Bachelorette 15 - Hannah Brown - General Discussion - *Sleuthing Spoilers* #4

So, I’ve been putting it all together in my head and IMO - Jed was always F1 and Peter F2, Hannah had always planned to have sex with both. Then along comes Tyler (who might have actually been F4, with Luke P in the picture). No intention of having sex with Tyler but he blew her away on their FS date and she fell for him hard. So, even though she had sex with Peter (4 times?) she let him go - poor guy, he must have felt so blindsided, upset and confused. Come the FRC, she is totally conflicted because of her strong feelings for Tyler that crept up on her but she thought she should stick with her original F1 because it felt safe (God knows how or why), whereas Tyler was still somewhat a mystery. This is the only way I can justify to myself why she didn’t choose Tyler - one more date and Im sure it would have been different. What a sad mess. Is this what others think too?

umngirl wrote:This is probably a super unpopular opinion but my first thought when I saw the bag was that it was a prop used to make it look like Tyler spent the night when he actually didn’t. This him leaving with the bag when in fact they only met up that morning to chat.

Unless I missed the pics of him arriving at her place and then my theory is moot.

@umngirl
I don’t know what really happened but I like the way your mind works and IMO your theory is pretty sound.

The whole thing was orchestrated IMO

I’m pretty sure Hannah said he spent the night though in her interviews yesterday.

@Just Looking, the edit for the season showed Hannah fell in love with Jed. They regularly encountered conflicts that they overcame to lead them to each other at the FRC. It was Jed or no one by then, as some posters suggested.

Even now, Hannah graciously defends Jed in interviews. She even said that she just broke an engagement. I believe that the girl is hurting and putting on a brave face.

As for Tyler, I was confused after FSDs about the way it was handled. Bachelorettes like JoJo and Becca (maybe Rachel?) showed a precedent of sending home their F3s rather than spend an overnight. Hannah gave Tyler a shot, and I do think their evening took her by surprise, opening her heart to him because of the respect he showed her. That respect never wavered throughout the season's airing or ATFR. Given the country's, Bachelornation's, social media/the board's responses to Tyler--and possibly her family's--Hannah may have realized that she deserved THAT kind of love, support, and security, which reignited her feelings that emerged in the final weeks for Tyler leading to the ATFR reunion/date request.

About Tyler now: Part of me wonders if he's remiss to couple-up quickly with Hannah partially because of Jed (I think there are MANY factors). For as much as he's disappointed in Jed, they were friends, and I do think Jed fell in love with Hannah in a twisted way. Maybe a guy can speak to it, but I think it's a "no-no" for another guy to jump right in on his friend's ex-girl even in the Bachelor World.

We don't know exactly how Tyler is feeling. He seemed much more closed off about his feelings for Hannah in his interviews even though he never said he didn't have any anymore.

This is all IMO and hindsight is often 20/20.

Just Looking wrote:So, I’ve been putting it all together in my head and IMO - Jed was always F1 and Peter F2, Hannah had always planned to have sex with both.  Then along comes Tyler (who might have actually been F4, with Luke P in  the picture).   No intention of having sex with Tyler but he blew her away on their FS date and she fell for him hard.  So, even though she had sex with Peter (4 times?)  she let him go - poor guy, he must have felt so blindsided, upset and confused.  Come the FRC, she is totally conflicted because of her strong feelings for Tyler that crept up on her but she thought she should stick with her original F1 because it felt safe (God knows how or why), whereas Tyler was still somewhat a mystery.  This is the only way I can justify to myself why she didn’t choose Tyler - one more date and Im sure it would have been different.  What a sad mess.    Is this what others think too?

I think you've summed up what I've been feeling as well. Thanks, I've been struggling to wrap my head around things.

I think these two rn are caught up in doing what is theoretically "healthy" , which is a good instinct. But I kinda wish one or both would just say we have to give this a real try. I think that might've been the healthiest thing in the long run....if it failed, ok, we know, move on. Limbo land is not a happy place, no matter how many spiritual books one reads to help navigate it, jmo.

I hope if Tyler was pissed at Hannah over what he watched on tv that he actually told her, that they didn't spend that night tiptoeing around the elephant in the room. Would love to have been a fly on the wall Thursday night. 

Oh well, maybe Hannah's the impediment for all I know...her California dreamin etc etc. but that ford model ig of hers suggests otherwise to me....unless they really are such good chums she can rib him about his date with the model. Ugh.

But I confess I have been feeling like I'm suffering from a case of Bach whiplash since Sunday.....

Anyway, thanks for your summary, I think it was spot on. Jmo

Billysmom wrote:

Just Looking wrote:So, I’ve been putting it all together in my head and IMO - Jed was always F1 and Peter F2, Hannah had always planned to have sex with both.  Then along comes Tyler (who might have actually been F4, with Luke P in  the picture).   No intention of having sex with Tyler but he blew her away on their FS date and she fell for him hard.  So, even though she had sex with Peter (4 times?)  she let him go - poor guy, he must have felt so blindsided, upset and confused.  Come the FRC, she is totally conflicted because of her strong feelings for Tyler that crept up on her but she thought she should stick with her original F1 because it felt safe (God knows how or why), whereas Tyler was still somewhat a mystery.  This is the only way I can justify to myself why she didn’t choose Tyler - one more date and Im sure it would have been different.  What a sad mess.    Is this what others think too?

I think you've summed up what I've been feeling as well. Thanks, I've been struggling to wrap my head around things.

I think these two rn are caught up in doing what is theoretically "healthy" , which is a good instinct. But I kinda wish one or both would just say we have to give this a real try. I think that might've been the healthiest thing in the long run....if it failed, ok, we know, move on. Limbo land is not a happy place, no matter how many spiritual books one reads to help navigate it, jmo.

I hope if Tyler was pissed at Hannah over what he watched on tv that he actually told her, that they didn't spend that night tiptoeing around the elephant in the room. Would love to have been a fly on the wall Thursday night. 

Oh well, maybe Hannah's the impediment for all I know...her California dreamin etc etc. but that ford model ig of hers suggests otherwise to me....unless they really are such good chums she can rib him about his date with the model. Ugh.

But I confess I have been feeling like I'm suffering from a case of Bach whiplash since Sunday.....

Anyway, thanks for your summary, I think it was spot on. Jmo

I agree with you @Billysmom about trying to do what is healthy for them right now. But in long run, I don’t think it really is. I think all of this open ended stuff is just more confusing and more hurtful, actually. Limbo is not a happy place, as you have said. She has made her feelings known and I kind of wish he would to. IMO, his interviews last week appeared to say one thing, but this week’s news seems to imply something else. Whiplash is a great way to put it! ..... Just my take on things

Just Looking wrote:So, I’ve been putting it all together in my head and IMO - Jed was always F1 and Peter F2, Hannah had always planned to have sex with both.  Then along comes Tyler (who might have actually been F4, with Luke P in  the picture).   No intention of having sex with Tyler but he blew her away on their FS date and she fell for him hard.  So, even though she had sex with Peter (4 times?)  she let him go - poor guy, he must have felt so blindsided, upset and confused.  Come the FRC, she is totally conflicted because of her strong feelings for Tyler that crept up on her but she thought she should stick with her original F1 because it felt safe (God knows how or why), whereas Tyler was still somewhat a mystery.  This is the only way I can justify to myself why she didn’t choose Tyler - one more date and Im sure it would have been different.  What a sad mess.    Is this what others think too?

@Just Looking
IMO Hannah is a naive, stubborn, loser magnet. We all know them. They don’t want/like/appreciate the guys who are good for them. They gravitate toward losers, hard cases, selfish, difficult men. Hence Hannah’s dedication of her season to Luke P. I’ve seen how those women treat really good men that they settle for after all the trash they chase totally dogs them out. It’s not a pretty story. It’s not new. I’m no psychiatrist but I’ve seen several Hannahs and it takes work to learn to value what’s good not just a few weeks and a redo.

Bottom line, I’m glad Tyler escaped and I hope he someday finds a girl who deserves him and chooses him, first. It’s what he deserves. Tyler was not a mystery. Jed was the mystery because everywhere she turned, red flags were flying. She saw them, she cried about them, she argued against them, she dove right in. Just like with Luke.

One more week, one more month would not have made a difference, IMO. Tyler was not to be her choice. He was too good and she was in love with Jed. That should be obvious no matter what the narrative lies spew now.
All IMO.

You know, I am really starting to wish they would cast these shows at teacher or nursing conventions or the like. There are pretty people in all walks of life, looking for their person. I'm wondering if maybe this has all been so frustrating this season because even the lead and several of her top guys were into things like pageants, recording, modeling, etc. If it weren't for his toxic behavior Luke ps lifestyle actually seems the least popularity-based of that of many of the top guys. And I loved the Tyler who worried about his pops and about mental health and kids....the model Tyler who has had his sights on dwts for ages and sees his pops once in a blue moon is just not that appealing to me, sorry if that means I'm judgmental, jmo. He still seems like a respectful guy, but not quite the unicorn I'd thought he was. Not a bad guy, by any means, just not the Tyler I thought I'd come to know on the show.jmo. 

I know Hannah didn't want to settle for staying in Alabama and poppin out babies, but heading to Cali,  esp if she has her sights set on working in the industry, does seem like the pendulum has swung completely the opposite way. I confess I'm really feeling a tad jaded r n.

Or maybe they just have to have older contestants, as many have pointed out before....? 

(I reserve the right to retract all of the above if the tannah ship sets sail again sometime soon, )

Billysmom wrote:You know, I am really starting to wish they would cast these shows at teacher or nursing conventions or the like. There are pretty people in all walks of life, looking for their person. I'm wondering if maybe this has all been so frustrating this season because even the lead and several of her top guys were into things like pageants, recording, modeling, etc. If it weren't for his toxic behavior Luke ps lifestyle actually seems the least popularity-based of that of many of the top guys. And I loved the Tyler who worried about his pops and about mental health and kids....the model Tyler who has had his sights on dwts for ages and sees his pops once in a blue moon is just not that appealing to me, sorry if that means I'm judgmental, jmo. He still seems like a respectful guy, but not quite the unicorn I'd thought he was. Not a bad guy, by any means, just not the Tyler I thought I'd come to know on the show.jmo. 

I know Hannah didn't want to settle for staying in Alabama and poppin out babies, but heading to Cali,  esp if she has her sights set on working in the industry, does seem like the pendulum has swung completely the opposite way. I confess I'm really feeling a tad jaded r n.

Or maybe they just have to have older contestants, as many have pointed out before....? 

(I reserve the right to retract all of the above if the tannah ship sets sail again sometime soon, )

  I would love an "older" season!!!

Chgohighlife wrote:

Just Looking wrote:So, I’ve been putting it all together in my head and IMO - Jed was always F1 and Peter F2, Hannah had always planned to have sex with both.  Then along comes Tyler (who might have actually been F4, with Luke P in  the picture).   No intention of having sex with Tyler but he blew her away on their FS date and she fell for him hard.  So, even though she had sex with Peter (4 times?)  she let him go - poor guy, he must have felt so blindsided, upset and confused.  Come the FRC, she is totally conflicted because of her strong feelings for Tyler that crept up on her but she thought she should stick with her original F1 because it felt safe (God knows how or why), whereas Tyler was still somewhat a mystery.  This is the only way I can justify to myself why she didn’t choose Tyler - one more date and Im sure it would have been different.  What a sad mess.    Is this what others think too?

@Just Looking
IMO Hannah is a naive, stubborn, loser magnet. We all know them. They don’t want/like/appreciate the guys who are good for them. They gravitate toward losers, hard cases, selfish, difficult men. Hence Hannah’s dedication of her season to Luke P. I’ve seen how those women treat really good men that they settle for after all the trash they chase totally dogs them out. It’s not a pretty story. It’s not new. I’m no psychiatrist but I’ve seen several Hannahs and it takes work to learn to value what’s good not just a few weeks and a redo.

Bottom line, I’m glad Tyler escaped and I hope he someday finds a girl who deserves him and chooses him, first. It’s what he deserves. Tyler was not a mystery. Jed was the mystery because everywhere she turned, red flags were flying. She saw them, she cried about them, she argued against them, she dove right in. Just like with Luke.

One more week, one more month would not have made a difference, IMO. Tyler was not to be her choice. He was too good and she was in love with Jed. That should be obvious no matter what the narrative lies spew now.
All IMO.

I don't think Hannah can be faulted for finding Jed's seeming down-home familiarity attractive. And I can't seem to recall glaring red flags with him prior to the Mtp....Jed was not my type and to the audience didn't seem to return Hannah's energy the way we might've liked, but it was for Hannah to decide if she was comfortable and content with whatever they shared. I don't like Jed and don't trust him, but I don't think she chose him because of his loser ways....the guys saw him as a great, sweet guy. Once she learned the truth she cut him loose. I don't think she wants to be stuck with a loser....if anything, she saw Tyler as the greater threat, until she had enough time with him to see the real Tyler under the smooth exterior. I can't fault her for being a bit wary.... And she admitted her error in judgment. So I don't find her as stubborn as was stated above. I think she is patient to a fault, and I believe that is an extension of her sincere efforts to live out her faith. If anything I think she has needed to come to a healthier understanding of what god wants for her, and I think she is on the right path to finding that - which is why I believe she needed to ask Tyler out last week. Their reunion continues to be intentionally nonsexual, so she is continuing to try to ensure her decisions are healthy and sound, it would seem. Interesting that Tyler gets credit for respecting her and not Hannah for resoecting Tyler enough not to use him. 
Tyler is certainly allowed to feel hurt by how the season went. But it's his choice now to decide if he sees enough  in Hannah to warrant pursuing something and to do so or to dismiss it because she didn't choose him first. If he chooses the latter then his feelings IMHO were never as strong as he claimed they were. 
The whole show is such a mndf$&k, I guess it makes sense that people would come out of it with some doubts about the realness of what their new partner might be claiming to feel. But I'm not convinced that dating around resolves those doubts....I think making an honest go of it, even if it doesn't work in the long run, is probably the way to go.  Forgiveness and commitment are choices, not just feelings. All jmo.

veg_out wrote:snipped
About Tyler now: Part of me wonders if he's remiss to couple-up quickly with Hannah partially because of Jed (I think there are MANY factors). For as much as he's disappointed in Jed, they were friends, and I do think Jed fell in love with Hannah in a twisted way. Maybe a guy can speak to it, but I think it's a "no-no" for another guy to jump right in on his friend's ex-girl even in the Bachelor World.

We don't know exactly how Tyler is feeling. He seemed much more closed off about his feelings for Hannah in his interviews even though he never said he didn't have any anymore.

This is all IMO and hindsight is often 20/20.

IMO the Bachelor World has it's own continents, oceans and atmosphere compared to the world we normally dwell in, but the unspoken "man code" in the real world would say you don't jump in on someone that your friend (or maybe even acquaintance) is with or just broke up with. The Bachelor World warps that because every F1 jumped in on every F2; but that doesn't mean it isn't going to get at least a raised eyebrow.

And ... we don't know how Tyler is feeling right now and I've really tried to put myself in his shoes and figure out what I'd be feeling. IMO I would be concerned that Hannah could be looking at me as a rebound relationship and perhaps to offset her embarrassment for making a really dumb choice. And If I'm Tyler, I'd need some convincing that a) I was not just a rebound choice and that b) She really did love me now. Everything else I could let slide if I was sure about those two issues. IMO during filming, Tyler's role was to chase Hannah and I can't fault him for doing a single thing wrong at that. Now, IMO, it's Hannah who has to do the heavy lifting if she wants anything more than a friend.
JMHO