Lauren Bushnell - Bachelor 20 - *Sleuthing - Spoilers* - #2

I never personally saw Lauren as indifferent to Ben. I saw her as one of the few realistic contestants we've ever had that is not rushing to gush about him after one real date. Yes, she likes him, he shows interest in her, but she actually realizes she is on a reality show where he is dating multiple women, and isn't crowing "game over" because their relationship is progressing nicely.

This week I saw as close to natural progression of a relationship as we'll ever see on this very unnatural show. She's starting to let the guard (protect her heart) down by letting him know she has feelings for him too. Seems pretty realistic to me- he clearly has feelings for her, but how could she expect the relationship that has started to progress if she doesn't let him know the feelings are mutual and he is not "spinning his wheels"? JMO

peggy0221 wrote:You guys all say she is very sweet, I'm curious to know what made you all think that? I'm trying to like her (although I can never like her cheekbones ), so am trying to see if I missed anything.

The conversations with her and Ben were all about herself so far, her dad, her being picky, her being uncertain, etc. Still haven't seen her caring side at all, not even seen her comforting Ben, etc. Those moments may have left in the editing floor, but I don't know what I missed as an audience, instead of seeing her through the spoiled F1 glasses or through Ben's glasses.

Her eyes welled up completely when Ben was talking about his dad. You could see how touched she was by what he was telling her.  I think that conversation has been the only one completely about Ben this season. I don't remember him talking to other ladies about himself at all, aside when he told them all about his friends passing away, and Jubilee comforted him. Soon all that became about the women wanting to interrupt them, and how they thaught Jubikee was rude and all that.

My comment was not to say Sweet was a bad quality.  It was a commentary on if I'm looking at a guy as my "love/the one" I would rather be thought of as sexy over sweet.  Since Ben has been hanging out in So Cal and Lauren is a beach gal....maybe.....Ben meant "Sweet" in surfer speak.....as in totally rad.  "Dude that wave was Sweet."

From the Lauren I have seen on my TV, I'll bet she had a good laugh about it AND gave Ben a ribbing too.

JMO

peggy0221 wrote:

AmyB wrote:I'm confused. Lauren is generally a confident person, yes, but that doesn't mean that she has confidence in absolutely everything she does 100% of the time. Before, she was criticized for acting like she doesn't care enough, but now that she is showing him she cares it must be her being manipulative and passive aggressive because, as a confident person, she's not allowed to feel uncertainty and seek out validation to make sure that Ben still feels the same thing she does?   She can't win!

In fact, standing on the complete opposite spectrum, I see what you see too.  
Fans of hers said everything in her favour to cover all bases, when she was indifferent with Ben, people said she was being real and know her value. When she fished for compliment, people said she has a fragile heart that it was only a guard. She wins no matter what.

I get why people like her, she always says the right things and smiles perfectly.
But confidence/cockiness can also be manipulative and calculated sometimes. We may just see it from a different angle.

Yeah, but from what I've seen, she's not being defended just because people are fans of her (I can't speak for everyone that's a fan of her, but if she did something I felt was worthy of criticism I would criticise her. She's not infallible to me ), but because of the circumstances surrounding the episode 2 cocktail party and Vegas group date. 

When she was indifferent with him it was episode 2, she hadn't gotten a date at all, and she hadn't seen him in days. So, IMO, her reaction to him at the time was completely realistic and knowing her value because at that point she hadn't had a chance to spend an extended period of time with him and develop any substantial feelings beyond physical attraction/a crush. Now, she's had her 1 on 1 with him, has spent more time with him, and has also had to see him go on dates with other girls and interact with other women in front of her, ect. So her reaction to be more candid and seek validation makes sense because her feelings have developed more and, prior to their conversation, she didn't know if he was feeling the same way as her or if he had stronger feelings for other girls (especially after seeing him kissing JoJo a day earlier). For me, she's still being real and knowing her value, but she's more vulnerable because she has stronger feelings now than she did earlier. It's more of a natural progression of a relationship, IMO.

If she had been the opposite way (half in love right out of the limo, but then cooled off and played hard to get after their 1 on 1), then I would 100% think she was being manipulative/calculated. But, to me personally, I see her reaction in this episode as someone who is developing feelings, doesn't know how to navigate the situation, and wants to make sure that what she's feeling is real and reciprocated after they had such a good 1 on 1 date.

Ben could have just meant "Sweet" as in my sweetheart, or my sweet love.  He was probably trying not to say too much when Ellen sprung Lauren's photo in his face.  He was thrilled to be on Ellen and was probably lucky to get his words out. Ellen admits she couldn't decipher any hints from any of his answers. Gotta love Ellen.  

AmyB wrote:

peggy0221 wrote:

AmyB wrote:I'm confused. Lauren is generally a confident person, yes, but that doesn't mean that she has confidence in absolutely everything she does 100% of the time. Before, she was criticized for acting like she doesn't care enough, but now that she is showing him she cares it must be her being manipulative and passive aggressive because, as a confident person, she's not allowed to feel uncertainty and seek out validation to make sure that Ben still feels the same thing she does?   She can't win!

In fact, standing on the complete opposite spectrum, I see what you see too.  
Fans of hers said everything in her favour to cover all bases, when she was indifferent with Ben, people said she was being real and know her value. When she fished for compliment, people said she has a fragile heart that it was only a guard. She wins no matter what.

I get why people like her, she always says the right things and smiles perfectly.
But confidence/cockiness can also be manipulative and calculated sometimes. We may just see it from a different angle.

Yeah, but from what I've seen, she's not being defended just because people are fans of her (I can't speak for everyone that's a fan of her, but if she did something I felt was worthy of criticism I would criticise her. She's not infallible to me ), but because of the circumstances surrounding the episode 2 cocktail party and Vegas group date. 

When she was indifferent with him it was episode 2, she hadn't gotten a date at all, and she hadn't seen him in days. So, IMO, her reaction to him at the time was completely realistic and knowing her value because at that point she hadn't had a chance to spend an extended period of time with him and develop any substantial feelings beyond physical attraction/a crush. Now, she's had her 1 on 1 with him, has spent more time with him, and has also had to see him go on dates with other girls and interact with other women in front of her, ect. So her reaction to be more candid and seek validation makes sense because her feelings have developed more and, prior to their conversation, she didn't know if he was feeling the same way as her or if he had stronger feelings for other girls (especially after seeing him kissing JoJo a day earlier). For me, she's still being real and knowing her value, but she's more vulnerable because she has stronger feelings now than she did earlier. It's more of a natural progression of a relationship, IMO.

If she had been the opposite way (half in love right out of the limo, but then cooled off and played hard to get after their 1 on 1), then I would 100% think she was being manipulative/calculated. But, to me personally, I see her reaction in this episode as someone who is developing feelings, doesn't know how to navigate the situation, and wants to make sure that what she's feeling is real and reciprocated after they had such a good 1 on 1 date.

I see all that you are saying and agree that yes the statements she makes, concerns she brings up are realistic given the timeline and normal in the real world. A contestant on the show like that would be so refreshing and I'd be all gung-ho for Ben's wonderful future if I found her believable. What I've seen from either her body language, eyes or voice and tones is not coming across as genuine and believe me I've looked hard for it. I want to like her too and see her as most of North America does but I still don't. Will that change when/if I begin to see sincerity or will I not be able to get past what I can't help but notice now. I personally think Ben made a mistake by showing her he was all in so soon and by letting his emotions do "his thinking" for him. 

As an aside but related, I've seen two seasons (Bach AU 3 and NZ 1) knowing who the F1 is. I saw the instant spark between the leads and them from the very beginning but the difference between Ben and them is that both of these leads took their time and were more realistic and sensible and kept their eyes open despite the immediate connection.

Well that's your opinion I find her real and Ben finds her real and that's all that matters.

^ Amy B:

bachfan29 wrote:Well that's your opinion I find her real and Ben finds her real and that's all that matters.

Obviously. And yes that is my opinion that's why I wrote it on this board full of opinions.

TMZ's second post about Lauren....

BACHELOR' CONTESTANT LAUREN B. Engagement Ring On ... WINNER WINNER?



From Bachelor' favorite Lauren Bushnell looks like a taken woman, judging from the ring on her finger, but there's less here than meets the eye.

The photo surfaced Tuesday -- Lauren wearing what looks like an engagement ring -- and it caused a ****storm thanks to her friend who posted the pic on Instagram. Could it be ... Ben not only picked her but popped the question?  No.

The photo was taken in September, 2 months BEFORE Ben picked the woman of his dreams. There's no way she was married during the competition, or even engaged, because it would mean the show was a sham and that would be a PR disaster for producers.

So the takeaway is this ... a rose by any other name may be a rose, but a ring on the left ring finger is not always an engagement ring.

http://www.tmz.com/2016/01/27/bachelor-lauren-bushnell-engagement-ring/

Wow no need to be snippy. We get that you don't think she is real and let's leave it at that.

I wasn't snippy, just matter of fact.