The Bachelor 17 - Speculation/Spoilers - Discussion

sdmom wrote:This is very interesting. I haven't watched since Jillian's season, so I went on Wiki to see if there's any correlation between 1 on 1 on episodes and F1.
In recent years, the Bachelor:
Ben- Courtney ep.2
Brad - Emily ep. 3
Jake- Vienna ep. 3
Jason- Melissa ep. 2 (Molly ep.4)
Matt (anyone remember him? the International Banker) -Shayne ep. 3
Andy- Tessa ep.3

The Bachelorette:
Emily- Jef ep. 5 (Sean also ep. 5)
Ashley-J.P. ep. 3
Ali- Roberto ep. 3
Jillian - Ed ep.3
Deanna- the one she really wanted Graham ep. 2, default F1 Jesse ep. 4
(Correct me if I am wrong)
See a pattern? In most cases, F1 has the solo date on ep. 3. Who has 1 on 1 in ep. 3 in Sean's season? Ashlee & Lesley. I still remember the post from an inside prior to FD that "Ashlee is the one to beat. Sean is very into her". Something probably went wrong in their FD.
Other than Emily, the rest of F1 had their date on ep. 2. In Sean's season, Desiree and Sarah did. Sarah took herself out and I wonder if Deseree's HTD prank backfired.
Don't get me wrong, I am not saying Catherine is the default F1, but IMO, Sean was more interested in other girls earlier on, but as time goes on, he likes her more and more, probably reach the highest point after FD.

NCGalBecca wrote:Sean's detours and dead ends have me interested in seeing what transpires, i.e. such as the fact that Kacie gets the group date rose in epi 2 yet is sent home before the RC in epi 3, Sarah opting out, whether he is really interested in Tierra or is she just a producer pick that he has to play along with, why things go south with Lesley Murphy, etc.

Most of all, I look forward to seeing why many of his "good on paper matches" didn't work out (AshLee, Lindsay, Desiree, Lesley). This isn't a knock against Catherine either - it seems like the producers found quite a few girls and Sean confirmed this, that they probably thought matched up well with Sean's background, i.e. such as how they thought Sean and Emily would have made a good match based on what she said she was looking for pre-season.

That's what I want to see too. I also wonder about the "roles" they have to play. In my mind, I can see Tierra "the early frontrunner that everyone hates, aka the villain", Ashlee "the one who falls too early too hard with a sappy story", Lindsey "America's sweetheart, aka the next Bachelorette".

Good ol' wikipedia... LOL! For a while, they didn't have all of this information.

JP lost the flip-coin toss in week #2, losing out to Mickey Ryan... but the F1s do tend to favor the episode #3 solo dates. I recently (belatedly) watched their wedding at abc.com. So many from Ryan Park in his brief segment to Chris Harrison himself are pretty much confirming (in so many words) that Ashley was already zeroing in on JP right away on her season, even if she wasn't "95% certain" until hometowns. We even had that shot in episode #1 of her escorting him herself in the background, making sure she got time with him. (The simple fact that Bentley got the last rose in the ceremony in itself suggests "smokescreen character"... BUT... we all have different opinions on that subject matter and I'll leave it at that. In any case, they still needed A SHOW.)

Now, Catherine is well placed in the meet & greet photo up front. Yes... I know! I know! Some of you don't take stock in that stuff... and, no, we are never certain if there is ANY "rhyme or reason" to anything on this show... group photo positions, rose ceremony positions or timing of the first solo date.

There is also a bit of a trend to let someone "go" in episode 3 from a one on one. It did NOT happen to JP, who had the 2nd 1-1 in Ep 3. When Ali talked about the 1-1s she said she would talk it over with Cassie and they would decide together. I can see that Sean wouldn't want to take the ones going to the end on the Pretty Woman date- IMO, Catherine and Lindsay got the best of the "first" one on ones without them being too glitz oriented (jewelry, dresses, black tie- black tie looks nice on Sean, but I think that look is rare for him- he's a t-shirt kind of guy).

Based on the screencaps/extended preview Sean and Catherine do have chemistry. So even if they don't show a deep conversation between the two that first night we will see them interact on a personal level at some point this season. That we do know.

Absolutely Sean and Catherine have Chemistry. I think we've seen it in the HTD and the FD that we've seen in the videos (and maybe other dates?). I just love the look on her face when, I presume, they are greeting each other on the FD.... her smile is soooooo big.... and you can tell by his cheek, he's got a big grin, too.

Who do you think she's talking about...they are still recruiting the men for the Bachelorette so I would be surprised if it is for the upcoming season..she works at a park in Cali:

16 Dec Diana Zaitseva ‏@DianaZaitseva
Yesterday they were filming The Bachelorette at Six Flags.

Diana Zaitseva ‏@DianaZaitseva
It was the fakest thing ever. After the cameras were off, the couple wouldn't even walk together.

Diana Zaitseva ‏@DianaZaitseva
I don't believe in that "cutesy" tv show & movie love anymore.

When I saw this on the other thread, I thought maybe it was a crew from another country- in the US for "exotic" dates. Bachelor Canada came to the US.... could it be b-ette Canada?

JBF wrote:Is it just me and my quirky eyes or is every first solo date shown in episode #2 always “representing” the end-goal of our lead?

Jason “slow dancing” with otherwise frisky Jillian… then, for his second 1 on 1, blimp-kissing fast and furious with Melissa. (Guess he temporarily went for the quickie in the end, then restarted with a slower romance later.)

Jillian dressing and undressing Jake and trying to get him sloshed to country music. Oh golly gee.

Jake fiddles with his airplane controls as Ali sits in her frightened yellow.

Ali’s car breaking down in front of the Hollywood sign so she and Frankie can talk shared “dreams”.

Brad takes Ashley to an amusement park to undergo “Daddy therapy”

Ashley had a shot-gun marriage in Las Vegas with Willie. In fact, she’s the only one with weddings on the brain, later posing in Taiwan with JP in tux.

Ben, seeking “post-Daddy therapy”, watches home movies in Sonoma of Daddy… and Kacie’s Daddy. Benny Boy was just soooo eager to meet her Daddy later on her wine-free hometown.

Emily dresses football jock Ryan in a flowery apron and forces him to bake cookies for Ricki.

Did I get any of these wrong? Correct me.

When you lay it all out on the line like this, it sure makes me wonder why any of us watch this fake toilet show.

Fruit Loops wrote:

When you lay it all out on the line like this, it sure makes me wonder why any of us watch this fake toilet show.

1 word why... JASH :)

I don’t know what is wrong with me. Seeing too many Funny Little Coincidences season after season? I feel jaded and exhausted. I also think Sean is shown shirtless a little TOO much. I know he's a professional model and they want to get the Magic Mike crowd in, but so did Brad Womack on the season he dumped both ladies and Jake Pavelka. I know… I know. Sean is NOT like those two in any way!!!! *Slap! Slap!* There. I won’t talk like that again. At least Sean keeps his behind covered, so he isn’t expecting “all of America” to spank him like Ben Flajnik.

That promo was interesting. Reality Steve claims the Desiree boyfriend bit was a practical joke, but its prominence in the promo was intentional. Also his comment of keeping hands off of him, although spoken to the boyfriend, is heard over Desiree… as if something pretty bad went down between them that may not be aired on the actual show. Then again... maybe nothing did, but the editing is still peculiar.

Like Ben’s and a few other promos, we get a showcased medical emergency with the lead observing. Ben looked befuddled and clueless during the "turning blue" scene at the San Francisco rose ceremony. Sean is shown analyzing with his finger to his face during the ambulance scene… like he does Desiree’s boyfriend situation, as if saying "there has to be a catch to this".

I was comparing Sean's promo with Ben’s, Emily’s, Ashley’s, Brad’s second season, Jake’s, Jillian’s and Jason’s… and one of Ali’s (but not the good comparative one). If the F1 spoiler is true, we have a lady with very limited involvement or concern for the drama this season, while all the past F1s were either commenting on the drama in the promo or part of the drama itself. ALL F1s play a part in the very "dark center" section of every promo, as some sort of sign on how they deal with the struggles of the lead in any future relationship. Jef disliked somebody (Kalon) talking bad about Emily, Courtney "winning" the rose and skinnydipping, JP was saying "things are getting out of hand" and carrying Ashley in the rain, Emily was "sabotaging every relationship" and getting Brad "stuck" chasing a dream, Roberto was concerned somebody was hurting himself, Vienna was fighting and crying with everybody and Jake yanked his microphone not wanting to deal with it all (he later rides his motorcycle solo), Jillian asks an off-screen Ed about his "other girlfriend" and Ed voice-overs he wants to leave, Molly spends "a lot of time" with Jason and Deanna tells Jason "I think I made a mistake" (with Jason's response: "I had absolutely no idea that it would turn out this way")...

We will see how the promo shown on episode #1 differs from the online one. Might be totally different. Ben had two different ones. I also suspect that Steve watched a different episode #1 edit than we will see.

JBF wrote:I don’t know what is wrong with me. Seeing too many Funny Little Coincidences season after season? I feel jaded and exhausted. I also think Sean is shown shirtless a little TOO much. I know he's a professional model and they want to get the Magic Mike crowd in, but so did Brad Womack on the season he dumped both ladies and Jake Pavelka. I know… I know. Sean is NOT like those two in any way!!!! *Slap! Slap!* There. I won’t talk like that again. At least Sean keeps his behind covered, so he isn’t expecting “all of America” to spank him like Ben Flajnik.

That promo was interesting. Reality Steve claims the Desiree boyfriend bit was a practical joke, but its prominence in the promo was intentional. Also his comment of keeping hands off of him, although spoken to the boyfriend, is heard over Desiree… as if something pretty bad went down between them that may not be aired on the actual show. Then again... maybe nothing did, but the editing is still peculiar.

Like Ben’s and a few other promos, we get a showcased medical emergency with the lead observing. Ben looked befuddled and clueless during the "turning blue" scene at the San Francisco rose ceremony. Sean is shown analyzing with his finger to his face during the ambulance scene… like he does Desiree’s boyfriend situation, as if saying "there has to be a catch to this".

I was comparing Sean's promo with Ben’s, Emily’s, Ashley’s, Brad’s second season, Jake’s, Jillian’s and Jason’s… and one of Ali’s (but not the good comparative one). If the F1 spoiler is true, we have a lady with very limited involvement or concern for the drama this season, while all the past F1s were either commenting on the drama in the promo or part of the drama itself. ALL F1s play a part in the very "dark center" section of every promo, as some sort of sign on how they deal with the struggles of the lead in any future relationship. Jef disliked somebody (Kalon) talking bad about Emily, Courtney "winning" the rose and skinnydipping, JP was saying "things are getting out of hand" and carrying Ashley in the rain, Emily was "sabotaging every relationship" and getting Brad "stuck" chasing a dream, Roberto was concerned somebody was hurting himself, Vienna was fighting and crying with everybody and Jake yanked his microphone not wanting to deal with it all (he later rides his motorcycle solo), Jillian asks an off-screen Ed about his "other girlfriend" and Ed voice-overs he wants to leave, Molly spends "a lot of time" with Jason and Deanna tells Jason "I think I made a mistake" (with Jason's response: "I had absolutely no idea that it would turn out this way")...

We will see how the promo shown on episode #1 differs from the online one. Might be totally different. Ben had two different ones. I also suspect that Steve watched a different episode #1 edit than we will see.

I share in your sentiments. Were there any other promos/seasons where the F1 was hidden? Don't they usually have to get the F1 on the screen relatively early to build up a fan base? I imagine that the spoiled F1 will have a storyline to parallel that of whatever contrived drama happens elsewhere in the season. But, I expect that we won't see a Ben F and his crucified F1's edit on Sean and whoever he picked. I can't imagine the franchise making sport out of running over their leads in two consecutive seasons like that; can you?

Wow..loved the analysis, JBF and the identification of the patterns in play. This season does have me intrigued because they (had) let Sean openly admit that he took some detours and dead ends before finding his way. As almost to say, don't get too hooked or misled by what happens during the early episodes.

Tierra's front and center presence in the promos doesn't really surprise given her dramatic turn as the "villain". Why do you think AshLee (as F3) has such a constant presence in the promos? Whereas, Lindsay, who has a a lot of pre-show love in social media, gets a minimal amount and Catherine almost none?

JBF wrote:I don’t know what is wrong with me. Seeing too many Funny Little Coincidences season after season? I feel jaded and exhausted. I also think Sean is shown shirtless a little TOO much. I know he's a professional model and they want to get the Magic Mike crowd in, but so did Brad Womack on the season he dumped both ladies and Jake Pavelka. I know… I know. Sean is NOT like those two in any way!!!! *Slap! Slap!* There. I won’t talk like that again. At least Sean keeps his behind covered, so he isn’t expecting “all of America” to spank him like Ben Flajnik.

That promo was interesting. Reality Steve claims the Desiree boyfriend bit was a practical joke, but its prominence in the promo was intentional. Also his comment of keeping hands off of him, although spoken to the boyfriend, is heard over Desiree… as if something pretty bad went down between them that may not be aired on the actual show. Then again... maybe nothing did, but the editing is still peculiar.

Like Ben’s and a few other promos, we get a showcased medical emergency with the lead observing. Ben looked befuddled and clueless during the "turning blue" scene at the San Francisco rose ceremony. Sean is shown analyzing with his finger to his face during the ambulance scene… like he does Desiree’s boyfriend situation, as if saying "there has to be a catch to this".

I was comparing Sean's promo with Ben’s, Emily’s, Ashley’s, Brad’s second season, Jake’s, Jillian’s and Jason’s… and one of Ali’s (but not the good comparative one). If the F1 spoiler is true, we have a lady with very limited involvement or concern for the drama this season, while all the past F1s were either commenting on the drama in the promo or part of the drama itself. ALL F1s play a part in the very "dark center" section of every promo, as some sort of sign on how they deal with the struggles of the lead in any future relationship. Jef disliked somebody (Kalon) talking bad about Emily, Courtney "winning" the rose and skinnydipping, JP was saying "things are getting out of hand" and carrying Ashley in the rain, Emily was "sabotaging every relationship" and getting Brad "stuck" chasing a dream, Roberto was concerned somebody was hurting himself, Vienna was fighting and crying with everybody and Jake yanked his microphone not wanting to deal with it all (he later rides his motorcycle solo), Jillian asks an off-screen Ed about his "other girlfriend" and Ed voice-overs he wants to leave, Molly spends "a lot of time" with Jason and Deanna tells Jason "I think I made a mistake" (with Jason's response: "I had absolutely no idea that it would turn out this way")...

We will see how the promo shown on episode #1 differs from the online one. Might be totally different. Ben had two different ones. I also suspect that Steve watched a different episode #1 edit than we will see.

Connecting some random dots here. Could TPTB have given someone the impression that the epi 1 edit was complete, they leak it to RS for whatever compensation, RS leaks info to the world and TPTB once again trapped RS into a lawsuit? Good analysis JFB.