Couples Therapy - Season 5 - Premier Sept 10 2014 - General Discussion

grace8136 wrote:

stuckinsc wrote:I am again a minority.  JPG has not said he loves Nikki but he shows her.  He has done many sweet things and I think for him the willingness to move away from Camila is a big deal.  You all see it as phony, but to me that is sincere.  
*snipped*

I don't see it as love or sincerity. It's selfish and irresponsible on both their parts. It's a big deal for sure... in that it makes him a terrible parent. Would you feel differently if it was Carla moving away from Camila? Why is it ok for fathers, but not for mothers? It's not. He doesn't have that option and it shouldn't even be on the table. I'm not even going to add an "imo" to that. You don't move away from your child to pacify your girlfriend or look for fame. He can move from the condo arrangement to something with appropriate boundaries. If Nikki thinks he can't be trusted or is insecure around Carla, she needs to deal with that issue, not run away from it at Camila's expense.

You can say all you want about Juan but the one thing you can not say is he is not a great father. He is a great father and always puts Camilia first.

I almost want to cry for Nikki after watching this ^^^. It isn't a word issue - it's a control issue. If you feel love for someone, you don't withhold saying so, especially if you know how much it would mean to them.

Has Juan Pablo ever said if he was in love with Carla? Did he tell her he loved her? I wonder if Nikki knows. There's a lot of baggage and expectations that go along with those words.

grace8136 wrote:

stuckinsc wrote:I am again a minority.  JPG has not said he loves Nikki but he shows her.  He has done many sweet things and I think for him the willingness to move away from Camila is a big deal.  You all see it as phony, but to me that is sincere.  
*snipped*

I don't see it as love or sincerity. It's selfish and irresponsible on both their parts. It's a big deal for sure... in that it makes him a terrible parent. Would you feel differently if it was Carla moving away from Camila? Why is it ok for fathers, but not for mothers? It's not. He doesn't have that option and it shouldn't even be on the table. I'm not even going to add an "imo" to that. You don't move away from your child to pacify your girlfriend or look for fame. He can move from the condo arrangement to something with appropriate boundaries. If Nikki thinks he can't be trusted or is insecure around Carla, she needs to deal with that issue, not run away from it at Camila's expense.

Let me state. I am disappointed in both JPG and Nikki that they are thinking of leaving Miami. I believe with his work travel schedule to not live in Miami with her is a bad idea. I agree with JPG that it may not affect her now, as she has a large extended family to fill the void, but may bother her later in life. If you look at my old posts in this thread and the Nikki and JPG fan thread, I am very much not in support of JPG leaving Miami.

My point is that it means something that he is willing to move away from Camila and that Nikki should be giving him some credit for that.

whit90 wrote:

grace8136 wrote:

stuckinsc wrote:I am again a minority.  JPG has not said he loves Nikki but he shows her.  He has done many sweet things and I think for him the willingness to move away from Camila is a big deal.  You all see it as phony, but to me that is sincere.  
*snipped*

I don't see it as love or sincerity. It's selfish and irresponsible on both their parts. It's a big deal for sure... in that it makes him a terrible parent. Would you feel differently if it was Carla moving away from Camila? Why is it ok for fathers, but not for mothers? It's not. He doesn't have that option and it shouldn't even be on the table. I'm not even going to add an "imo" to that. You don't move away from your child to pacify your girlfriend or look for fame. He can move from the condo arrangement to something with appropriate boundaries. If Nikki thinks he can't be trusted or is insecure around Carla, she needs to deal with that issue, not run away from it at Camila's expense.

You can say all you want about Juan but the one thing you can not say is he is not a great father. He is a great father and always puts Camilia first.

Whit, in general I agree with you. But I do think moving to LA is not good for Camila in the long term. She would in all likelihood stay in Miami with her mother and extended family and I think it is selfish of them to do this. His career can do as much in Miami as LA, being he is most comfortable in Spanish speaking entertainment anyway. Now if Carla also wants to move to LA to pursue opportunities, then that is a different story.

metalgirl wrote:Has Juan Pablo ever said if he was in love with Carla?  Did he tell her he loved her? I wonder if Nikki knows.  There's a lot of baggage and expectations that go along with those words.  

I believe that Carla got pregnant rather quickly in their dating lives. They attempted to make a go of it, but were actually broken up before Camila was born. I am sure he has said he loves her as the mother of his child, but I doubt that he ever said te amo to Carla.

I know I am in the minority again, but you shouldn't say ILY to someone until you are ready. When you have to push as hard for it as Nikki is then I don't think that is a good idea. I also kind of understand JPG wanting them to be together more before he states it.

I had no problem with Josh only wanting to say ILY to one more woman, the one he will marry. I think JPG feels the same way. Everybody comes to emotions in their own time. If he isn't there or needs more time with her that is okay, but if she is bothered by it, then she should break up with him. He is comfortable with where they are. If Nikki is not then she needs to take action. I do feel bad for Nikki, but I don't think forcing someone to say ILY is any better than not hearing it. If he says it before he means it and she moves to LA and they break up a month or two later because it wasn't real is that really better?

One of my favorite songs ever is by George Strait and it is called "You Can't Make a Heart Love Somebody". Sorry, but I don't vilify JPG for not saying ILY until he is ready. Again, this is something I think this show throws around too casually. Honestly, do you think that Drew or Zak W were really in love with Des or that Cody, Marcus or Chris, two of whom are in relationships now and one who is now that bachelor were ever really in love with Andi? I think they were in deep like and lust, but love, sorry to me this franchise throws that word around very easily and almost pressures contestants to say it. Much like the engagement, if you have spent less than 48 total hours with someone can you really know you love them and want to marry them? It is ridiculous.

whit90 wrote:

grace8136 wrote:

stuckinsc wrote:I am again a minority.  JPG has not said he loves Nikki but he shows her.  He has done many sweet things and I think for him the willingness to move away from Camila is a big deal.  You all see it as phony, but to me that is sincere.  
*snipped*

I don't see it as love or sincerity. It's selfish and irresponsible on both their parts. It's a big deal for sure... in that it makes him a terrible parent. Would you feel differently if it was Carla moving away from Camila? Why is it ok for fathers, but not for mothers? It's not. He doesn't have that option and it shouldn't even be on the table. I'm not even going to add an "imo" to that. You don't move away from your child to pacify your girlfriend or look for fame. He can move from the condo arrangement to something with appropriate boundaries. If Nikki thinks he can't be trusted or is insecure around Carla, she needs to deal with that issue, not run away from it at Camila's expense.

You can say all you want about Juan but the one thing you can not say is he is not a great father. He is a great father and always puts Camilia first.

Would you have left your daughter when she was 5 to move with a boyfriend across the country? He flat out said he was choosing Nikki over Camilia!  :shocked!:

stuckinsc wrote:

metalgirl wrote:Has Juan Pablo ever said if he was in love with Carla?  Did he tell her he loved her? I wonder if Nikki knows.  There's a lot of baggage and expectations that go along with those words.  

I believe that Carla got pregnant rather quickly in their dating lives.  They attempted to make a go of it, but were actually broken up before Camila was born.  I am sure he has said he loves her as the mother of his child, but I doubt that he ever said te amo to Carla.

I know I am in the minority again, but you shouldn't say ILY to someone until you are ready.  When you have to push as hard for it as Nikki is then I don't think that is a good idea.  I also kind of understand JPG wanting them to be together more before he states it.  

I had no problem with Josh only wanting to say ILY to one more woman, the one he will marry.  I think JPG feels the same way.  Everybody comes to emotions in their own time.  If he isn't there or needs more time with her that is okay, but if she is bothered by it, then she should break up with him.  He is comfortable with where they are.  If Nikki is not then she needs to take action. I do feel bad for Nikki, but I don't think forcing someone to say ILY is any better than not hearing it.  If he says it before he means it and she moves to LA and they break up a month or two later because it wasn't real is that really better?

*snipped*

This is what I keep thinking. It's his prerogative not to say it and it's hers to leave. The eventual ILY is becoming more meaningless by the day with all this coercion.

^Yes. I would feel like a total fool begging for an ILY from someone.

stuckinsc wrote:I believe that Carla got pregnant rather quickly in their dating lives.  They attempted to make a go of it, but were actually broken up before Camila was born.  I am sure he has said he loves her as the mother of his child, but I doubt that he ever said te amo to Carla.

What makes you think that? I got the impression that they were very happy during the pregnancy, from this vid at least: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZ0alxEFRa4 Actually from what I read and saw during his season, I figured he was in love with her, but she got sick of him not having a proper job at the time. As we've seen on CP as well, his attitude seems to be "we'll figure it out as we go". I really wouldn't be surprised if Carla was also bothered by his lack of plans. She started dating a soccer player and got a stay-at-home dad with no plans for the future. I think deep down he may still be hoping that his newfound fame will make her take him back and then they can be a perfect little family. That's why he can't give his all to this relationship with Nikki.

grace8136 wrote:

whit90 wrote:

grace8136 wrote:
I don't see it as love or sincerity. It's selfish and irresponsible on both their parts. It's a big deal for sure... in that it makes him a terrible parent. Would you feel differently if it was Carla moving away from Camila? Why is it ok for fathers, but not for mothers? It's not. He doesn't have that option and it shouldn't even be on the table. I'm not even going to add an "imo" to that. You don't move away from your child to pacify your girlfriend or look for fame. He can move from the condo arrangement to something with appropriate boundaries. If Nikki thinks he can't be trusted or is insecure around Carla, she needs to deal with that issue, not run away from it at Camila's expense.

You can say all you want about Juan but the one thing you can not say is he is not a great father. He is a great father and always puts Camilia first.

Would you have left your daughter when she was 5 to move with a boyfriend across the country? He flat out said he was choosing Nikki over Camilia!  :shocked!:

stuckinsc wrote:

metalgirl wrote:Has Juan Pablo ever said if he was in love with Carla?  Did he tell her he loved her? I wonder if Nikki knows.  There's a lot of baggage and expectations that go along with those words.  

I believe that Carla got pregnant rather quickly in their dating lives.  They attempted to make a go of it, but were actually broken up before Camila was born.  I am sure he has said he loves her as the mother of his child, but I doubt that he ever said te amo to Carla.

I know I am in the minority again, but you shouldn't say ILY to someone until you are ready.  When you have to push as hard for it as Nikki is then I don't think that is a good idea.  I also kind of understand JPG wanting them to be together more before he states it.  

I had no problem with Josh only wanting to say ILY to one more woman, the one he will marry.  I think JPG feels the same way.  Everybody comes to emotions in their own time.  If he isn't there or needs more time with her that is okay, but if she is bothered by it, then she should break up with him.  He is comfortable with where they are.  If Nikki is not then she needs to take action. I do feel bad for Nikki, but I don't think forcing someone to say ILY is any better than not hearing it.  If he says it before he means it and she moves to LA and they break up a month or two later because it wasn't real is that really better?

*snipped*

This is what I keep thinking. It's his prerogative not to say it and it's hers to leave. The eventual ILY is becoming more meaningless by the day with all this coercion.

I agree with you Grace. Even with ILY I think it's too little too late.

eirekay wrote:I almost want to cry for Nikki after watching this ^^^.   It isn't a word issue - it's a control issue.  If you feel love for someone, you don't withhold saying so, especially if you know how much it would mean to them.

To be perfectly honest...
To be perfectly honest...

Nikki needs a new "start out" phrase here since the more times these reality TV stars say this or "honestly", the less honest they appear. Then again, she DOES say this repeatedly while Juan does NOT.

She also has that wonderful Freudian slip of "I just need to see if this (i.e. a relationship with Juan) is right for MEEEEEEE."

Yeah, it is hard to send him back to the store without a receipt. Hopefully he is the right "size".

I completely lost it when they were asked "why are you here?" (on this show), then told to "sit by your partner", and Juan sports the cheeeeeeziest grin possible for the cameras. The editors gleefully inserted that shot of him at the right moment to get laughs on cue. (Well... to get ME to laugh anyway.)  He looks like the eager student trying to "kiss butt" with the teacher. Obviously Nikki has to be careful how she handles his huge ego, which makes the Goodyear blimp look like a shriveled cucumber by comparison. Nikki's scorpion stinger keeps poking and poking and poking at all of that helium...

Not sure if the editors are getting carried away here or not (like that sadistic band of sickos who work on Fleiss' Bachelor/ette franchise), but the "in the moment" body language is hilarious. The moment the great Don Juan speaks (all stiff and poised), she starts fussing around in different directions.

Dick with the "evel" look: "Give them the Lie Detector."

Dr. Jenn looks even more "evel" examining them.

mindless wrote:^Yes. I would feel like a total fool begging for an ILY from someone.

stuckinsc wrote:I believe that Carla got pregnant rather quickly in their dating lives.  They attempted to make a go of it, but were actually broken up before Camila was born.  I am sure he has said he loves her as the mother of his child, but I doubt that he ever said te amo to Carla.

What makes you think that? I got the impression that they were very happy during the pregnancy, from this vid at least: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZ0alxEFRa4 Actually from what I read and saw during his season, I figured he was in love with her, but she got sick of him not having a proper job at the time. As we've seen on CP as well, his attitude seems to be "we'll figure it out as we go". I really wouldn't be surprised if Carla was also bothered by his lack of plans. She started dating a soccer player and got a stay-at-home dad with no plans for the future. I think deep down he may still be hoping that his newfound fame will make her take him back and then they can be a perfect little family. That's why he can't give his all to this relationship with Nikki.

I am not sure. I read it in an article, but don't know where. I don't think he and Carla are more than friends. But, I have no proof.