Re: Nick Viall - Bachelorette 10 Contestant - Spoilers - Discussion - Thread #5

[MiaHawk]

After last night's episode, I feel like a woman without a country.    
Where do I post without annoying someone else?   :hidingchair
 
I personally don't see Andi choosing Chris, so I feel like I cannot post in the Chris threads.
I personally don't feel warm and fuzzy about Josh, so I feel like I cannot post in the Josh threads.
I personally believe the spoilers.  I think she did choose Josh.  But....I see Nick as a guy who is head over heels in love, who is going to be heartbroken at FRC.

It is always difficult at this time of the season to watch the train go off the tracks.
I cried during Nick's HTD because I could see the true emotion he feels towards Andi, and it will be difficult to see him be blindsided.  I hope I see Andi begin to pull back from him in the next episodes.  If she truly is set on Josh, why lead Nick on even more.  I know, I know, it is the premise of the show and Andi is a good little soldier.  It's just so difficult to watch people get crushed, especially when I can see that they do have deep feelings for the lead.  Bubble or not, I see that Nick is in love with Andi.  I also believe that Andi was in love with Nick (as well as Josh) but something tipped the scales in favor of Josh.

Could it all be part of an elaborate foiler campaign?  Maybe.  I've been known to believe in the concept of foilers.  The thing that makes me feel that it is spoiler rather than foiler is the Murray family involvement in it.  I see them as a competitive family through and through.  If Josh was F2, I don't see them as willing participants in this foiler, at all.  I could see Nick, sarcastic and sneaky, going along with TPTB's idea, but I cannot imagine Josh and his family.  I think that the Murray's would circle their wagons around Josh and be done with it all by now.

But what do I know.  I don't read media, SM, or sleuth.  I watch the show, read this board, and go with my gut.  I knew she'd never pick sexy sweetheart Marcus, but I enjoyed watching his journey.  And even though I do think that Nick is smug, I see him as invested, open, vulnerable, and in love with Andi.  I have witnessed the transformation of Nick.  Never bought into the villain edit, just the smirky (perhaps) over-confidence in their relationship as being better than the other guys.  And even if he ends up as F2, there is a part of me that still thinks that he was right--he and Andi did have the best relationship---it's just that Andi saw something in a future with Josh that she felt she couldn't get with Nick, and she was willing to bet on the future potential of that relationship and choose Josh.  JMHO.      

Mia, you have been one of this the whole time.  Sdmom and I don't want her to pick Nick, and others have doubt, but it is fun to discuss Nick here.

I am torn between all the SM and the Murrays being haha, we are F1 and yahoo, we are the next bachelor.

Either way Nick is happy, so I am happy and glad we got to meet all of her F4.  I would have been happier with a different ette, but hey the guys liked her so maybe she isn't so bad.

  
Sometimes I feel Andi is not good enough for Nick who deserves someone who loves, respect, support and cherish him wholeheartedly ....Her grumpy face and downward turned lips are really not attractive at all.... :hidingchair 

When I saw Sabel on HTD, I thought "Oh, he is attracted to Andi's grumpy lips because she reminds him of Sabel".   

[Beagle]

After last night's episode, I feel like a woman without a country.    
Where do I post without annoying someone else?   :hidingchair
 
I personally don't see Andi choosing Chris, so I feel like I cannot post in the Chris threads.
I personally don't feel warm and fuzzy about Josh, so I feel like I cannot post in the Josh threads.
I personally believe the spoilers.  I think she did choose Josh.  But....I see Nick as a guy who is head over heels in love, who is going to be heartbroken at FRC.

It is always difficult at this time of the season to watch the train go off the tracks.
I cried during Nick's HTD because I could see the true emotion he feels towards Andi, and it will be difficult to see him be blindsided.  I hope I see Andi begin to pull back from him in the next episodes.  If she truly is set on Josh, why lead Nick on even more.  I know, I know, it is the premise of the show and Andi is a good little soldier.  It's just so difficult to watch people get crushed, especially when I can see that they do have deep feelings for the lead.  Bubble or not, I see that Nick is in love with Andi.  I also believe that Andi was in love with Nick (as well as Josh) but something tipped the scales in favor of Josh.

Could it all be part of an elaborate foiler campaign?  Maybe.  I've been known to believe in the concept of foilers.  The thing that makes me feel that it is spoiler rather than foiler is the Murray family involvement in it.  I see them as a competitive family through and through.  If Josh was F2, I don't see them as willing participants in this foiler, at all.  I could see Nick, sarcastic and sneaky, going along with TPTB's idea, but I cannot imagine Josh and his family.  I think that the Murray's would circle their wagons around Josh and be done with it all by now.

But what do I know.  I don't read media, SM, or sleuth.  I watch the show, read this board, and go with my gut.  I knew she'd never pick sexy sweetheart Marcus, but I enjoyed watching his journey.  And even though I do think that Nick is smug, I see him as invested, open, vulnerable, and in love with Andi.  I have witnessed the transformation of Nick.  Never bought into the villain edit, just the smirky (perhaps) over-confidence in their relationship as being better than the other guys.  And even if he ends up as F2, there is a part of me that still thinks that he was right--he and Andi did have the best relationship---it's just that Andi saw something in a future with Josh that she felt she couldn't get with Nick, and she was willing to bet on the future potential of that relationship and choose Josh.  JMHO.      

I feel the same way. After last night my heart broke a little more for Nick. I know Marcus is doing well, Chris will be the next Bachelor, so I don't feel as sad for him, I feel pretty sure Josh is F1, so where does that leave Nick? I cant post these feelings on his fan thread because as much as I think Nick is the one that has the real deep connection with Andi (to me he is what Chris S. is to Des) Andi will end up going with the familiar UGA jock that has the most in common with her lifestyle. Sorry, I just don't see the depth of that relationship, its nothing against Josh, I just see so much more understanding of each other when she is with Nick.

[nutty1]

What I am asking is how those who think Nick is F1 can explain the Snapchat?

Unfortunately, I don't know anything about snap chat so I don't know that I can explain.  Can you fake a snapchat account? I know you can fake other SM accounts.  What I meant in my previous post was that I thought the timing of Josh tweeting about the high amount of requests he was receiving after RS posted about it seemed odd.  If I was Josh, I would have remained silent and not said anything about it.  It just basically gave RS even more credence  and who would want to do that.  I think all SM clues between Josh and his family has been overly blatant anyway. Kind of annoying IMO.   I guess I  don't know what to think as to whether Nick would be F1 or not  - my heart wants him to be, my head tells me he's not.

RS displayed Josh's Snapchat favorites screen. His second most snap chatted person was Andi Dorfman. We all agreed it was Josh's real one because of Josh's tweet about getting bombarded with requests. But the question always has been if it was really Andi's. Some say she'd never use her real name, especially as a lawyer. I know nothing of Snapchat but I always wondered how "Andi's" name appeared there. Why would Josh go along with a foiler.....unless he was the next lead and is already playing their game.

[happygolucky]

MiaHawk ... I quote you all (especially the post above about Sabel  )

Sdmom, stuckinsc ... I'm your silent partner. I don't really feel she is The One. But as said, for Nick's sake, I continue to have hope for him and his choice.

[MiaHawk]

After last night's episode, I feel like a woman without a country.    
Where do I post without annoying someone else?   :hidingchair
 
I personally don't see Andi choosing Chris, so I feel like I cannot post in the Chris threads.
I personally don't feel warm and fuzzy about Josh, so I feel like I cannot post in the Josh threads.
I personally believe the spoilers.  I think she did choose Josh.  But....I see Nick as a guy who is head over heels in love, who is going to be heartbroken at FRC.

It is always difficult at this time of the season to watch the train go off the tracks.
I cried during Nick's HTD because I could see the true emotion he feels towards Andi, and it will be difficult to see him be blindsided.  I hope I see Andi begin to pull back from him in the next episodes.  If she truly is set on Josh, why lead Nick on even more.  I know, I know, it is the premise of the show and Andi is a good little soldier.  It's just so difficult to watch people get crushed, especially when I can see that they do have deep feelings for the lead.  Bubble or not, I see that Nick is in love with Andi.  I also believe that Andi was in love with Nick (as well as Josh) but something tipped the scales in favor of Josh.

Could it all be part of an elaborate foiler campaign?  Maybe.  I've been known to believe in the concept of foilers.  The thing that makes me feel that it is spoiler rather than foiler is the Murray family involvement in it.  I see them as a competitive family through and through.  If Josh was F2, I don't see them as willing participants in this foiler, at all.  I could see Nick, sarcastic and sneaky, going along with TPTB's idea, but I cannot imagine Josh and his family.  I think that the Murray's would circle their wagons around Josh and be done with it all by now.

But what do I know.  I don't read media, SM, or sleuth.  I watch the show, read this board, and go with my gut.  I knew she'd never pick sexy sweetheart Marcus, but I enjoyed watching his journey.  And even though I do think that Nick is smug, I see him as invested, open, vulnerable, and in love with Andi.  I have witnessed the transformation of Nick.  Never bought into the villain edit, just the smirky (perhaps) over-confidence in their relationship as being better than the other guys.  And even if he ends up as F2, there is a part of me that still thinks that he was right--he and Andi did have the best relationship---it's just that Andi saw something in a future with Josh that she felt she couldn't get with Nick, and she was willing to bet on the future potential of that relationship and choose Josh.  JMHO.      

I feel the same way. After last night my heart broke a little more for Nick. I know Marcus is doing well, Chris will be the next Bachelor, so I don't feel as sad for him, I feel pretty sure Josh is F1, so where does that leave Nick? I cant post these feelings on his fan thread because as much as I think Nick is the one that has the real deep connection with Andi (to me he is what Chris S. is to Des) Andi will end up going with the familiar UGA jock that has the most in common with her lifestyle. Sorry, I just don't see the depth of that relationship, its nothing against Josh, I just see so much more understanding of each other when she is with Nick.

We are on the same page then. I see Andi and Nick's relationship as being the most mature. Maybe that 's because Nick has done a good job of articulating his feelings and thoughts thus far. Maybe It's just the editing.

I don't get the "athlete lifestyle". I don't get that your parents and siblings and their SOs would be expected to fly to a different city each weekend to watch your brother essentially do his job. Nobody comes to my place of employment to watch me work. Why would that be expected from his family every single weekend? When you work fulltime or even parttime, weekends are when you get all of your real life stuff done and socialize with friends, family, etc. Aren't these football games broadcast on tv? What is wrong with watching the game on tv? Granted, I do not come from a sports obsessed family. I married a man who is not sports obsessed. I guess I cannot wrap my head around the fact that grown adult siblings would be asked to pay for traveling and take all that time to go watch another grown sibling do his job. If the parents want to do that, fine. But let everyone have their own space to make their own lives.

It seems like this family and Josh belong to the "all or nothing" club. For example, why wouldn't a grown man step foot near a baseball field if baseball was so important to him? Get over yourself, Josh. You spent five years after high school chasing the dream of making it to the big leagues and it did not pan out. He says he quit baseball because of the" lifestyle" and wanting to settle down. At 22 he said this? I call BS. He left because by that time he had spent five years and not achieved the big leagues. He probably saw the writing on the wall, and he left so he could go to college at 22 and get a degree to have a real work a day job. That was probably a smart thing to do. But to shun any contact with the sport for seven years? Seems strange to me. It's like he cannot enjoy the activity of baseball just for the activity that it is. Was it only about the challenge and the dream of being a superstar? Now that he isn't on the pedistal he cannot appreciate it? Or is it that jobody his age in a local league is anywhere near as good as he is, so there is no competition, no challenge, and therefore it is too boring?

IDK, to me, "all or nothing" thinking is unhealthy. Hopefully Josh and Family and Andi can learn to compromise and not expect perfection rrom one another. But from this edited show, I think they might have an uphill battle.

I also don't blame Nick if he is a bit bitter. Hopefully he will move passed it and be happy and find himself the right girl.

[Retiredswimmom]

This is a quote from MiaHawk. "When I saw Sabel on HTD, I thought "Oh, he is attracted to Andi's grumpy lips because she reminds him of Sabel"" [/quote]

I absolutely respect your opinion.  But it's not a fair analogy to neither Sabel nor Andi.  Whether or not you meant for it to be funny.

[Kashathediva]

Discussion threads: all opinions positive and negative regarding cast are welcome as long as site rules are respected.

[happygolucky]

To me it appears as really good sarcastic line. I like Josh, Sable is adorable, I have no problem with Andi ... but her grumpy pout doesn't do her any good. RC is hilarious/irritating to watch just because of that expression. Well anyway, sarcasm can be a double-edged-sword, since it should be sharp and bitter.

[nutty1]

I love how they kept showing Nick's family dog in between saying who each sibling was!   

[beader]

This is a quote from MiaHawk. "When I saw Sabel on HTD, I thought "Oh, he is attracted to Andi's grumpy lips because she reminds him of Sabel"" 

I absolutely respect your opinion.  But it's not a fair analogy to neither Sabel nor Andi.  Whether or not you meant for it to be funny.[/quote]

I agree that it is a put-down to Sabel.  Is she considered cast?   

But we need to get back to Nick--it's his thread.

[Guest]

After last night's episode, I feel like a woman without a country.    
Where do I post without annoying someone else?   :hidingchair
 
I personally don't see Andi choosing Chris, so I feel like I cannot post in the Chris threads.
I personally don't feel warm and fuzzy about Josh, so I feel like I cannot post in the Josh threads.
I personally believe the spoilers.  I think she did choose Josh.  But....I see Nick as a guy who is head over heels in love, who is going to be heartbroken at FRC.

It is always difficult at this time of the season to watch the train go off the tracks.
I cried during Nick's HTD because I could see the true emotion he feels towards Andi, and it will be difficult to see him be blindsided.  I hope I see Andi begin to pull back from him in the next episodes.  If she truly is set on Josh, why lead Nick on even more.  I know, I know, it is the premise of the show and Andi is a good little soldier.  It's just so difficult to watch people get crushed, especially when I can see that they do have deep feelings for the lead.  Bubble or not, I see that Nick is in love with Andi.  I also believe that Andi was in love with Nick (as well as Josh) but something tipped the scales in favor of Josh.

Could it all be part of an elaborate foiler campaign?  Maybe.  I've been known to believe in the concept of foilers.  The thing that makes me feel that it is spoiler rather than foiler is the Murray family involvement in it.  I see them as a competitive family through and through.  If Josh was F2, I don't see them as willing participants in this foiler, at all.  I could see Nick, sarcastic and sneaky, going along with TPTB's idea, but I cannot imagine Josh and his family.  I think that the Murray's would circle their wagons around Josh and be done with it all by now.

But what do I know.  I don't read media, SM, or sleuth.  I watch the show, read this board, and go with my gut.  I knew she'd never pick sexy sweetheart Marcus, but I enjoyed watching his journey.  And even though I do think that Nick is smug, I see him as invested, open, vulnerable, and in love with Andi.  I have witnessed the transformation of Nick.  Never bought into the villain edit, just the smirky (perhaps) over-confidence in their relationship as being better than the other guys.  And even if he ends up as F2, there is a part of me that still thinks that he was right--he and Andi did have the best relationship---it's just that Andi saw something in a future with Josh that she felt she couldn't get with Nick, and she was willing to bet on the future potential of that relationship and choose Josh.  JMHO.      

I feel the same way. After last night my heart broke a little more for Nick. I know Marcus is doing well, Chris will be the next Bachelor, so I don't feel as sad for him, I feel pretty sure Josh is F1, so where does that leave Nick? I cant post these feelings on his fan thread because as much as I think Nick is the one that has the real deep connection with Andi (to me he is what Chris S. is to Des) Andi will end up going with the familiar UGA jock that has the most in common with her lifestyle. Sorry, I just don't see the depth of that relationship, its nothing against Josh, I just see so much more understanding of each other when she is with Nick.

We are on the same page then.  I see Andi and Nick's relationship as being the most mature.  Maybe that 's because Nick has done a good job of articulating his feelings and thoughts thus far.  Maybe It's just the editing.  

I don't get the "athlete lifestyle".  I don't get that your parents and siblings and their SOs would be expected to fly to a different city each weekend to watch your brother essentially do his job.  Nobody comes to my place of employment to watch me work.  Why would that be expected from his family every single weekend?  When you work fulltime or even parttime, weekends are when you get all of your real life stuff done and socialize with friends, family, etc.  Aren't these football games broadcast on tv?  What is wrong with watching the game on tv?  Granted, I do not come from a sports obsessed family.  I married a man who is not sports obsessed.  I guess I cannot wrap my head around the fact that grown adult siblings would be asked to pay for traveling and take all that time to go watch another grown sibling do his job.  If the parents want to do that, fine.  But let everyone have their own space to make their own lives.  

It seems like this family and Josh belong to the "all or nothing" club.  For example, why wouldn't a grown man step foot near a baseball field if baseball was so important to him?  Get over yourself, Josh.  You spent five years after high school chasing the dream of making it to the big leagues and it did not pan out.  He says he quit baseball because of the" lifestyle" and wanting to settle down.  At 22 he said this? I call BS.  He left because by that time he had spent five years and not achieved the big leagues.  He probably saw the writing on the wall, and he left so he could go to college at 22 and get a degree to have a real work a day job. That was probably a smart thing to do.  But to shun any contact with the sport for seven years?  Seems strange to me.  It's like he cannot enjoy the activity of baseball just for the activity that it is.  Was it only about the challenge and the dream of being a superstar?  Now that he isn't on the pedistal he cannot appreciate it?  Or is it that jobody his age in a local league is anywhere near as good as he is, so there is no competition, no challenge, and therefore it is too boring?

IDK, to me, "all or nothing" thinking is unhealthy.  Hopefully Josh and Family and Andi can learn to compromise and not expect perfection rrom one another.  But from this edited show, I think they might have an uphill battle.

I also don't blame Nick if he is a bit bitter.  Hopefully he will move passed it and be happy and find himself the right girl.

He's done that twice. Why can't Josh just say he saw that he wasn't going to make the big leagues so he went back to school? Andi's a smart girl. Surely she is not buying that bs.

Because Nick gets the helicopter/beach date, and before that the tux-prince date, it does seem like he was the F1 up to that point. Nutty, either it's an elaborate foiler campaign or Josh is the F1. That's the only way to explain snapchat for me.

[Guest]

I feel the same way. After last night my heart broke a little more for Nick. I know Marcus is doing well, Chris will be the next Bachelor, so I don't feel as sad for him, I feel pretty sure Josh is F1, so where does that leave Nick? I cant post these feelings on his fan thread because as much as I think Nick is the one that has the real deep connection with Andi (to me he is what Chris S. is to Des) Andi will end up going with the familiar UGA jock that has the most in common with her lifestyle. Sorry, I just don't see the depth of that relationship, its nothing against Josh, I just see so much more understanding of each other when she is with Nick.

We are on the same page then.  I see Andi and Nick's relationship as being the most mature.  Maybe that 's because Nick has done a good job of articulating his feelings and thoughts thus far.  Maybe It's just the editing.  

I don't get the "athlete lifestyle".  I don't get that your parents and siblings and their SOs would be expected to fly to a different city each weekend to watch your brother essentially do his job.  Nobody comes to my place of employment to watch me work.  Why would that be expected from his family every single weekend?  When you work fulltime or even parttime, weekends are when you get all of your real life stuff done and socialize with friends, family, etc.  Aren't these football games broadcast on tv?  What is wrong with watching the game on tv?  Granted, I do not come from a sports obsessed family.  I married a man who is not sports obsessed.  I guess I cannot wrap my head around the fact that grown adult siblings would be asked to pay for traveling and take all that time to go watch another grown sibling do his job.  If the parents want to do that, fine.  But let everyone have their own space to make their own lives.  

It seems like this family and Josh belong to the "all or nothing" club.  For example, why wouldn't a grown man step foot near a baseball field if baseball was so important to him?  Get over yourself, Josh.  You spent five years after high school chasing the dream of making it to the big leagues and it did not pan out.  He says he quit baseball because of the" lifestyle" and wanting to settle down.  At 22 he said this? I call BS.  He left because by that time he had spent five years and not achieved the big leagues.  He probably saw the writing on the wall, and he left so he could go to college at 22 and get a degree to have a real work a day job. That was probably a smart thing to do.  But to shun any contact with the sport for seven years?  Seems strange to me.  It's like he cannot enjoy the activity of baseball just for the activity that it is.  Was it only about the challenge and the dream of being a superstar?  Now that he isn't on the pedistal he cannot appreciate it?  Or is it that jobody his age in a local league is anywhere near as good as he is, so there is no competition, no challenge, and therefore it is too boring?

IDK, to me, "all or nothing" thinking is unhealthy.  Hopefully Josh and Family and Andi can learn to compromise and not expect perfection rrom one another.  But from this edited show, I think they might have an uphill battle.

I also don't blame Nick if he is a bit bitter.  Hopefully he will move passed it and be happy and find himself the right girl.

He's done that twice. Why can't Josh just say he saw that he wasn't going to make the big leagues so he went back to school? Andi's a smart girl. Surely she is not buying that bs.

Because Nick gets the helicopter/beach date, and before that the tux-prince date, it does seem like he was the F1 up to that point. Nutty, either it's an elaborate foiler campaign or Josh is the F1. That's the only way to explain snapchat for me.

So glad someone said this! We've had 2 other baseball player F1's. Neither found the thought of their great passion and talent so upsetting they gave up ever doing it once they moved on to other careers. Josh clearly can't say he gave up being a minor league player because he didn't enjoy it and could see he wasn't going to make it to the majors. I find the story of giving it up due to wanting a simple family lifestyle so tedious and feel a bit sad for him. I do think he really has convinced himself of that story he's telling, since we seem to hear it a lot, and isn't trying to BS Andi, but it comes off sounding really disingenuous. I guess the mentality of serious competitive athletes and the families that produce them is just a bit of a puzzle to me personally. It's too bad he can't look back on that as a great achievement in his life and a fond memory, not an upsetting one.

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