The Bachelor 20 - Ben Higgins - F1 to F4 - *Sleuthing - Spoilers* - #2

LUCAS .. You hit the nail right smack on the head .. Thank you

Lucas- brilliant!

Lucas15 wrote:

Sprite wrote:Yes, Sean season was spoiled. Unlike Lauren this season, Cat was not shown too much at the beginning and had a late first date... I believe it was episode 6. As a result, there was questions if she was indeed the one. We got lots of little hints post show that indicated that she was and even though their chemistry build over the course of the season there were many that still questioned the result...but that is always the case. The editors are good at their job and always create doubt.

Very true. But IIRC Sean later said that he knew he wanted Catherine around and he didn't need a 1-1 with her to know that. But that doesn't mean that all leads would do it that way and Ben seems to have preferred to focus in on the one who, in his words on the HTD, made the world stop. Different strokes for different folks but IMO Ben wanted to explore if Lauren was really real and he did that by giving her a lot of key dates that showed her who he believes he really is.

IMO we need to remember one key conversation that to me is pivotal and that is the conversation between Ben and Lauren on their first 1-1 where Ben asks Lauren just what she is looking for. Her answer (paraphrased) is that she comes from a close-knit family and her father is a simple, nice and caring man and a great father, and she is looking for someone like that who can be the same father to her kids that her father was to her. So all the dates that Ben has had with Lauren have been tailored to show her that he is just that kind of man.

Everyone else is chasing Ben and has somehow managed to handicap themselves with baggage along the way - Caila with her confusing stories and admission that her big fear is that she won't be able to love Ben - JoJo with her antagonistic brothers and an ex who suddenly wants her back after breaking her heart. And while this is going on, Ben has been chasing Lauren and the only reason he doesn't know (yet) that he has actually caught her is that the producers have (somehow) stopped Lauren from telling Ben all the things that she's told viewers and her sister. Ben is Lauren's "my person" and he just doesn't know it yet.

Follow the feet - look to see who is chasing who ...

JMHO

No doubt Lauren has been his favorite at the beginning of the season...
But the main question is will she stay the one at the end ?
It seems that Ben got more and more invested in Jojo, IMO, and I am waiting to watch FD and LCD to see how things go.
Who will finish first?
Pole positions don't always "win"...

I think all the post show clues, editing and poor little Ben trying way too hard to keep a perfectly neutral face when Lauren was shown on Jimmy Kimmel all prove to me it's her, IMO.  I'd be shocked because of those reasons if it's not Lauren. They seem like a great match for each other and I imagine Ben was super happy about how it turned out as soon as the FRC is done and they started their relationship.  I hope they're doing really well.

I also think that because they've cut so much footage out of Lauren and Ben that she is the F1, by showing less footage they make it less obvious. I'm thinking that JoJo is kind of like the decoy - it's similar to how Richie on the Bachelorette AU was used as the decoy where Sam was filmed watching their date, and there was always interviews saying that an 'underdog' would win and the finale would be unexpected, but it was the person we expected the whole time. The producers have tried to plant a seed of doubt with Ben posting about JoJo's dates, and showing a lot of their time together, and also all the promos but even with this doubt there's no hiding the love he has for Lauren so im still 99% sure she is the F1

sde1041 wrote:But the main question is will she stay the one at the end ?

IMO for Lauren to fail to stay the one at the end, there has to be some sort of cataclysmic event happen that would prevent Ben from choosing her. An example of such an event that we have seen derail a lead who had fallen (hard) for someone who did not end up at F1 was Des' season where Brooks left before she could choose him. Not to detract from what seems to have been a very happy "real life" relationship leading to a very happy marriage, it was less that Chris "won" and more that Brooks "lost" by withdrawing.

Should Lauren withdraw - or decide that she can't see a life with Ben and never tell Ben how she feels about him. leaving him in deep doubt that she wants "this" - then I can see how Ben might have chosen someone else. But I don't see any evidence thus far that she did that.

While I hate to make a positive point with a negative argument, there are two factors to be overcome in the argument for Ben to have picked what appears to be the best alternative to Lauren - JoJo. One is that JoJo's family has not welcomed Ben with open arms - more like the toe of their boots. To someone who doesn't like drama, that's big. You can make a go of it with someone whose family doesn't approve but that is not a situation to be taken lightly and it really wears on a relationship. And the second factor is there's an ex - and not just any ex - in this case in the ex who left JoJo heartbroken and is responsible for her difficulty in opening up - and that ex has now decided that he made a mistake and wants JoJo back. That is pitting Ben - with about 6 weeks of manipulated "showmance" against an ex with months (years?) of history with JoJo; that's not a level playing field and Ben knows it because he had a past experience (apparently - from what he said on the HTD) that didn't go well for him. IMO choosing JoJo is a big risk with tangible indications why it might not work out well for Ben. Lauren has no handicap - there's nothing in her past (that we know of) that could come out of the woodwork to cause problems going forward, and her family has been as welcoming to Ben as any family can be expected to be. Mollie especially seems enamored with Ben.

I can't for the life of me figure out why Ben would pass up a low-risk choice like Lauren (even if he wasn't in love with her) for a high-risk choice like JoJo. This is, IMO, Lauren's to lose and the only way she's not going to be picked is if she leaves or rejects Ben. I don't think she does any such thing.
JMHO

Jeepers wrote:Lauren has been very supportive of Ben .. Wasn't her last question to him at her HTD .. How are you doing??  Just one example

His comment/question to JoJo a couple episodes .. I thought you would understand...

They are both pretty supportive .. Can't rule either one out

Looking at the families though, Lau's dad asked Ben how he is doing too, I think empathy from the family will also play a role.

I am not even going to bother saying I agree with Lucas' post as I firmly believe Lucas is my brother from another mother when it comes to this season

also Lauren has been liking and replying to tweets that she wouldn't be replying and liking if she wasn't with Ben. For example if she wasn't with Ben i don't think she'd be saying 'makes sense' to loving him like in this tweet IMO

To summarize my thoughts on all above posts, I agree Ben is feeling more and more for Jojo. I think he is trying to give that relationship a fair shot. And i do think he did feel love for her.

I just think he is a goner for Lauren. She is the only one he wants to know all about him (convo about his dad's illness on first date, "I want this girl to really know me" "this girl is changing me" "DONT" when she tells him about her doubt, the convo in the Whiskey library about him being afraid she would walk away early on... ) Actually to me this last one is key, as is the fact she hasnt told him she loves him, and wont until AFTER Jojo on FD (even though it will be showed before on purpose). I think he is very afraid to not be loved back, and tried to not put all his eggs into the Lauren basket because of that insecurity she might not choose him/stay/love him. So when jojo declares her love, he chose to express his love for her.

I am NOT saying it was a precaution and he didnt feel love for Jojo, but i am saying things may have been different had Lau's date been before Jojo's.

IMHO

sophienette wrote:Looking at the families though, Lau's dad asked Ben how he is doing too, I think empathy from the family will also play a role.

IMO the families play a big role. We grow up seeing various things about our parents. Sometimes our parents do things that we don't think were right and we tend to try to be the opposite, and sometimes our parents do things that we think are just great and we try to follow in those footsteps.

I think that both Ben and Lauren came from close families where the parents shared a great love for each other and are both looking for that kind of family in their own marriages. What the HTDs do is provide a glimpse (however brief it is) into the families of the contestants to see if there's a pattern there to indicate what kind of spouse that person would be.

sophienette wrote:"DONT" when she tells him about her doubt,

That "DON'T" was right out of Sean's playbook with Catherine. IIRC it was on their LCD when Catherine said she was fighting daydreams of engagement parties and Sean said to her "don't fight it" - if not the only assurance Sean gave Catherine that she was his choice, this was one that we actually got to see.