Re: * No Spoilers* The Bachelor 18 FINALE (LCD/MTP/FRC) Discussion- Thread #2

[George1218]

I see things differently.

Why so much anger and blame on CH? Professional? Professional what? He simply asked a question that if I were a woman in Nikki's shoes I would want to know. Does this man that I BLINDLY fell for loves me or not?

IMO, CH was trying to help Nikki (who seems to be terrified of losing JP) get the answer that she has not been able to get for 6 months. Her denial is so strong that she is too afraid to ask in fear that she will be rejected by JP. Nikki has been wondering since the LCD IF JP loves her. That cannot be a good feeling.
No need to displace your disappointment with the show on to CH, production, or editing.
IF the contestants wouldn't do or say certain things, the editing dept would not have these scenarios in the show, would they?

I think the situation is what it IS; Nikki is in blind love willing to take any crumb he throws her way. JP is in the drivers seat (control). Not having strong feelings for her gives him the edge in the relationship, and JP is taking full advantage of this. Hey, maybe he cannot fall in love but wants to. Who knows? The point is that the relationship is one sided and it shows, no spinning it.JP can blame the world, but if he cannot say ILY, it's NOT there. If you feel it the emotion takes over and you have no control to yell ILY!!!

I'm not naïve and when I see a non-committal man, I will call him just that. JP can try to camouflage it using excuses that the whole world is against him. Heck he's even convinced Nikki of it. He needs to own his feelings or lack of them and be a MAN about it.

As for the people on the Bach having sex. Of course they do. That's what people that age do- have sex any chance they get. Lust takes over. Many mistake that for love. Just sayin.

 
When I watched ATFR I saw a couple who were in love and, to me, looked like they were in cahoots together against TPTB.  Nikki has come across, IMO, as a very intelligent woman with a good head on her shoulders.  She even said that as if the situation didn't feel right she would be out of there.

[Litta123]

Thanks Maggenzm, biolalyss and grace! I was happy to supply the screen caps. I haven't made up my mind whether I'll be posting them for Andi on the spoiled side or on this side. Right now I'm leaning on going spoiled -- certainly staying unspoiled didn't help my judgment on F1.   So why not, right?!

[Ariela]

I hope that Nikki is in cahoots with JP and that's what it is because I saw a woman who clung on to what she perceived as "her man". I don't think he's hers, or ever will be.

I give them 1 month before they go their way. She deserves better.
I don't care what sort of game JP is playing with ABC, CH or Nikki. My sixth sense tells me he IS bad news.

I know that the women on WTA sounded like a bunch of scorned women, but now after seeing the show in its' entirety there seemed to have been a pattern-JP is a jerk. If it quacks like a duck...it IS a duck.

[nd4reality]

Thanks Maggenzm, biolalyss and grace! I was happy to supply the screen caps. I haven't made up my mind whether I'll be posting them for Andi on the spoiled side or on this side. Right now I'm leaning on going spoiled -- certainly staying unspoiled didn't help my judgment on F1.   So why not, right?!

Just wanted to add my thanks for the hard work you put in. While I agree staying unspoiled did not help with the judgement (I could not make up my mind even on the day of the finale ) there is a lot less pressure from spoiled folks who jump on the spoiled f1 bandwagon. And yes - that does exist despite those folks vehemently denying it.

This was the first season I went unspoiled also (I tried for Seans and kept away from the board because the non-spoiler side was always too quiet. Ended up not watching the last 4 episodes).
However during Des' season I actually stayed away from the edit threads a bit and focused on the SCs, the behind-the-scenes social media which IMO held more clues than anything. It was the social media and SCs that convinced me 100% that Brooks could not be F1. I wasn't sure that Chris would be - thought she would walk away alone after her being 'in love' with Brooks even prior to HTDs. I knew the Brooks and her real life activities were not synching up and he was listening to depressing songs. He also went on a cruise within weeks of the finale when he should have been spending time with Des. Just a few things that clued me in.
This season we had JP and Nikki both flying simultaneously, scarf-gate.
Being on the non-spoiler section makes it hard to come by the social media stuff because anyone can get spoiled by doing a simple google search. That is the missing piece.
Thanks to the posters    that brought some of the info across to the non-spoiler side. You guys all rock. Though there was no nail in the coffin while sleuthing - we now can assume that scarf-gate was real.

[Maggenzm]

I hope that Nikki is in cahoots with JP and that's what it is because I saw a woman who clung on to what she perceived as "her man".  I don't think he's hers, or ever will be.

I give them 1 month before they go their way. She deserves better.
I don't care what sort of game JP is playing with ABC, CH or Nikki. My sixth sense tells me he IS bad news.

I know that the women on WTA sounded like a bunch of scorned women, but now after seeing the show in its' entirety there seemed to have been a pattern-JP is a jerk. If it quacks like a duck...it IS a duck.

On the 1st bolded, Nikki thinks he is the one for her, so it doesn't really matter what you and I say.
I remember the same line thrown at Des, how she wasn't good enough for Chris, he deserved better than her. Negative opinions didn't change anything for Chris and Des relationship outcome and it is not going to change Juanp and Nikki. It's out of our control. All we can do is wish them the best and see what happen.

I would not be so sure on the 2nd bolded. The most any of us can say is we think they can/can't make it.
You know how many people gave Chris and Des 1 month? It has been over 6 months and it looks like they are actually going to make it. Praise the Lord! Call me a romantic fool. Once the lead makes his decision, I am board whether he was my fave or not.

[Litta123]

Thanks Maggenzm, biolalyss and grace! I was happy to supply the screen caps. I haven't made up my mind whether I'll be posting them for Andi on the spoiled side or on this side. Right now I'm leaning on going spoiled -- certainly staying unspoiled didn't help my judgment on F1.   So why not, right?!

Just wanted to add my thanks for the hard work you put in. While I agree staying unspoiled did not help with the judgement (I could not make up my mind even on the day of the finale ) there is a lot less pressure from spoiled folks who jump on the spoiled f1 bandwagon. And yes - that does exist despite those folks vehemently denying it.

This was the first season I went unspoiled also (I tried for Seans and kept away from the board because the non-spoiler side was always too quiet. Ended up not watching the last 4 episodes).
However during Des' season I actually stayed away from the edit threads a bit and focused on the SCs, the behind-the-scenes social media which IMO held more clues than anything. It was the social media and SCs that convinced me 100% that Brooks could not be F1. I wasn't sure that Chris would be - thought she would walk away alone after her being 'in love' with Brooks even prior to HTDs. I knew the Brooks and her real life activities were not synching up and he was listening to depressing songs. He also went on a cruise within weeks of the finale when he should have been spending time with Des. Just a few things that clued me in.
This season we had JP and Nikki both flying simultaneously, scarf-gate.
Being on the non-spoiler section makes it hard to come by the social media stuff because anyone can get spoiled by doing a simple google search. That is the missing piece.
Thanks to the posters     that brought some of the info across to the non-spoiler side. You guys all rock. Though there was no nail in the coffin while sleuthing - we now can assume that scarf-gate was real.

No problem! I actually enjoyed posting on this side quite a bit. Frankly, there were a lot less arguments -- just real honest discussions (with a few exceptions   ).

What I'd like to know is if there is interest in doing a similar approach for Andi's season. It sounded to me like several people who were regular posters down here are thinking of skipping her season...so part of the reason I'm tempted to go spoiled is because I'd rather not post alone. Kind of pointless, right?   If there's no interest for posting here, I figured I'd get in on Andi's from the start...even though I suck at pre-season sleuthing.

I know it's kind of early for people to make a commitment. I certainly understand the burned out feeling...so perhaps it's too early for some to even consider this question. Is there anyone who wants to sleuth Andi's season unpoiled? If there is enough interest, maybe I'll stick to this side.

[mtnlvr55]

Thanks Maggenzm, biolalyss and grace! I was happy to supply the screen caps. I haven't made up my mind whether I'll be posting them for Andi on the spoiled side or on this side. Right now I'm leaning on going spoiled -- certainly staying unspoiled didn't help my judgment on F1.   So why not, right?!

Just wanted to add my thanks for the hard work you put in. While I agree staying unspoiled did not help with the judgement (I could not make up my mind even on the day of the finale ) there is a lot less pressure from spoiled folks who jump on the spoiled f1 bandwagon. And yes - that does exist despite those folks vehemently denying it.

This was the first season I went unspoiled also (I tried for Seans and kept away from the board because the non-spoiler side was always too quiet. Ended up not watching the last 4 episodes).
However during Des' season I actually stayed away from the edit threads a bit and focused on the SCs, the behind-the-scenes social media which IMO held more clues than anything. It was the social media and SCs that convinced me 100% that Brooks could not be F1. I wasn't sure that Chris would be - thought she would walk away alone after her being 'in love' with Brooks even prior to HTDs. I knew the Brooks and her real life activities were not synching up and he was listening to depressing songs. He also went on a cruise within weeks of the finale when he should have been spending time with Des. Just a few things that clued me in.
This season we had JP and Nikki both flying simultaneously, scarf-gate.
Being on the non-spoiler section makes it hard to come by the social media stuff because anyone can get spoiled by doing a simple google search. That is the missing piece.
Thanks to the posters     that brought some of the info across to the non-spoiler side. You guys all rock. Though there was no nail in the coffin while sleuthing - we now can assume that scarf-gate was real.

No problem! I actually enjoyed posting on this side quite a bit. Frankly, there were a lot less arguments -- just real honest discussions (with a few exceptions   ).

What I'd like to know is if there is interest in doing a similar approach for Andi's season. It sounded to me like several people who were regular posters down here are thinking of skipping her season...so part of the reason I'm tempted to go spoiled is because I'd rather not post alone. Kind of pointless, right?   If there's no interest for posting here, I figured I'd get in on Andi's from the start...even though I suck at pre-season sleuthing.

I know it's kind of early for people to make a commitment. I certainly understand the burned out feeling...so perhaps it's too early for some to even consider this question. Is there anyone who wants to sleuth Andi's season unpoiled? If there is enough interest, maybe I'll stick to this side.

I say we should keep posting on this side--sleuthing is SO much fun!

[nd4reality]

I will possibly join and post a bit. I promised myself a limit to posting so will see if I can keep that promise to myself. But yes, Non-spoiler is it for me if I visit the boards after the FRC filmed.
Particularly with TB'ette, the fangirling is hard to handle.
Being here will keep it more objective.

[quietpal]

I hope that Nikki is in cahoots with JP and that's what it is because I saw a woman who clung on to what she perceived as "her man".  I don't think he's hers, or ever will be.

I give them 1 month before they go their way. She deserves better.
I don't care what sort of game JP is playing with ABC, CH or Nikki. My sixth sense tells me he IS bad news.

I know that the women on WTA sounded like a bunch of scorned women, but now after seeing the show in its' entirety there seemed to have been a pattern-JP is a jerk. If it quacks like a duck...it IS a duck.

On the 1st bolded, Nikki thinks he is the one for her, so it doesn't really matter what you and I say.
I remember the same line thrown at Des, how she wasn't good enough for Chris, he deserved better than her. Negative opinions didn't change anything for Chris and Des relationship outcome and it is not going to change Juanp and Nikki. It's out of our control. All we can do is wish them the best and see what happen.

I would not be so sure on the 2nd bolded. The most any of us can say is we think they can/can't make it.
You know how many people gave Chris and Des 1 month? It has been over 6 months and it looks like they are actually going to make it. Praise the Lord! Call me a romantic fool. Once the lead makes his decision, I am board whether he was my fave or not.

I totally agree Maggenzm! As far as she deserves better, that is according to whom? What the edit chose to show us was a positive relationship between the two of them. He never treated her with anything but respect, and he showed he cared about her by getting her gifts. That's what she knows. As long as they are in agreement about their relationship moving forward, then that's all that matters.

[Maggenzm]

I hope that Nikki is in cahoots with JP and that's what it is because I saw a woman who clung on to what she perceived as "her man".  I don't think he's hers, or ever will be.

I give them 1 month before they go their way. She deserves better.
I don't care what sort of game JP is playing with ABC, CH or Nikki. My sixth sense tells me he IS bad news.

I know that the women on WTA sounded like a bunch of scorned women, but now after seeing the show in its' entirety there seemed to have been a pattern-JP is a jerk. If it quacks like a duck...it IS a duck.

Just read all the posts, and you will see that we all see differently. So, you and I might be dead wrong. Besides, we are spectators, it 's not your life nor mine to live. It's their lives and they chose to spend it together. Will it work? Who know? I have a strong felling it will work. You have a strong feeling it will not work.
Only time will tell.

[Ariela]

Hopefully there is a board running in a couple months on JP and Nikki...........because I think that if he cannot get himself to say ILY by now, it ain't happening, and Nikki is in denial.

Nikki, as a woman, deserves to be treated better. It's not ok to make a woman BEG for love. No self respecting woman would go for that.

[nd4reality]

I hope that Nikki is in cahoots with JP and that's what it is because I saw a woman who clung on to what she perceived as "her man".  I don't think he's hers, or ever will be.

I give them 1 month before they go their way. She deserves better.
I don't care what sort of game JP is playing with ABC, CH or Nikki. My sixth sense tells me he IS bad news.

I know that the women on WTA sounded like a bunch of scorned women, but now after seeing the show in its' entirety there seemed to have been a pattern-JP is a jerk. If it quacks like a duck...it IS a duck.

On the 1st bolded, Nikki thinks he is the one for her, so it doesn't really matter what you and I say.
I remember the same line thrown at Des, how she wasn't good enough for Chris, he deserved better than her. Negative opinions didn't change anything for Chris and Des relationship outcome and it is not going to change Juanp and Nikki. It's out of our control. All we can do is wish them the best and see what happen.

I would not be so sure on the 2nd bolded. The most any of us can say is we think they can/can't make it.
You know how many people gave Chris and Des 1 month? It has been over 6 months and it looks like they are actually going to make it. Praise the Lord! Call me a romantic fool. Once the lead makes his decision, I am board whether he was my fave or not.

I totally agree Maggenzm! As far as she deserves better, that is according to whom? What the edit chose to show us was a positive relationship between the two of them. He never treated her with anything but respect, and he showed he cared about her by getting her gifts. That's what she knows. As long as they are in agreement about their relationship moving forward, then that's all that matters.

I agree. Folks were just as hard on Chris and Des last season but they are attempting a relationship in the real world. None of us have a crystal ball and can predict which couples will make it and which will not.
I never thought that Ali/Roberto, Andy/Tessa and Charlie/Sarah would be kaput. But they were. There are others that I gave a better chance but they barely dated for a few months.
This couple needs the time to figure it out on their own. At least if they do break up - no promises were made to each other in front of any of us so no big deal. They dated, they broke up, their done. In their time.
Rather than multiple fake engagements and the whole I-must-be-engaged at the end of this process like DeAnna and Emily.

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