The Bachelorette 11 - Kaitlyn Bristowe - Epi 8 July 6th - *Sleuthing - Spoilers*

Peppermom wrote:IMO, if TPTB had a straight "love story" season, what would everyone have to argue about? IMO only :cutesmile!:

IMO, if all they had is what they've shown so far,,,without sex gate..it would have been boring as hell! So on Monday night, back to sex it is!

In all fairness, I think Kaitlin helped throw herself under the bus. 
This was not her first rodeo. She knows how things work with the edit. She knows how production is. 
Yet, she managed to give them a great hand to play her. I don't put all the blame for once( I know I can't believe it myself) on the machine.

I've watched this show for years and know all about the splice n dice editing, but...

When K talked to S (during his many freak outs) her facial expression didn't show much empathy or caring for him. It was more her being worried that her 'cat was out if the bag'.

When K talked to N (at RC) her facial expression, again, didn't show much empathy or caring for him. She was just interested in finding out exactly what N had told the other guys.

She was worried about S's reaction, but was it concern for S's feelings? Or concern for herself having to go through the uncomfortable explanation? Or the fear that one of her favorites would leave the show? IDK, to me, it seems like more of a concern for her own discomfort with having to explain herself to the guys and S, than a concern of hurting the man she's falling in love with. I am really curious to see what emotion she will show during the scene where she tells S the truth.

I felt badly for N is that pre RC scene. I think he shed those tears out of feeling like a misjudged and used fool. He said, "I had a nice time" in reference to their sex, and then said he was scared of a repeat of last season (thinking he was F1 but being let go after sex). It was as if, "Didn't you have a great time?" Or "Do you now regret the sex?" Was what he was actually saying. To me, it was kind of a role reversal scene, where the one who is in the more vulnerable position (typically the woman) is feeling like he was used and now the user wants nothing to do with him. If I saw K's flat affect looking back at me in that situation, you better bet I would be feeling like I was used. She didn't look at him with empathy or love. It was basically the FRC part one. Can't believe the spoiler that he actually proposes to her!

To me, they just seem like a trio of self serving individuals, and not people who are caring about anyone elses feelings. I feel this about Nick slightly less than the others. S is just a bag of nerves in love with the idea of love, moreso than K, cuz he doesnt even know her. K more in love with the idea of the strapping young man who smells good, but willing to sleep with the other guy who makes her feel desired.

Wondering what exactly was visible in this K/S snapchat everyone is talking about? What did it show? Is in available for viewing somewhere?

It's hard for me to fathom this ends well. Jmho.

isittrue wrote:I like Shawn and Kait together and Nick as well but I do think the edit is throwing all of them under the bus this season.  I still expect the drama to last all the way through ATFR.  CH and K both said this season was refreshing as it shows Kait  handling things in a different way than past bachelorettes but I just find it stressful to watch at times.  It seems as though Kait and Shawn are happy right now but I am just hoping we see that at ATFR and that TPTB don't have any more tricks up their sleeves.  

I have seen nothing refreshing about this season thus far and I fully expect I won't see anything refreshing by the time we are done. Like you, I find it stressful to watch at times, however, mostly I am just finding it distasteful and annoying. I don't expect things to be any different at the AFTR.

Bring on BIP!

OnePromise wrote:I believe the video of Nick that Ariel is referring to is from post show interviews last season.  He was asked if he would consider being the next bachelor and he replied a pretty staple answer that all contestants are coached to use.  He said that he would be flattered to be considered, but would have to consider if he was ready for something like that and talk to his family about it.  He did not really sound like he was seriously considering it, IMO.  

Thanks, that is what I figured - that it must have been something from one of his interviews, following last season's big fallout.

Thanks OP. This is what happens when links aren't provided.

If he did say it recently, by all means if someone has a link, please post it. TYIA

I remember it. I was from about a year ago immediately after the ATFR fallout.
It was in response to the interviewer asking if offered what his response would be and his answer was a politically correct: I'd be honored or it would be a honor, something like this. 
What could you say? Shove it?

MiaHawk wrote:I've watched this show for years and know all about the splice n dice editing, but...

When K talked to S (during his many freak outs) her facial expression didn't show much empathy or caring for him. It was more her being worried that her 'cat was out if the bag'.

When K talked to N (at RC) her facial expression, again, didn't show much empathy or caring for him. She was just interested in finding out exactly what N had told the other guys.

She was worried about S's reaction, but was it concern for S's feelings? Or concern for herself having to go through the uncomfortable explanation? Or the fear that one of her favorites would leave the show? IDK, to me, it seems like more of a concern for her own discomfort with having to explain herself to the guys and S, than a concern of hurting the man she's falling in love with. I am really curious to see what emotion she will show during the scene where she tells S the truth.

I felt badly for N is that pre RC scene. I think he shed those tears out of feeling like a misjudged and used fool. He said, "I had a nice time" in reference to their sex, and then said he was scared of a repeat of last season (thinking he was F1 but being let go after sex). It was as if, "Didn't you have a great time?" Or "Do you now regret the sex?" Was what he was actually saying.  To me, it was kind of a role reversal scene, where the one who is in the more vulnerable position (typically the woman) is feeling like he was used and now the user wants nothing to do with him. If I saw K's flat affect looking back at me in that situation, you better bet I would be feeling like I was used. She didn't look at him with empathy or love. It was basically the FRC part one. Can't believe the spoiler that he actually proposes to her!

To me, they just seem like a trio of self serving individuals, and not people who are caring about anyone elses feelings. I feel this about Nick slightly less than the others.  S is just a bag of nerves in love with the idea of love, moreso than K, cuz he doesnt even know her. K more in love with the idea of the strapping young man who smells good, but willing to sleep with the other guy who makes her feel desired.

Wondering what exactly was visible in this K/S snapchat everyone is talking about? What did it show? Is in available for viewing somewhere?

It's hard for me to fathom this ends well. Jmho.

LOVE this post!!!  I agree with everything that you wrote.  When we are able to look at these three people (K,S,N) on this show as characters and can remain neutral, it makes cutting through all this bullsh*t a whole lot easier.  But, once we pick a favorite, it becomes that much harder to see the big picture.

That being said, I have felt all along that Kaitlyn derailed her own season by CHOOSING to sleep with Nick.  From that point on she has been operating out of fear, since she has openly said that she doesn't REGRET what happened - only the timing.  So, I agree with you that Kaitlyn is more worried about how this is going to affect HER right now, and that is why she refused to come clean with the guys any earlier.  She even said that her biggest fear was ending up with no one at the end of this show.

I have wondered what this season would have been like, had she not had sex with Nick that early in the process.  How would that have changed the entire direction of the season if she had used some common sense and restraint and just dated all the guys - kept each relationship on an even playing field?  At this point all I see is Kaitlyn reacting and putting out fires - fires that she herself started.

Longhornfan wrote:

... Snipped to shorten ...

That being said, I have felt all along that Kaitlyn derailed her own season by CHOOSING to sleep with Nick.  From that point on she has been operating out of fear, since she has openly said that she doesn't REGRET what happened - only the timing.  So, I agree with you that Kaitlyn is more worried about how this is going to affect HER right now, and that is why she refused to come clean with the guys any earlier.  She even said that her biggest fear was ending up with no one at the end of this show.

I have wondered what this season would have been like, had she not had sex with Nick that early in the process.  How would that have changed the entire direction of the season if she had used some common sense and restraint and just dated all the guys - kept each relationship on an even playing field?  At this point all I see is Kaitlyn reacting and putting out fires - fires that she herself started.

Well said. This is exactly how I feel too. I'm a fan of Kaitlyn and Shawn and rooting for them but I would much rather have seen a normal season play out - HTDs where we get to meet families, more one on one dates where we see more of the top 6 guys, travelling somewhere cool for the FDs, etc. There's so much genuine angst for all 3 of our main characters, it's not too fun to watch and it basically has to carry through to the end now. There ' s a reason such a crazy situation needs a tight structure. I'm not sure why the producers let up a bit and Kaitlyn had so much more freedom, obviously it didn't work and she used it very unwisely. I hope they go back to a tight leash format.

relaxing wrote:

Longhornfan wrote:

... Snipped to shorten ...

That being said, I have felt all along that Kaitlyn derailed her own season by CHOOSING to sleep with Nick.  From that point on she has been operating out of fear, since she has openly said that she doesn't REGRET what happened - only the timing.  So, I agree with you that Kaitlyn is more worried about how this is going to affect HER right now, and that is why she refused to come clean with the guys any earlier.  She even said that her biggest fear was ending up with no one at the end of this show.

I have wondered what this season would have been like, had she not had sex with Nick that early in the process.  How would that have changed the entire direction of the season if she had used some common sense and restraint and just dated all the guys - kept each relationship on an even playing field?  At this point all I see is Kaitlyn reacting and putting out fires - fires that she herself started.

Well said. This is exactly how I feel too.  I'm a fan of Kaitlyn and Shawn and rooting for them but I would much rather have seen a normal season play out - HTDs where we get to meet families, more one on one dates where we see more of the top 6 guys, travelling somewhere cool for the FDs, etc.  There's so much genuine angst for all 3 of our main characters, it's not too fun to watch and it basically has to carry through to the end now.  There ' s a reason such a crazy situation needs a tight structure.  I'm not sure why the producers let up a bit and Kaitlyn had so much more freedom, obviously it didn't work and she used it very unwisely.  I hope they go back to a tight leash format.

I do like Nick, but I wish that Kaitlyn had declined to let him join the show when they met up in New York.  He would have left knowing that he had put forth the effort, but that she did not want to upset the guys that she had already developed strong feelings for, and I think that Nick would have been okay with it.  He might have been disappointed with her decision, but he would have had an answer, one that would have spared all of them a lot of grief.  They might have even been able to continue their friendship somewhere down the road.

And, I wish that I could get behind this couple, Kaitlyn and Shawn, but things this season have just been too messy and tawdry for me.  I am not liking the Shawn that they are showing to me each week either, but he has certainly given them plenty to work with, when it comes to the edit.

I believe that I saw somewhere that Shawn resembles a past boyfriend of hers, so maybe he is Kaitlyn's "type", and she continues to gravitate toward guys like him.  I personally see nothing attractive about Shawn - especially from the neck up.  But, it isn't just his looks that I am not attracted to.  It is his brooding and seemingly angry personality that turns me off the most.

Anyway, it appears that they are still together as of this weekend.  So, time will tell.

Longhornfan wrote:

MiaHawk wrote:I've watched this show for years and know all about the splice n dice editing, but...

When K talked to S (during his many freak outs) her facial expression didn't show much empathy or caring for him. It was more her being worried that her 'cat was out if the bag'.

When K talked to N (at RC) her facial expression, again, didn't show much empathy or caring for him. She was just interested in finding out exactly what N had told the other guys.

She was worried about S's reaction, but was it concern for S's feelings? Or concern for herself having to go through the uncomfortable explanation? Or the fear that one of her favorites would leave the show? IDK, to me, it seems like more of a concern for her own discomfort with having to explain herself to the guys and S, than a concern of hurting the man she's falling in love with. I am really curious to see what emotion she will show during the scene where she tells S the truth.

I felt badly for N is that pre RC scene. I think he shed those tears out of feeling like a misjudged and used fool. He said, "I had a nice time" in reference to their sex, and then said he was scared of a repeat of last season (thinking he was F1 but being let go after sex). It was as if, "Didn't you have a great time?" Or "Do you now regret the sex?" Was what he was actually saying.  To me, it was kind of a role reversal scene, where the one who is in the more vulnerable position (typically the woman) is feeling like he was used and now the user wants nothing to do with him. If I saw K's flat affect looking back at me in that situation, you better bet I would be feeling like I was used. She didn't look at him with empathy or love. It was basically the FRC part one. Can't believe the spoiler that he actually proposes to her!

To me, they just seem like a trio of self serving individuals, and not people who are caring about anyone elses feelings. I feel this about Nick slightly less than the others.  S is just a bag of nerves in love with the idea of love, moreso than K, cuz he doesnt even know her. K more in love with the idea of the strapping young man who smells good, but willing to sleep with the other guy who makes her feel desired.

Wondering what exactly was visible in this K/S snapchat everyone is talking about? What did it show? Is in available for viewing somewhere?

It's hard for me to fathom this ends well. Jmho.

LOVE this post!!!  I agree with everything that you wrote.  When we are able to look at these three people (K,S,N) on this show as characters and can remain neutral, it makes cutting through all this bullsh*t a whole lot easier.  But, once we pick a favorite, it becomes that much harder to see the big picture.

That being said, I have felt all along that Kaitlyn derailed her own season by CHOOSING to sleep with Nick.  From that point on she has been operating out of fear, since she has openly said that she doesn't REGRET what happened - only the timing.  So, I agree with you that Kaitlyn is more worried about how this is going to affect HER right now, and that is why she refused to come clean with the guys any earlier.  She even said that her biggest fear was ending up with no one at the end of this show.

I have wondered what this season would have been like, had she not had sex with Nick that early in the process.  How would that have changed the entire direction of the season if she had used some common sense and restraint and just dated all the guys - kept each relationship on an even playing field?  At this point all I see is Kaitlyn reacting and putting out fires - fires that she herself started.

I am in total agreement with you! She is completely operating from a place of fear. Imo, the sex messed up the entire process.

It really makes me wonder how her journey would have been different if she had not engaged in sex at this early stage.  Would she still have chosen Shawn?  IMO her feelings for Nick became overshadowed by the pre-FS sex and she was never able to fully explore them after her fears about what Shawn would think about the situation dominated her thought process.  It likely was all that she thought about from that point on.  Does that mean that her fear about telling Shawn was her indicator that her relationship with him was the most important one?  Or could it have been that she was most fearful about telling him because he was so invested in her and she hated to think about hurting him?  IMO, this fear led her to push Nick out of her mind and not consider their relationship fully. IMO, she sold herself (and Nick) short.