Bachelor New Zealand - Art Green - Episode Discussion - *Sleuthing* - *Spoilers*

Guess we will find out in two weeks time. We all have different perspectives and that is what makes it interesting  :Nod:

The only edit I personally focus on is the one they show and the s/caps (especially post-show ITMs) and not what is left on the edit cutting floor (it's left there because it doesn't serve the story of F1).

This is first season and just as Bach Aussie S2 and Bach Can S2, I sleuthed that the story they were showing was the F1 story (Sam and April). I had my doubts because they would start to show all these other possible F1-contenders but that is how it always is with this show this past year.

This past year on every franchise I have watched (Bach Aussie, Bach Can, and TBUSA) all of the F1s were the obvious edit (definition of such being the F1 actually saying things like "I definitely 100% see myself with him" - Matilda and "I am engaged to Chris Soules" - Whitney, etc). I see the same with TBNZ S1. My doubt on this board has always been based on SM activity and post-show activity, and not based on the show itself.

If Matilda is not F1 then I was tricked by the edit that I personally see (emphasis on personally) and what my personal process of deduction is determining.

Bach Aussie S2 and Bach Can S2 there were no spoilers and no RS so I am just using the same reasoning I applied to those seasons and applying it to Bach NZ S1. It may work out it may not. Time will tell.

JMO as always.

It's easy to say the edit is showing us who the F1 is after the show has ended.
What may appear obvious to some, is not obvious to others, and they see the obvious as being something totally different

I don't think the majority of posters were saying because of the edit, it was obvious Chris was the F1 instead of Brooks, Arie instead of Jef, Ed instead of Reid, Roberto instead of Chris, and on and on.

I personally don't think a decision can be made on edit alone, but that's just me. I like to consider many factors before I form an opinion, and sometimes it's not till the the very end.

I was very surprised after epi 1 there already were calls for who the F1 was going to be. I believe it was Alysha at that time.

It will be interesting ATFR to look back and analyze everything post show.

agreed.
For me this show starts to be interesting at F8. It is a waste of time before that. Useless 1:1 and group dates with girls the lead generally do not care much but are meant to date to hide the top 6.
It is well known that the lead have a good idea who will be the top 6 at M&G. Among those 6, he probably has 3 or 4 strong crushes, physical and emotional. Everything else is sugar coat.
I would be way more interested if the number of girls started at 12 at episode 2 or 3. Then they could concentrate on more 1:1 with the top 6 and we could see the real evolution vs useless group dates.
Okay.. will never happen, but it is nice to say it anyway

At this point, I still believe alysha is F1. IF (big fat IF) Dani was the one, I would he pleased because I like the girl but also because I think they would match as GF/BF. They both need to mature and they have physicial chemistry from the get go. But I do not see it to happen. I saw his body language changing with Alysha. He is softer, protective, he is reaching her all the time, thing that he does not do with the others. To forgive her to be married was a big sign that he is already engaged emotionally. We all agreed that NZ are reserved people, that showing physical feelings is not the norm. Arthur was raised with 6 sisters and he has  strong family values. If it bothered him she was married, she would have taken the place of crystal. But he choose to present a married woman to his family...

How come arthur never made a move before the 2nd 1:1 with matilda. It was crystal clear that they had a good friendship until then. He never made any effort to push the boundaries with her. it makes no sense that turning 50 times around the pond, he suddenly discovered that she was the one from the start. Matilda body language begged for a kiss, IMO it was quite impossible to ignore it. He also said that because of her whist they were limited. I wonder if initially they were supposed to have some physical date. Physical date means no F1 in my book.

and again... who did not have much physical date? Alysha.

I am not fond of Alysha. The edits did not make me like her at all. Plus she came late on the show for me. She never stood out during group dates and I thought the winery date really tame and boring as well as the volcano 2nd date.

Anyway. If this is Matilda. As long as they are both happy GF/BF and they are still together in 2-3 months, then go go go! I am not fond of her awe and omg all the time but I am okay whomever will be F1

If this is poppy, I will drop from my chair laughing out loud!

After Episode 1 calls for F1 were Matilda by most on the board. After episode 3-4 was there thought based on SM activity on IG that Alysha may be the hidden F1. That debate if Alysha may be F1 along with Dani and Poppy also being F1 continues and the early call by the majority on this board that these four would be F4 is interesting since it proved accurate by those who differ on who the F1 may be. So there was some consensus early on about who may be in top 4.

Until the show ends, I cannot say I know anything even if I say I don't have doubts based on the show itself and how I only see it. I can only post what I personally see and I've been up and down between Matilda and Alysha. When I say "shown" I am only referring to what I see shown, not what is reality or true or correct. It can and may indeed be completely wrong. Everything is ultimately filtered through my own lens. Try as I might, I am susceptible to that and it may indeed turn out that Matilda is not F1. That is okay.

For me, it is ultimately an interesting experiment when analyzing what one sees through one's own eyes adding in SM activity, other viewpoints, comparing to other franchises (and their seasons, etc). I am personally interested to find out if TBNZ will be similar to BachCan S2 and BachAussie S2 since I am analyzing it in the exact same way and thus am looking for very similar things to be highlighted on TBNZ as these two shows/seasons.

If it is similar, then I think there may be some pattern there or maybe not. For example, Sam and Blake had their own "theme music" as do Art and Matilda from the first episode until the most recent they get the same music riff that Mura was able to sleuth. I did find it interesting to note that Art said that he was given the first episode of Bach Aussie S2 to watch before filming.

So for me, if this is a similarity between the two shows edits which point to F1 it will be interesting and not that surprising to me since these shows are still in their infancy compared to TBUSA. They could be totally different and have "theme music" for the non-F1 which will be very surprising to me and an interesting take for a first season of this show. It will also show me if they were going for a shocking ending or for one where the viewers favorite early on (Matilda) and again now after the recent episode is what the end result is. Based on what Katiebelle who lives in NZ and has shared on this board, she doesn't see how this show will end in a shock and be taken well by the public. I can see how that is probably true so if there is a shock and bad ending I don't see that boding well for a possible second season happening.

AllAboutLove wrote:After Episode 1 calls for F1 were Matilda by most on the board. After episode 3-4 was there thought based on SM activity on IG that Alysha may be the hidden F1. That debate if Alysha may be F1 along with Dani and Poppy also being F1 continues and the early call by the majority on this board that these four would be F4 is interesting since it proved accurate by those who differ on who the F1 may be. So there was some consensus early on about who may be in top 4.

Until the show ends, I cannot say I know anything even if I say I don't have doubts based on the show itself and how I only see it. I can only post what I personally see and I've been up and down between Matilda and Alysha. When I say "shown" I am only referring to what I see shown, not what is reality or true or correct. It can and may indeed be completely wrong. Everything is ultimately filtered through my own lens. Try as I might, I am susceptible to that and it may indeed turn out that Matilda is not F1. That is okay.

For me, it is ultimately an interesting experiment when analyzing what one sees through one's own eyes adding in SM activity, other viewpoints, comparing to other franchises (and their seasons, etc). I am personally interested to find out if TBNZ will be similar to BachCan S2 and BachAussie S2 since I am analyzing it in the exact same way and thus am looking for very similar things to be highlighted on TBNZ as these two shows/seasons.

If it is similar, then I think there may be some pattern there or maybe not. For example, Sam and Blake had their own "theme music" as do Art and Matilda from the first episode until the most recent they get the same music riff that Mura was able to sleuth. I did find it interesting to note that Art said that he was given the first episode of Bach Aussie S2 to watch before filming.

So for me, if this is a similarity between the two shows edits which point to F1 it will be interesting and not that surprising to me since these shows are still in their infancy compared to TBUSA. They could be totally different and have "theme music" for the non-F1 which will be very surprising to me and an interesting take for a first season of this show. It will also show me if they were going for a shocking ending or for one where the viewers favorite early on (Matilda) and again now after the recent episode is what the end result is. Based on what Katiebelle who lives in NZ and has shared on this board, she doesn't see how this show will end in a shock and be taken well by the public. I can see how that is probably true so if there is a shock and bad ending I don't see that boding well for a possible second season happening.

The Nz viewing public is incredibly invested in a happy ending for this show.  You have all seen the SM activity showing the adoration for the show and the contestants. It will not go down well if he is now seeing his ex, has a new girlfriend or stopped seeing the F1 as past rumors have stated.

As for guessing the F1 - I'm mainly looking at the edits as I have never watched this show before and do not trust the SM activity.

From what I have seen I think the final 2 are Matilda and Alysha. I didn't think Alyshas edit on the last episode shone her in a good light (I thought she came across as quite sulky) and I don't think the producers would do this to an F1.  Wouldn't the producers want the audience to like the F1? The edit they are doing doesn't make her very likeable. Does anyone on this forum want her as F1?

So therefore, based on the editing I think Matilda is more likely to be F1 because her "story" involves laughter, teasing, joking and romance - all the things that make an audience want to root for her. They have made her more likeable than Alysha.

AllAboutLove wrote:Guess we will find out in two weeks time. We all have different perspectives and that is what makes it interesting  :Nod:

The only edit I personally focus on is the one they show and the s/caps (especially post-show ITMs) and not what is left on the edit cutting floor (it's left there because it doesn't serve the story of F1).

This is first season and just as Bach Aussie S2 and Bach Can S2, I sleuthed that the story they were showing was the F1 story (Sam and April). I had my doubts because they would start to show all these other possible F1-contenders but that is how it always is with this show this past year.

This past year on every franchise I have watched (Bach Aussie, Bach Can, and TBUSA) all of the F1s were the obvious edit (definition of such being the F1 actually saying things like "I definitely 100% see myself with him" - Matilda and "I am engaged to Chris Soules" - Whitney, etc). I see the same with TBNZ S1. My doubt on this board has always been based on SM activity and post-show activity, and not based on the show itself.

If Matilda is not F1 then I was tricked by the edit that I personally see (emphasis on personally) and what my personal process of deduction is determining.

Bach Aussie S2 and Bach Can S2 there were no spoilers and no RS so I am just using the same reasoning I applied to those seasons and applying it to Bach NZ S1. It may work out it may not. Time will tell.

JMO as always.

I'm with you on all the above AAL

AllAboutLove wrote:After Episode 1 calls for F1 were Matilda by most on the board. After episode 3-4 was there thought based on SM activity on IG that Alysha may be the hidden F1. That debate if Alysha may be F1 along with Dani and Poppy also being F1 continues and the early call by the majority on this board that these four would be F4 is interesting since it proved accurate by those who differ on who the F1 may be. So there was some consensus early on about who may be in top 4.

Until the show ends, I cannot say I know anything even if I say I don't have doubts based on the show itself and how I only see it. I can only post what I personally see and I've been up and down between Matilda and Alysha. When I say "shown" I am only referring to what I see shown, not what is reality or true or correct. It can and may indeed be completely wrong. Everything is ultimately filtered through my own lens. Try as I might, I am susceptible to that and it may indeed turn out that Matilda is not F1. That is okay.

For me, it is ultimately an interesting experiment when analyzing what one sees through one's own eyes adding in SM activity, other viewpoints, comparing to other franchises (and their seasons, etc). I am personally interested to find out if TBNZ will be similar to BachCan S2 and BachAussie S2 since I am analyzing it in the exact same way and thus am looking for very similar things to be highlighted on TBNZ as these two shows/seasons.

If it is similar, then I think there may be some pattern there or maybe not. For example, Sam and Blake had their own "theme music" as do Art and Matilda from the first episode until the most recent they get the same music riff that Mura was able to sleuth. I did find it interesting to note that Art said that he was given the first episode of Bach Aussie S2 to watch before filming.

So for me, if this is a similarity between the two shows edits which point to F1 it will be interesting and not that surprising to me since these shows are still in their infancy compared to TBUSA. They could be totally different and have "theme music" for the non-F1 which will be very surprising to me and an interesting take for a first season of this show. It will also show me if they were going for a shocking ending or for one where the viewers favorite early on (Matilda) and again now after the recent episode is what the end result is. Based on what Katiebelle who lives in NZ and has shared on this board, she doesn't see how this show will end in a shock and be taken well by the public. I can see how that is probably true so if there is a shock and bad ending I don't see that boding well for a possible second season happening.

bold

See. I noticed also the music with dani from the start with arthur first preview ep1 and later when they were both together. .... It was not that clear with the other and the only reason is because I focused on dani. So we see and hear better with our favorite definitely

dani mentioned that she watched so many times all bachelor frachise too. matilda and dani follow sam, louise and bach au. I think NZ are very influenced with australia TV.... the same way canadian are influenced with US TV. I would not be surprised considering the roots that they have a lot of UK shows too (assuming). NZ is not a big country and katiebelle said that young people go on AU and return to settle down around 30. I am sure visa is not an issue and they have agreement to work etc. So the AU influence or reference is for me quite logical.

with all due respect with katiebelle, she is not the only one NZ and it is one opinion based as a newbie watching this franchise for the first time (even if she discusses it with a small group of friends , I do not think we should generalize the all nation thinking the same). Do not get me wrong, her knowledge about her culture is definitely a plus but I am sorry, I will not take for a done deal what may happen at the finale based on one opinion, even a few. Because a girl has a bit fan base or because few fan manifest very loudly their love on SM or forum do not mean that she will be F1 and we should not take this loud love as a proof that she is the one based on that. I will always cringe when I read "everyone says" or "all auckland says" etc. few opinions, even a big majority, remain opinions and holly wishes. the only one who knows for sure are the people involved, probably the top 6, family and crew.

I do not deny mathilda is a favorite and I think her big attraction to the public is that she is a very normal girl, pretty, not sexy, who love to cook and have family values. Her persona edited (lets remember the edits please) show her as the perfect daughter, the girl every teen should take as example etc She has a bit of sassy and sarcasm if you listen her ITM and RC but this is not overly heavy to destroy the perfect image of the perfect girl that every mother would be proud to welcome in their family. Mathilda is the symbol of THE ultimate sweet girl. If her intro did not mention cooking but lets say charity work, I bet fans would line up with a wedding dress at the end of episode 1 and may ask arthur deportation for not picking her (IF she is not the one). They cast her well for the 10-25 year public to represent them. I am a bit afraid of the "perfect on paper" edits

All I am saying is that edits can say anything but at the end of the day, again, arthur decided who he wanted, not the fans.

I want to give a shout out  & a to all the sleuthers & special shout out to AAL; despite everyone having a favorite, the sleuthing has been quite objective. IMO the edits can be looked at outside the lens of one's favorite. Case in point was Chris Soule's BACH US's season, there were quite a few Becca fans that openly declared that no way Becca was F1 & that was a tricky one because Chris was edited to be chasing Becca. The clue was to focus on Becca & take Chris out of the equation. Similarly during Des's season, she was edited to be all over Brooks but if one looked closely the love story shown was with Chris & yes some folks picked this up all credit to Mura for leading the troops on that.

My notion is that yes the edits can lead you to the F1 if one takes the blinders off IMO & credit to sleuthers that are able to do this season after season

question to ponder: why did we dismiss Poppy so quickly again?

I won't categorically say that Poppy is dismissed. Based on edits only there is little story line that we have been shown between Poppy & Art but she also fits the description of his ideal girl so I personally won't be shocked if she is F1. When you factor SM into it, she is high on the rumor mill as potential F1. The girl he has described in interviews fits more with Dani, Matilda or Poppy based on the personalities we were shown.

The one person that will surprise me if she is F1 is Alysha just because the Art we have been shown around her is just not the fun & dorky person he has said he is. But if Art chooses Alysha, then again it won't be shocking because the edits show him chasing her also. I will just wonder if they truly fit & wish them the best

Chrystal said (on her TV3) interview that the one criticism she has of Art was he wanted to be nice to everyone instead of just cutting girls & man up to tell them why they were not ideal for him. HEA I think you made this point as well before & I agree. The best I have seen Art articulate this was when he told Matilda he knows what he wants & he just wanted to figure out if any of the girls fit what he wanted. He could have done this way sooner IMO but probably producers influenced him keeping some girls around when they should have been cut earlier.

HEA wrote:question to ponder: why did we dismiss Poppy so quickly again?

This girl can only hope! #teampoppy

Has Poppy been on a date every episode?