Andi Dorfman - The Bachelorette 10 - Discussion - #2

Laudergirl wrote:

mindless wrote:

mag pie wrote:Imo, a real job would go a long way to giving her life clarity & direction. :Nod:

What I found laughable is the notion that you can love each other deeply, yet be unable to make it work. That is just BS IMO. Only thing that could come between true love is, IMO, distance, and even that usually takes years to accept if there's real love involved, because it's just too painful to give up. I've been in a long distance relationship for years and we've gone as long as 6 months without seeing each other in person, yet we've never even considered breaking up. We have been through all kinds of life changes, illness and so on, but it's always been clear as day that we're a unit and there's no one else we can see ourselves with than each other. Doesn't mean it's all puppies and rainbows and that we never annoy each other, but that doesn't affect the love. Andi and Josh, on the other hand, had everything in their favour, even location unlike other couples from this franchise, yet things blew up after a few short months. That's true love? What a JOKE. I also find it hard to imagine one would have sex with someone else after meeting and developing a relationship with one's soulmate, no matter how horny one might be, but to each their own I guess.

I think there are other things that can come between true love, and one of those is family (think the Notebook). I'm not saying that was the case in this situation, but I think it's very possible that it caused strain and possibly to Andi's feelings of not being supported.  When you then factor in two strong, stubborn personalities and their relative inexperience in committed relationships and the compromises it takes to make them work,  that can tear you apart.  Theirs was still a relatively young love, and hadn't had time to develop into the deeper loves that you see with longer relationships or marriage. But I don't think that it takes away from it still being a genuine, true love.

I got the sense from the interview that there are still a lot of unresolved feelings between these two and that there was likely more to the story than just the personality conflicts. Maybe if given more time and possibly a little counseling it could have made a difference.

On a side note, Andi (and Josh) are receiving so many tweets and IG comments from fans wishing they would work things out and get back together. Does anyone here on the forum know if that has happened before, and to this degree? I know SM is far more common now, but I just don't remember this with any of the other franchise couples that broke up.

Good post Laudergirl!

Laudergirl wrote:

mindless wrote:

mag pie wrote:Imo, a real job would go a long way to giving her life clarity & direction. :Nod:

What I found laughable is the notion that you can love each other deeply, yet be unable to make it work. That is just BS IMO. Only thing that could come between true love is, IMO, distance, and even that usually takes years to accept if there's real love involved, because it's just too painful to give up. I've been in a long distance relationship for years and we've gone as long as 6 months without seeing each other in person, yet we've never even considered breaking up. We have been through all kinds of life changes, illness and so on, but it's always been clear as day that we're a unit and there's no one else we can see ourselves with than each other. Doesn't mean it's all puppies and rainbows and that we never annoy each other, but that doesn't affect the love. Andi and Josh, on the other hand, had everything in their favour, even location unlike other couples from this franchise, yet things blew up after a few short months. That's true love? What a JOKE. I also find it hard to imagine one would have sex with someone else after meeting and developing a relationship with one's soulmate, no matter how horny one might be, but to each their own I guess.

I think there are other things that can come between true love, and one of those is family (think the Notebook). I'm not saying that was the case in this situation, but I think it's very possible that it caused strain and possibly to Andi's feelings of not being supported.  When you then factor in two strong, stubborn personalities and their relative inexperience in committed relationships and the compromises it takes to make them work,  that can tear you apart.  Theirs was still a relatively young love, and hadn't had time to develop into the deeper loves that you see with longer relationships or marriage. But I don't think that it takes away from it still being a genuine, true love.

I don't know, I guess we just have a different opinion on what love is. I think if two people truly love each other then they will do whatever it takes. True love isn't about having fun and kissing and making other people jealous by being all over each other at all times. It's about sticking by each other through thick and thin, loving the other person even when they annoy the heck out of you, putting them before yourself (within reason ofc) and making compromises. You can't just love the good parts of a person and the good moments you share. Well you can, but that's a superficial, selfish kind of love. Who knows, maybe Andi really did love Josh, but in that case, I don't think he really loved her. I just can't see two people who love each other deeply throwing away an engagement after mere 8 months. In that case the love was lacking on at least one end if not both. JMO. All long relationships went through that early period of young love, but just as many young loves died, because they were more about lust and infatuation, illusion and assumptions. Andi and Josh's relationship died in the early stages, so doesn't that just prove that it didn't have what it takes? If deep love takes time to develop and they didn't even give it the time then how could it have been true love and what proof is there that they had the makings of long-lasting love? Some words in interviews and carefully chosen pics in social media? I don't think those carry much weight.

I have seen plenty of couples who genuinely love each other not work out. It can be for various reasons. For some people certain hurdles are more difficult to jump over than they would be for others. It doesn't necessarily mean a couple loves each other less than another couple that was able to jump over the hurdles.  

For example, if Josh happened to ask Andi to get a job because he wanted to plan for their future and him just working wasn't going to cut it and she said no because she wasn't ready for a legitimate job yet and wanted more time off to discover what career path she really wanted, then that would be a hurdle. It doesn't have to mean they didn't love each other. You can love someone and want to plan for the future and you can also love someone but be confused about your career path and not being ready to jump into a job. You can love someone but want two different things. This is all hypothetical of course and just an example, but considering most people were in other relationships before they found the one or got married and you loved that person, but ended up breaking up for various reasons, well I don't find that as being any different than the position Andi and Josh are in now.

You can very easily genuinely love and care for someone, try to make it work because you wanted it to, and then realized you want two different paths or you feel that in the end, you're not a perfect match. There's nothing wrong with that and I don't think it means that the feelings were never genuine. We've all been there I would think.

I think Andi and Josh were in love, but didn't work because of incompatibility. If there wasn't love, they wouldn't have lasted as long as they did, especially living together.

Sad, but not surprised to hear that Andi is being attached on SM ... lots of lunatics out there.

Why are people acting like 8 months is that long? They were only together for 8 months and 6 months after the show aired.

They broke up 5 months post finale. But 8 months since the proposal.

bleuberry wrote:They broke up 5 months post finale. But 8 months since the proposal.

That wasn't much of a honeymoon phase.  Didn't Big Ben and Bug Robertson last longer?

Thanx^^ I still feel it really isn't that long. People have been together with people they don't love way longer then 8 months, the time frame doesn't prove they were in love. I know people still saying living together means they were together meant they were together a lot more than other couples in the franchise. I think that should have been an advantage instead of a disadvantage. 8 months its still 8 months weather you live together or not.

I dont know if it is appropriate to bring it here but I read Sean book a couple weeks ago and he mentions the was a time when he Cat didn't make it because Cat hardly saw Sean during the DWTS and was fed up. They had more pressure then two people that saw one another all the time and could do whatever they wanted, whenever they wanted while they couldn't do the same. They easily could have called it quits but they fought for their love.

Every couple except for maybe Jake and Vienna LOL has its own deeply invested circle of fans who can't let go of the projected fantasy of love. There I said it.

There were still diehard "Tessa's Hammock" members tweeting poor Andy Baldwin in secret codes or openly about getting back together with Tessa right up to the day five or six years post Finale when she married someone else.

To me, this inability to let go of a TV Couple says nothing about the couple, and more about the experience those audience members had personally with projecting personal feelings onto a couple they don't know.

It's so funny. Can you imagine becoming equally invested in a couple you knew in your Real / Actual Life? Prodding them to stay in touch, diagramming their areas of compatibility or whether they were fated to stay together? It's one of the MOST curious things about this franchise, or internet "SHIPPING" in general to me.

I didn't say they never loved each other at all. I'm sure they at least thought they did, but there are different kinds of love and true love is when you love the other person for who they really are, with their faults and all. By the time they were "madly in love" and Andi "knew he was the one", they didn't even know each other yet. It takes time to really get to know someone, years even, and it seems as though they started having problems as soon as the rose-coloured glasses started coming off. 8 months is nothing really.

I have to quote Mia on this, because this is my idea of true love as well:

MiaHawk wrote:One day Andi will look back and realize that this wasn't true love either. She was simply in lust with a guy she liked because of his perceived stature in the community, his perceived future earnings potential, and his athletic looks and jovial personality.  She enjoyed her time in the limelight which was based on her being part of this couple.  She was happy for him in her life, because with Josh came these perks.  She liked him and cared for him, but I stand firmly in my belief that she did not have true love with him because:

The "love" between Josh and Andi failed on nearly all of those accounts. The examples presented of things possibly tearing them (or couples in general) apart also wouldn't be issues if the love had been as described in that bible quote (I'm not religious at all, but love that quote, because I think it's so true). Their love clearly wasn't patient (if job situations or when to start a family were issues), it envied (why haven't we started wedding planning like everyone else?), it boasted (all their interviews and social media), it was selfish and easily angered (neither was willing to back down or supported each other), it delighted in evil (calling others not good people, holding grudges), it didn't trust, it didn't hope, it didn't persevere. It wasn't that special. IMO.

Thanx for bringing that Mindless. Mia certainly has a way with words and truly well said.

Love, relationship, marriage, take a lot of work and commitment on both sides. There will be ups and downs, but how those are handled determines success and failure. Probably, some people do not know that and thus, bail out.