Nick Viall - Bachelorette 11 - *Spoilers - Sleuthing* - Discussion #6

I'm a hopeless romantic too so I always can see Nick as the guy who has an open heart And falls to hard.

But IMO, the general public and the skeptics, they cannot believe this. They think the contestants know this is a stupid tv show, they can't fall for real, they can't be this heartbroken. So they tend to see Nick as a manipulator, a fame whore and whatever Nick is not.

This is why I'm always confused, people want to see genuine feeling, but when Nick shows it, he's a villian. He is different from most of the guys, because he truly was in love, unlike the others were there for the traveling, for anything else. I always think most of the guys, no matter at what point they were let go, have no real feeling for the lead so that's why they can just walk off and move on to other chics.

peggy0221 wrote:I'm a hopeless romantic too so I always can see Nick as the guy who has an open heart And falls to hard.

But IMO, the general public and the skeptics, they cannot believe this. They think the contestants know this is a stupid tv show, they can't fall for real, they can't be this heartbroken. So they tend to see Nick as a manipulator, a fame whore and whatever Nick is not.

This is why I'm always confused, people want to see genuine feeling, but when Nick shows it, he's a villian. He is different from most of the guys, because he truly was in love, unlike the others were there for the traveling, for anything else. I always think most of the guys, no matter at what point they were let go, have no real feeling for the lead so that's why they can just walk off and move on to other chics.

He is damned if he does damned if he doesn't. Only reason I think he moved on faster this time is because he got closure.

Going on a show after the lead is giving him lip signals on Jimmy Kimmel, let's him on the show half-way through, invites him back to her place for pre-FS, gives him a rose despite him saying he is scared to death and doesn't want to go through what he went through last year, and then reassures his family/mom, is all like "promise" you love me, then lets him propose and rejects him? Yeah, he got his closure alright. No wonder he doesn't want to be with Kaitlyn.

And for all the speculation that Nick was wanting Kaitlyn back? No way he would considering Us Weekly saying Nick was like "WTF" and didn't want to talk to Kaitlyn. It's easy to move on when someone rejects your proposal for someone else despite all the pre-SM flirting, on show, sex, proposal, whatever. IMO, Nick deserves waaaay better than someone like Kaitlyn and I think he knows it too and is grateful that he wasn't chosen by a girl who was telling some other guy that HE was the one (and then sleeping with Nick straight way). Because either way, sounds like K was talking out of both sides of her mouth just like CH.

peggy0221 wrote:I'm a hopeless romantic too so I always can see Nick as the guy who has an open heart And falls to hard.

But IMO, the general public and the skeptics, they cannot believe this. They think the contestants know this is a stupid tv show, they can't fall for real, they can't be this heartbroken. So they tend to see Nick as a manipulator, a fame whore and whatever Nick is not.

This is why I'm always confused, people want to see genuine feeling, but when Nick shows it, he's a villian. He is different from most of the guys, because he truly was in love, unlike the others were there for the traveling, for anything else. I always think most of the guys, no matter at what point they were let go, have no real feeling for the lead so that's why they can just walk off and move on to other chics.

See, I don't necessarily believe that. I think that there's two reasons why people don't believe Nick's heartbreak -

a) he's a man - How many months did DeAnna cry about being dumped by Brad? Just like Nick, she came back to the ATFR, months after the finale and berated him on not loving her and leading her on. Most people totally believed her heartbreak at the time, whereas Nick just seemed like a stalker to many.

b)he wasn't the perfect (totally unrealistic) image of heartbreak - For the most part, I think that when F2s appear on the ATFR, they are over it. They realize that it was never true love, they've privately talked to the lead if needed, and they are just at the ATFR to play a role. That's why they ask all these perfect questions that they probably don't care about, like "When did you know?" because they are safe questions and they are easily answered. Real heartbreak usually doesn't work like that - the questions are a lot more tough and the answers are a lot more complicated and messy. How many people believed Jason at his ATFR with Deanna? I know I did - then I listened to his podcast and he said that he was over it the day of the rejection and was partying it up with the crew THAT day. I think people just don't know how to react to real, messy, complicated heartbreak on reality TV, since it's just supposed to be a guilty pleasure and there are supposed to be 1-dimensional people who we can easily categorize as "villains" or "fan favorites".

chasingpavements wrote:Yup, I think that's why I'm such a Nick fan - I feel like someone has to defend him as he gets called a manipulative, sl*t-shaming, creepy, stalker loser...just because he fell in love and didn't immediately get over that girl, like everyone else does the second they leave filming. Doesn't that make him MORE sincere and genuine in his feelings?

I was listening to the Right Reasons podcast (which I usually find hilarious) and Juliet hates him SO much she said she had to stop watching when he started crying in front of his mom, because that disgusted her so much. Like...what?

It's like when people condemn cyber bulling , but when Nick posts supportive messages he is being called creepy stalker. When he is wrongly accused no one likes him, does he have the right to defend himself on his own sm? I've read posts here wondering if K told S he's the one why did she have sex with N two days later and possibly again but if Nick ever dares to ask her the question he's sl$t shaming her?

I am forever stuck in never f1 club

AllAboutLove wrote: (snipped)

Going on a show after the lead is giving him lip signals on Jimmy Kimmel, let's him on the show half-way through, invites him back to her place for pre-FS, gives him a rose despite him saying he is scared to death and doesn't want to go through what he went through last year, and then reassures his family/mom, is all like "promise" you love me, then lets him propose and rejects him? Yeah, he got his closure alright. No wonder he doesn't want to be with Kaitlyn.

And for all the speculation that Nick was wanting Kaitlyn back? No way he would considering Us Weekly saying Nick was like "WTF" and didn't want to talk to Kaitlyn. It's easy to move on when someone rejects your proposal for someone else despite all the pre-SM flirting, on show, sex, proposal, whatever. IMO, Nick deserves waaaay better than someone like Kaitlyn and I think he knows it too and is grateful that he wasn't chosen by a girl who was telling some other guy that HE was the one (and then sleeping with Nick straight way). Because either way, sounds like K was talking out of both sides of her mouth just like CH.

Yes, Yes and Yes, AAL. :Nod:

I will continue to stand by Nick. I agree with CH. IMO, he hasn't really done anything wrong. I think he is an acquired taste. I absolutely think he is misunderstood. Maybe people don't like sweet, smart, generally nice guys unless they are the cookie cutter alpha male? I also think his hatred is exaggerated as I have said many times. People tend to follow the masses. In many cases, what is popular isn't always right. I think at this point, people are going to hate just because that is where the majority stands.

sdmom wrote:

chasingpavements wrote:Yup, I think that's why I'm such a Nick fan - I feel like someone has to defend him as he gets called a manipulative, sl*t-shaming, creepy, stalker loser...just because he fell in love and didn't immediately get over that girl, like everyone else does the second they leave filming. Doesn't that make him MORE sincere and genuine in his feelings?

I was listening to the Right Reasons podcast (which I usually find hilarious) and Juliet hates him SO much she said she had to stop watching when he started crying in front of his mom, because that disgusted her so much. Like...what?

It's like when people condemn cyber bulling , but when Nick posts supportive messages he is being called  creepy stalker. When he is wrongly accused no one likes him, does he have the right to defend himself on his own sm? I've read posts here wondering if K told S he's the one why did she have sex with N two days later and possibly again but if Nick ever dares to ask her the question he's sl$t shaming her?

I am forever stuck in never f1 club

I was stuck in the f3 club for years.  I always knew in the beginning of a season that if I had a preference for any particular cast member, he or she would be f3. I feel your pain.

I seriously cannot understand all hatred and venom that is thrown Nicks way.  If the Bachelor franchise is committed to their "anti bullying" campaign they better include Nick in their PSA.

I am so over hearing the poor Andi routine.  Andi vilified JPG after her ego was bruised by him rejecting her after the FS and then continually mocked him for being Latino ie having an accent and saying "eeeeesssss okay." Andi was cold hearted to Nick after she rejected him and yet Nick is the villain?

Kaitlyn totally lead on and appears to have had sex with him numerous times times, asks him to promise to love her forever, reassures his family, lets him get down on one knee and propose and then rejects him. Yet again Nick is the Villain?

Please all you anti Nick people.......educate me!!  I cannot understand the disdain.

Bet2Win wrote:

sdmom wrote:

chasingpavements wrote:Yup, I think that's why I'm such a Nick fan - I feel like someone has to defend him as he gets called a manipulative, sl*t-shaming, creepy, stalker loser...just because he fell in love and didn't immediately get over that girl, like everyone else does the second they leave filming. Doesn't that make him MORE sincere and genuine in his feelings?

I was listening to the Right Reasons podcast (which I usually find hilarious) and Juliet hates him SO much she said she had to stop watching when he started crying in front of his mom, because that disgusted her so much. Like...what?

It's like when people condemn cyber bulling , but when Nick posts supportive messages he is being called  creepy stalker. When he is wrongly accused no one likes him, does he have the right to defend himself on his own sm? I've read posts here wondering if K told S he's the one why did she have sex with N two days later and possibly again but if Nick ever dares to ask her the question he's sl$t shaming her?

I am forever stuck in never f1 club

I was stuck in the f3 club for years.  I always knew in the beginning of a season that if I had a preference for any particular cast member, he or she would be f3. I feel your pain.

Yup, the only F1 I ever rooted for and loved was Roberto. Other than that, my favorites have always been F2/F3 (Arie, Reid, Jillian, NICK). I have missed a bunch of seasons in between, but I still can't believe it's been 5 years since I was giddy about the final couple.

chasingpavements wrote:Yup, I think that's why I'm such a Nick fan - I feel like someone has to defend him as he gets called a manipulative, sl*t-shaming, creepy, stalker loser...just because he fell in love and didn't immediately get over that girl, like everyone else does the second they leave filming. Doesn't that make him MORE sincere and genuine in his feelings?

I was listening to the Right Reasons podcast (which I usually find hilarious) and Juliet hates him SO much she said she had to stop watching when he started crying in front of his mom, because that disgusted her so much. Like...what?

Same here. I just can't deal with all the hate towards someone who's really done nothing wrong IMO.

I was just watching AfterBuzz earlier and Cathy Kelley was also defending Shawn's actions, because she feels the same way about Nick so his feelings must be valid or whatever. I just don't get it. How can he inspire such disgust in people? You'd think he'd ran over a litter of puppies or something. I guess he has some mannerisms that come off as insincere to some, but you'd think people would've seen his genuine heartbreak last season and realized he really was sincere. But I guess that was all an act too, since he's a professional acto... I mean software salesman. At least Danny and Brooks were defending him.

Another funny thing to me is that Reid basically did the same thing with Jillian at aftr, but I don't remember there being this long-term backlash against him for it. I wasn't an avid follower then so scmiiw.

BKay wrote:Another funny thing to me is that Reid basically did the same thing with Jillian at aftr, but I don't remember there being this long-term backlash against him for it. I wasn't an avid follower then so scmiiw.

The difference is that Jill was gracious and didn't deny her feelings or try to minimize Reid's.
She acknowledged that she loved him, just not as much as Ed. She cried about it on ATFR.
(And she let him go at F3 b/c he wasn't willing or ready to verbalize his feelings).
We haven't seen the likes of her since.