THE BACHELORETTE - SEASON 12 - JOJO FLETCHER - **NO SPOILERS** - Episode Discussion - *SLEUTHING* DISCUSSION #2

Thank you for posting those videos, Ladybug and mercieme  

What struck me most about the videos of Jordan and Robby picking out rings is that Jordan is talking about himself when picking out a ring and Robby is talking about JoJo. That says it all to me, imo, as I really do think Jordan seems to be entitled and self-absorbed. IA with Mia's post on top of this page that Jordan doesn't act like he is all in and ready for a commitment. Robby seems all in. Even when Robby is taking to JoJo's parents (I loved that he talked to her mom, too) I like that he is able to articulate what marriage means to him. Robby seems to have really good communication skills and even with his ex-stuff, I liked that Robby was upfront and talked to JoJo about it. That strikes me as someone who wants to be open. I also like that Robby calls JoJo "Joelle" he seems like someone who would treat JoJo, Joelle, like a princess.

That being said, I still think JoJo may choose Jordan, which, if she does, I will be surprised if it lasts TBH as I just don't find Jordan to be genuine nor that interested in JoJo. I think JoJo saying early on that she didn't think Jordan was as into her as she him was spot on and her women's intuition speaking to her and as much as I am hoping that Jordan is F2 I am just not sure based on how much JoJo has justified Jordan's actions far more than any of the other guys and especially Robby about his ex (which seemed hypocritical a bit considering she had ex drama too).

Regarding Chase and Luke. WTHeck was JoJo thinking? Chase was, imo, the most normal guy out of all the guys on JoJo's season and showed through his actions how he felt and then wham he gets the boot. I can't blame him for being upset and understand it is just the show but then again, if JoJo was ever really serious about him I don't think she would have had Chase on a 2on1 date and then booted before FD. It seems like she really put him through the ringer. Luke seemed shocked when he left and didn't seem fully over JoJo either on MTA, imo. When looking at the guys JoJo let go, half of me wonders if JoJo even wants a serious commitment if she ends up choosing Jordan instead of Robby as I think Robby, and especially Chase and Luke, strike me as much more mature and ready for a commitment.

AllAboutLove wrote:
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That being said, I still think JoJo may choose Jordan, which, if she does, I will be surprised if it lasts TBH as I just don't find Jordan to be genuine nor that interested in JoJo. I think JoJo saying early on that she didn't think Jordan was as into her as she him was spot on and her women's intuition speaking to her...

When looking at the guys JoJo let go, half of me wonders if JoJo even wants a serious commitment if she ends up choosing Jordan instead of Robby as I think Robby, and especially Chase and Luke, strike me as much more mature and ready for a commitment.

Great post, AAL I think that you hit the nail on the head with the last sentence. As I reflect on this season and the fact that JoJo continued her "bad boy" pattern (again, the show set up this contrast of bad boys being Robby and Jordan and good guys being Luke and Chase), I more firmly believe that some truth lived in the tabloid article. As much as I think that she wanted to find love, I also think that her motivation for doing this show was to use it as a launching pad for a bigger career, possibly in entertainment or on HGTV (she is in real estate). I do believe that JoJo will pick Jordan based on caps and edit, and it seems likely that this outcome was pre-determined for her to sign on the dotted line.

Chase accurately summarized this season when he told her, "You never gave it a chance." Because Jo is a physically and emotionally expressive person, it comes across as interest, but her heart was always with Jordan even if she enjoyed Robby, Chase, and Luke, imo. This season reminded me again of my preference for an older Bette: Jo's focus on words over actions, and, ultimately, her choosing of Jordan indicate to me that she's not ready for long-lasting love nor to settle down. If she was, she'd have picked Chase or Robby.

Like Jilly, Jo will evolve in her understanding of love. I hope that she finds her mate someday like Ali did Kevin; I just don't think it's Jordan.

@veg_out TBH it's been a really strange season to me with guys like Robby, Chase, and Luke chasing JoJo and JoJo chasing Jordan. IA that perhaps JoJo may be wanting to launch into another career so I guess if she chooses Jordan and it doesn't work out she can do that?

Which brings me to this: I am still wondering about those s/caps of JoJo walking by herself at sunset at the FRC...

When I first saw those s/caps I immediately thought that JoJo chooses no one, because, despite TPTB usually showing the lead all confused and undecided I don't recall a lead ever been shown later at FRC sunset by themselves? Wouldn't the FRC have happened by then?

My speculation for F1 here still makes me wonder if JoJo chooses no one? If she does have an F1 then I can only see it as being Jordan atm, but it certainly is possible it is Robby but I think he has more of the typical F2 edit (overconfident calling himself the frontrunner and physical connection shown from the beginning). Not long now to find out...

One last sneak peek preview:  GMA preview

The link for GMA is only the video.  Your safe clicking it.  The source listed below is from Twitter and has comments, so beware.  

Source

Happy Finale day!  Happy viewing!  

Among the F4, I see Robby and Jordan as being the outgoing, extroverted type and I think that's what Jojo ultimately wanted. I see Luke and Chase as being more introverted. Introverts (of which I am one) are fine with socializing and making bonds, but they also need alone time to recharge.

Among the F4, Jordan is the only one whom I don't think was fully ready to commit to Jojo. I don't think it was anything about her, specifically, but more about him. IMO he just needed more time. Now he may have gone ahead and made the proposal, but if she picked him, I don't see it lasting.

I don't see him as being a bad guy. I do think he's somewhat narcissistic and self-involved, however. I've seen guys like that eventually settle down and get married, but they do it on their own schedule. To me he's the least attractive choice among the F4.

I'm rooting for Robby!

Ok, after watching that GMA preview, I'm thinking: Could they have had any more steps down to that beach? I mean, is it any wondering that we see her saying her finale good byes to the F2 (aka Jordan) down on the sand. Ain't no way she's climbing that mountain one more time than is absolutely necessary. 

Here is my play by play prediction for how it is going to go down tonight:

1) Jordan meets family and comes across ok, but does not completely convince them he is 'ready'.

2) Robby meets family and they are blown away by him and his asking for 'the blessing'.

3) Jojo talks through her feelings for both men, and there is a big question mark edited in at the end of this segment.

4) Robby and Jojo have LCD day and night. She's on top of the world with him and his plans for their future. He is afraid that there is a chance she might pick Jordan, and he is searching for reassurance that he is the one. She still doesn't say ILY, and she displays anxiety over the situation. He is nervous as Jojo leaves. My Spumoni will have another sleepless night.

5) Jordan and Jojo have LCD day and night. She does activity date with him (again) to cut down on constant physical proximity/kissing. (I wonder if there will be a sacred temple in the grotto, too?) They will edit the date, however, to show us every canoodle and kiss the guy got to keep us in suspense (not). She will grill him with questions about whether or not he is ready for forever, and he will give her lukewarm answers. They will make it look like he still has a chance, but he really doesn't. But, yeah, she has a show to put on.

6) Jordan picks out a ring thinking only about how he feels. Robby picks out a ring thinking only of how he wants to make Jojo feel.

7) On the morning of the FRC they will show us distraught Jojo. She is distraught precisely for the reason she says in the GMA preview: She fell in love (but not equally) with 2 men. She has never broken up with any man before this show. So far she has broken up with many men, but none whom she felt she was actually in love with. (We heard her tell final 2 that she let Chases go because she wasn't in love him). So, this is the big cry, the big panic attack, the big last minute freak out.

8) Jordan shows up and she says: Everyday I wanted it to be you, and I fell in love with you. But my heart belongs to another.  (I'm not convinced that any of the other VO words go here, but they might). She walks him over to the boats and he then make the long climb back up those steps.


9) After they reapply her makeup, Robby arrives. She tells him that she's in love with him. They exchange speeches. At this point, Robby might drop to one knee, but there is still a part of me that thinks that Robby will tell her that he wants the moment to be on a day (possibly surrounded by family) that she is not feeling so emotionally tumultuous. (He may show her the ringbox) Instead he may give her a bracelet as his token on love til that time. (That's why I see what appears to be him fixing a bracelet to her left wrist and her taking that very staged looking solo walk along the beach at sunset with a bracelet on.)

10) ATFR will be filled with Hayes (The Patridge family) and Fletcher (The Brady Bunch) families. We will see happy and in love couple and possibly the proposal, if it hasn't already occurred.

    

T minus 6 for me.  This will be my final post before tonight's finale and ATFR. 

It has been a pleasure posting here in the unspoiled threads all season with such a great group of intelligent, insightful, and funny people. You all have made it such a wonderful few months. Thanks to the moderators and all of those who shared their technical talents with us. 

Enjoy the show!

 

It was so enjoyable reading your posts @MiaHawk as well as everyone else's! Great job by all. What a great example of teamwork!

There will be updates in this section in the next coming days in order to prepare for a new season.

Enjoy the show!

Mia, I agree with most of your scenario, except that I think Robby goes ahead and pops the question on the beach! I'll see everyone back here later on.

Thanks to everyone who has posted on the unspoiled threads. I have to say that I really enjoyed being unspoiled this season, although those two week intervals between shows were *tough*. Thanks also to the Mods for having our backs.

I am totally looking forward to the silliness that is BiP. Bring it on!

Enjoy the show, my peeps! What a fantastically fun, rewarding, and wonderful season with all of you. I loved the way that we worked together and respected each other's opinions and predictions. It made the season!

I probably won't join in the conversation until after 9 p.m. Eastern. Mia, best of luck!

Oh, Mia.

When Robby was the first one out of the car, I said out loud, "OH  $#%+! I really thought he had pulled it off.

I guess that Jordan was the one that she wanted. If I were Robby, the one question I would have had for her was, when did she know it was Jordan?" She seemed really torn just before the end, but then she told Jordan how much she was "crazy in love with" him. Was she crazy in love with him for a long time, but wondering if he was in the same place emotionally? Was she at least to some degree stringing Robby along? Was he ever a viable candidate for her? He seemed to get a moment of clarity after she talked to him where it struck him, okay, Jojo had a show to put on and it wasn't me. Arrgh.

I was also interested when she told Robby that the quality of their friendship wasn't comparable to the quality of the friendship she had with Jordan. That seemed to come out of left field for me. But it was almost brutally honest, and sometimes you need that if you want to come to terms with the end of a relationship.

I certainly wish Jojo and Jordan the best. I've had reservations about Jordan, and I still do. But I hope it works out for them. They looked fine together on ATFR. I didn't get the sense that there is any significant trouble between them at present, apart from their reported problems from negative media reports (about Jordan?) My impression is that they will give it a shot.

As for the next Bachelor, I think that Luke, Chase, and Robby would all be fine choices. My preference is for Luke, but with those three men you really can't go wrong.