Bachelor 21 - Nick Viall - F1-F3 - Discussion - *Sleuthing Spoilers*

^^ that does make me think raven is f2 and he's trying to be mindful of Vanessa's feelings.

coolangel wrote:

Cila51290 wrote:
Oh, I know I've seen the blogs and the 5 to watch about Raven. What I did mean is during post filming interviews. I don't recall Nick talking about Raven. If anyone does have any interviews he has spoken about Raven, I'd love to see to compare.

I had not noticed this before but now that I think about it, I can't recollect him talking about Raven in any interviews either. Good observation [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]!  

Here are his captions for the IG pics he posted after every 1-1 (except DLo):

Kristina: Cruising with this cutie
Rachel: All smiles all the time
Raven: Truthfully, we spent most of our date just eating the orange slices
Vanessa: Now that was a great date!
Danielle M: Great times with beautiful Danielle!

One of those captions is not like the others IMO. Very impersonal. JMO.

Would a F2 have such an impersonal tweet? Cutie, great date, beautiful Danielle and all smiles, compared to eating orange slices.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], ITA! Add this to Nick liking that IG pic a few days back of how DLo/Chase and Raven/Luke would be perfect couples. IMO it's also interesting coz Nick has been very vocal during podcasts that he is not a fan of Jojo's F6. Makes me go hmm.

Nick continues to praise Rachel in interviews. Raven doesn't get a mention usually and he likes a pic saying she would be a perfect couple with someone who he didn't have a favorable opinion of? Interesting indeed!

All JMO.

Did Raven initially sign up thinking Luke would be the Bachelor? Does anyone know?

Maybe Nick feels like she would've been better off with Luke

I feel the way they spin the F1 F2 and that the lead is so confused and conflicted and all that jazz I don't see that happening with Raven. I can see that with Rachel. That's another reason I feel Raven may be F3 and not F2.

The F3 IMO is the one who is friend zoned, good times, but no chemistry. CH mentioned the chemistry between Nick and Rachel was off the charts, paraphrasing, and at this point I see Raven and someone fun to be with but no real chemistry.

jessietrey wrote:I didn't think this was Vanessa before, I always thought it was Raven but now I do think that it's Vanessa. Because she has started wearing a winter jacket lately that looks exactly like this jacket.

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Bring this over from Vanessa's thread to compare the coat

Diana wrote:She really is so gorgeous!

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I don't think Nick would be praising his F2 this much! That'd just be mean to her and to his F1.
The thing I think nobody "gets" about Raven vs. Rachel is that the former is a safe bet. She's already said the L-word. Rachel, on the other hand, seems FAR more likely to reject Nick.
If this season's story is "Will Vanessa accept Nick?" he might need a "back-up".

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] so you think Rachel is f3 because the high praises he gave to her?

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I don't know! It's so hard to say because I think it'd be so rude for Nick to talk her up this much. Could you imagine how Lauren would have felt if Ben was singing JoJo's praises?
On the other hand, I see SO much more chemistry with Rachel than Raven.

Still, I think from the bracelet, Nick might have always known he wanted Vanessa and set Rachel up to be the next lead by giving her F3.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] but if our speculation is true, Nick and Vanessa were together two weeks ago, right before the airing of Rachel's date. My guess is he probably reassured and comforted her during that visit. Just my wishinful thinking.....

Here's what I think, assuming the spoilers are right and I think they are. I think Nick legitimately liked and respected Rachel as I've been saying from the beginning. I think he was and clearly still is, very impressed with the woman that she is and she certainly would made a great life partner.

However, in the end, his heart ultimately was with Vanessa. And when it got down to the end, he let Rachel go at F3 because in a sense she was more vulnerable because she'd been so wary and unsure about the process, her feelings and his feelings, etc. So he might have thought it would be more cruel to then take her to F2, only to dump her then when by that point he knew for certain that it was going to be Vanessa.

Because I can see Nick and Rachel having the type of relationship where she told him once he knew it wasn't her, to let her go. Basically what Nick said to Kaitlyn and so Nick being the kind of person we've seen, he did. I think although Raven was saying how in love she was, Nick who's been around this show enough times to know the different types of "love", probably knew that Raven's was more the "in the bubble" type of love and so ultimately she'd be fine when he let her go at F2. All my opinion of course.

Regarding all the praise and talk about Rachel, honestly, maybe I'm weird but I don't see it as a big deal. Again, I think Nick is being honest because I think he does admire and respect Rachel and think all those great things about her - doesn't mean he's in love with her. To me, unless Nick goes around in interviews saying how much he loved Rachel, how he couldn't imagine his life without her when they were together, etc. I don't give much thought to the positive things he's said about her. You can think a person is an amazing human being but it doesn't mean you're in love with them.

And at the end of the day we don't know the relationship Nick and Vanessa have and we haven't seen him say all the great things he loves about her because it's obvious to me that he's very careful when speaking about her as to not let anything accidentally slip (kind of like him referring to himself as single in the past tense in one interview). Bottom line I absolutely believe Nick still to this day likes and respects the woman Rachel is. But I don't think it has any bearings on his current relationship and his feelings for Vanessa.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] I agree. The praise Nick has been giving Rachel in interviews stems from respect and admiration. The same type of respect and admiration Rachel has been receiving since people learned she's an accomplished lawyer with a level-headed personality. You can talk highly of someone without having feelings or being in love with that person. The strongest relationships are when the people in them can acknowledge the merits of others without inciting jealousy or insecurity in their partners.

While I think there's something romantic, albeit archaic, about your partner constantly reassuring you, I think there's something more respectable about being comfortable enough in your own relationship that you don't care if your boyfriend is saying positive things about another woman. Especially if they sound like objective truths -- she is intelligent and beautiful. For the record, there's no proof that Vanessa, if she's indeed the F1, feels jealous or insecure because Nick speaks highly or Rachel. I'm not saying she is or isn't. But, tbh, I'm no fan of the speculation that she might be, and that Nick giving Rachel praise spells trouble for N&V's relationship.