Episode 7 -- Miami -- airs Feb 17

docnash14 wrote:

stuckinsc wrote:

lcwilli3 wrote:In the previews for next week, Clare's conversation with her mother is very telling. It seems Clare is used to crying, pouting and throwing a fit when she doesn't get what she wants. And her mother recognizes that Clare is being manipulative.

It's just baffling to me that Clare is a 32-year-old woman. She acts much younger.

Look up narcissism.  It is very much Clare.  To me almost to a shocking degree and having that in your family is incredibly hard to deal with.  I still go to therapy on and off to deal with my mother who is much like Clare.

While I don't think it's my place to diagnose Clare, what i will say as someone who is a psychologist in private practice for many, many years and who teaches psychopathology to psychology graduate students, someone with narcissistic personality disorder has deep emotional wounds.  Further, unlike the common myth that the narcissist is someone in love with self, s/he has deep, underlying feelings of inadequacy/toxic shame.  The person with narcissistic personality disorder is very susceptible to narcissistic injury (which can be a result of something as simple as a real or perceived slight) which may lead him/her to act out (e.g. temper tantrums) or experience depression.

Thank you doc. What I have seen with my mom is actually that she needs to try to buy love. For us it was first in taking care of my bipolar sister, to a point that I think it actually made my sister worse. It continued in blowing through her total retirement account in two and half years so that others would love her and talk to her. It next became being the care giver to my father after he had a very bad care accident and was permanently handicapped. My mother needs to feel loved, but every situation still comes back to how it effects her. I love my mom and I continue to try to get her to get help as well, but growing up that way has been hard. I know that I myself actually have to learn to say no, so that I don't make myself sick trying to help others. My therapist now tells me it is asking myself if things are good for me, but also to trust someone enough to try to let them help me, as I always feel the responsibility to help others.

I am sorry if I trivialized Clare. I didn't mean to, I actually think viewing her in this way give me some insight into her actions.

Jeepers wrote:

Aunties_Love wrote:

Jeepers wrote:

USAGold wrote:

Jeepers wrote:The icing on the cake tonight was Clare's comments at the RC .. On the bitchy scale she hit the bell.  DONG!!

She wasn't the only one Nikki did too which is what the show wants us to see conflict drama etc....

nikki didn't saw one word at the RC!!  Clare's comment about JP making a mistake was totally inappropriate .. A major jab

In her itm's Nikki also took some major jabs at Clare.  Let's just say we aren't going to agree on this, but let's also say that Nikki is the "Bitchy" one of the group, and Clare can come out as being over the top sometimes but definately NOT cray cray.

My comment was ONLY and SPECIFIALLY regarding Clare's comment about JP making a mistake at the rose ceremony .. Uncalled for and rude and inappropriate .. A real bitch

They are both bitchy....no doubt with lots of prodding and encouragement from producers for those wonderfully self centered comments. The whole episode was chopped up and clearly edited to death and does neither of them any favours. I'll call it a draw.

pbmax wrote:stuckinsc, I agree with you. I don't care for Renee. She was just as bad as Clare and Chelsea.

They certainly showed their true colors tonight. Clare has been showing hers for weeks now. The sad thing is, I actually use to think she was alright. I found their behavior tonight to be very childish, and rude. Nicki was rude as well, but out of all of them she bothered me the least. Nicki walked away rather than getting into it all about Andi getting the rose that Clare thought for sure she was getting. Clare is all about Clare. Nicki was not going to sit there and take what Clare was saying to her, and why should she? Clare was the one who went up into the room Nicki sleeps in to confront her about why she left. She had nothing nice to say about Nicki from the minute she walked into the room after being sent back with the other girls. Not cool at all in my book.

I think Sharleen did the right thing even though she seemed genuinely torn. I really liked how JP handled it. He got a lot of my respect tonight. He's very empathetic when dealing with emotions. I can see him being a good dad.  

I really liked Nikki's date. There were some awkward moments but mostly the family visit went well. I do see something between JP & Nikki that I don't see with the others. She tweeted that her outfit was inappropriate for baseball and that goodness for double stick tape.   

I loved Andi getting the GDR. It must have killed her to be emotional on camera (or watching it). I thought the outtake was funny. She's almost like Elaine on Seinfeld dancing. Yikes.

The conflict between Clare & Nikki so just dumb. I completely understand why Nikki walked away because Clare was starting to talk about Andi. Why Clare followed is beyond me. Nikki has her snarky moments but that was just bizarre and uncomfortable.  Even worse was the cocktail party. I'm shocked they didn't pipe in crickets when it was just Nikki & Clare.  

I was disappointed in Renee siding with Clare & Chelsea. Maybe she's not as nice as I thought.

IA that Nikki shouldn't have called Clare's family crazy. She should have known they'd use it although doubt she thought about that. Nikki is far from perfect. This situation doesn't appear to bring out her best. I do think I'd have been friends with her & Andi if I were there. I like snark.   :Nod:

albean99 wrote:I think Sharleen did the right thing even though she seemed genuinely torn. I really liked how JP handled it. He got a lot of my respect tonight. He's very empathetic when dealing with emotions. I can see him being a good dad.  

I really liked Nikki's date. There were some awkward moments but mostly the family visit went well. I do see something between JP & Nikki that I don't see with the others. She tweeted that her outfit was inappropriate for baseball and that goodness for double stick tape.   

I loved Andi getting the GDR. It must have killed her to be emotional on camera (or watching it). I thought the outtake was funny. She's almost like Elaine on Seinfeld dancing. Yikes.

The conflict between Clare & Nikki so just dumb. I completely understand why Nikki walked away because Clare was starting to talk about Andi. Why Clare followed is beyond me. Nikki has her snarky moments but that was just bizarre and uncomfortable.  Even worse was the cocktail party. I'm shocked they didn't pipe in crickets when it was just Nikki & Clare.  

I was disappointed in Renee siding with Clare & Chelsea. Maybe she's not as nice as I thought.

IA that Nikki shouldn't have called Clare's family crazy. She should have known they'd use it although doubt she thought about that. Nikki is far from perfect. This situation doesn't appear to bring out her best. I do think I'd have been friends with her & Andi if I were there. I like snark.   :Nod:

I don't agree with the bolded. The thing is, she's probably seen a lot more of the bad side of Nikki than you or me and that is why she feels the way she does. I don't think that Nikki is all that innocent and nice and tonight showed some of it.

Aunties_Love wrote:

albean99 wrote:I think Sharleen did the right thing even though she seemed genuinely torn. I really liked how JP handled it. He got a lot of my respect tonight. He's very empathetic when dealing with emotions. I can see him being a good dad.  

I really liked Nikki's date. There were some awkward moments but mostly the family visit went well. I do see something between JP & Nikki that I don't see with the others. She tweeted that her outfit was inappropriate for baseball and thank goodness for double stick tape.   

I loved Andi getting the GDR. It must have killed her to be emotional on camera (or watching it). I thought the outtake was funny. She's almost like Elaine on Seinfeld dancing. Yikes.

The conflict between Clare & Nikki so just dumb. I completely understand why Nikki walked away because Clare was starting to talk about Andi. Why Clare followed is beyond me. Nikki has her snarky moments but that was just bizarre and uncomfortable.  Even worse was the cocktail party. I'm shocked they didn't pipe in crickets when it was just Nikki & Clare.  

I was disappointed in Renee siding with Clare & Chelsea. Maybe she's not as nice as I thought.

IA that Nikki shouldn't have called Clare's family crazy. She should have known they'd use it although doubt she thought about that. Nikki is far from perfect. This situation doesn't appear to bring out her best. I do think I'd have been friends with her & Andi if I were there. I like snark.   :Nod:

I don't agree with the bolded.  The thing is, she's probably seen a lot more of the bad side of Nikki than you or me and that is why she feels the way she does.  I don't think that Nikki is all that innocent and nice and tonight showed some of it.

That's fine, it's your opinion. I happen to disagree. I put more store in the opinion of Kelly, Sharleen, & Andi who I like.

albean99 wrote:I think Sharleen did the right thing even though she seemed genuinely torn. I really liked how JP handled it. He got a lot of my respect tonight. He's very empathetic when dealing with emotions. I can see him being a good dad.  

I really liked Nikki's date. There were some awkward moments but mostly the family visit went well. I do see something between JP & Nikki that I don't see with the others. She tweeted that her outfit was inappropriate for baseball and that goodness for double stick tape.   

I loved Andi getting the GDR. It must have killed her to be emotional on camera (or watching it). I thought the outtake was funny. She's almost like Elaine on Seinfeld dancing. Yikes.

The conflict between Clare & Nikki so just dumb. I completely understand why Nikki walked away because Clare was starting to talk about Andi. Why Clare followed is beyond me. Nikki has her snarky moments but that was just bizarre and uncomfortable.  Even worse was the cocktail party. I'm shocked they didn't pipe in crickets when it was just Nikki & Clare.  

I was disappointed in Renee siding with Clare & Chelsea. Maybe she's not as nice as I thought.

IA that Nikki shouldn't have called Clare's family crazy. She should have known they'd use it although doubt she thought about that. Nikki is far from perfect. This situation doesn't appear to bring out her best. I do think I'd have been friends with her & Andi if I were there. I like snark.   :Nod:

I totally agree with you and see things the same way.

As for Nikki, I suspect that she was so upset that her words went further than her thoughts.
She may even be regretting saying that on the spur of the moment .

Sprite wrote:

Jeepers wrote:

Aunties_Love wrote:

Jeepers wrote:

USAGold wrote:

Jeepers wrote:The icing on the cake tonight was Clare's comments at the RC .. On the bitchy scale she hit the bell.  DONG!!

She wasn't the only one Nikki did too which is what the show wants us to see conflict drama etc....

nikki didn't saw one word at the RC!!  Clare's comment about JP making a mistake was totally inappropriate .. A major jab

In her itm's Nikki also took some major jabs at Clare.  Let's just say we aren't going to agree on this, but let's also say that Nikki is the "Bitchy" one of the group, and Clare can come out as being over the top sometimes but definately NOT cray cray.

My comment was ONLY and SPECIFIALLY regarding Clare's comment about JP making a mistake at the rose ceremony .. Uncalled for and rude and inappropriate .. A real bitch

They are both bitchy....no doubt with lots of prodding and encouragement from producers for those wonderfully self centered comments. The whole episode was chopped up and clearly edited to death and does neither of them any favours. I'll call it a draw.

Again .. I was ONLY referencing ONE specific scene and the comments of ONE specific person .. That was totally inappropriate .. Real bitchy

 This board is actually funnier than the show itself    

Jeepers wrote:

Sprite wrote:

Jeepers wrote:

Aunties_Love wrote:

Jeepers wrote:

USAGold wrote:

Jeepers wrote:The icing on the cake tonight was Clare's comments at the RC .. On the bitchy scale she hit the bell.  DONG!!

She wasn't the only one Nikki did too which is what the show wants us to see conflict drama etc....

nikki didn't saw one word at the RC!!  Clare's comment about JP making a mistake was totally inappropriate .. A major jab

In her itm's Nikki also took some major jabs at Clare.  Let's just say we aren't going to agree on this, but let's also say that Nikki is the "Bitchy" one of the group, and Clare can come out as being over the top sometimes but definately NOT cray cray.

My comment was ONLY and SPECIFIALLY regarding Clare's comment about JP making a mistake at the rose ceremony .. Uncalled for and rude and inappropriate .. A real bitch

They are both bitchy....no doubt with lots of prodding and encouragement from producers for those wonderfully self centered comments. The whole episode was chopped up and clearly edited to death and does neither of them any favours. I'll call it a draw.

Again .. I was ONLY referencing ONE specific scene and the comments of ONE specific person .. That was totally inappropriate .. Real bitchy

As was Nikki basically calling Clare's whole family crazy (who she does not know and has never met)...also inappropriate and bitchy. As I said...a draw.

albean99 wrote:The conflict between Clare & Nikki so just dumb. I completely understand why Nikki walked away because Clare was starting to talk about Andi. Why Clare followed is beyond me.

Because NO ONE WALKS AWAY WHILE THE QUEEN HOLDS COURT. And since I'm as nasty as the best of them, I actually loved Nikki's crack about Clare's family. Made me laugh. I figured her family did have to be crazy, or at least Grade A enablers to produce the likes of Clare. But Mama impressed me in the preview for next week. Stay strong Clare's Mama!

So how bad in bed is JP? All the crying in the previews. Can't wait for the carnage.

I thought all along that the conversation started because Clare came back from the date after being rejected, and had a huge chip on her shoulder. Nikki left because Clare started talking about Andi, and even though what Clare said wasn't awful, Nikki felt it would get worse so she excused herself. Clare followed Nikki upstairs, and began the confrontation. While Nikki could have handled herself better, Clare was clearly the instigator. Nikki was trying to avoid the confrontation by going upstairs, and then once again, when she asked Clare to leave the room. Clare responded like a 5 year old, and said "Did you pay for this room?"

Also, the comment Clare made at the RC, about being the "wrong decision" by sending Chelsea home was rude and uncalled for. Clare thinks she knows what's best for Juan Pablo.

I also found it funny that Clare's mom said "you're not manipulating mama." If anyone knows Clare the best, it's her mom, and clearly manipulating has been Clare's game for a long time.