Re: *NO SPOILERS* The Bachelor 18 Social Media - Twitter etc. Thread

[pbmax]

BTW: Just because he didn't choose my "fave" and I have sour grapes as is a common comment here is completely wrong.  I just think his comment to Clare about loving "f***ing her and the other comment as she was walking away spoke of his character, just because she spoke up to him.  Is that how he handles life??  I am not sour, but am just trying to speak to what he actually did say with the comment above, how he treated Clare at the end, how it seemed from all contestants on the show that he really didn't bother to get to really know anyone.  Hope that Nikki is different.

I think the problem some of us have doesn't relate AT ALL to any "favoritism". I said from the beginning that I didn't care whom he chose. I just happened to see Clare as F1... DURING THE AIRING OF THE SHOW.

We all know The Relationship doesn't begin until AFTER the show, so all of the debate last season over Brooks vs. Chris is ridiculous in hindsight. Desiree decided on a POST-show life with Chris regardless of how many fireworks were shown in Madeira or how many tears (visible or crocodile) were shed in Antigua.

My main struggle with this season was this:

After Ocean Romp, I found it difficult to understand how anybody he chose OVER Clare could watch that without squirming. Perhaps production didn't like Nikki for some reason and decided to push it in her face? Maybe her comment about Clare being a dog who "peed on him first" was a sign that she was OK with his relationship with Clare? Maybe Clare is a lesbian and Nikki had nothing to worry about? I kinda doubt that last scenario. Nikki seems fine post show regardless of what was shown, so my questioning just relates to MY perspective.

One comment by Juan repeated over and over is that he wants a lot of "romance" kept private. So Nikki may have experienced much more than Clare anyway.

Many of us saw a better hometown visit with Clare than Nikki, but there's a catch here. ABC did not post any photos of Nikki's that we could compare with his "heated" shots with Clare and more "friend zone" shots of Renee and Andi. It is possible that his shots with Nikki might have been too revealing.

The fact that Chris Harrison seems to side more with Clare than Juan in much of the questioning regarding Ocean Romp and Helicopter Speech is rather interesting. Was he skeptical of Juan's intentions on this show? Did he feel Juan "played" Clare unfairly? Particularly ominous was how each of Juan's "jury" including Sean and Sharleen were quite hypercritical of Juan's behavior. Usually The Bachelor "Family" is more supportive of the lead. Something peculiar happened this season.

In the end, it is Oh-Kay. It doesn't matter. Either Juan and Nikki will live happily ever after once the cameras are gone or they will break up. It is possible that this WAS a season in which the lead changed his mind very close to the end of the season. I personally do think he got a "red flag" on Clare's LCD that upset the applecart myself... otherwise, she was The One most of the season. However, I wasn't a fly on the wall to know what really happened... and, yes, he may have always wanted Nikki over Clare since Day #1 but was fooling us on screen. Again, as with the Brooks/Chris/Des triangle situation, it doesn't matter if F1 was a "default" or simply "one of two the lead struggled deciding between" since The Relationship begins AFTER the show ends.

To be honest, I did not have a very good "read" on their ATFR body language, so I will hold my breath for a wedding next year. Hard call here...

I would say ocean romp was no problem when you know his repenting that he did it was because of me...since we are on a tv show where he would have to kiss other women. Something Nikki acknowledge that she wasn't the only woman there. Something I think we should keep in mind for future shows...is when the lead does those special things for one.

[JBF]

I am a bit of a prude, so Ocean Romp and Helicopter Speech bothered ME more than it did others. A cluster here have no problem with Juan's behavior, even if/had he "gone all the way" with his F2 and lead her on (not that we will ever know exactly what happened off camera). Guess we all are different in that way.

At least he didn't promise anything with Nikki he couldn't keep. No proposal. No ring. No "I love you". Just a basic let-see-how-things-go setup. For her part, Nikki insisted in episode #1's intro that she will never settle unless she has that head-over-heels-can't-get-enough-of-each-other kind of love. Soooo... if they make it to the altar. Great. If they break up... we certainly won't be in a state of shock. No different than any other couple in this silly franchise.

[eirekay]

I am a bit of a prude, so Ocean Romp and Helicopter Speech bothered ME more than it did others. A cluster here have no problem with Juan's behavior, even if/had he "gone all the way" with his F2 and lead her on (not that we will ever know exactly what happened off camera). Guess we all are different in that way.

I'm not a prude. I still have a problem with both the day and evening portion of the LCD. It has everything to do with respect. If you knew you were dumping her in two days, which I believe JP did - Chelsie says that she knew from the second Group date that it was Nikki - you don't make a comment that marginalizes Clare and turns her into an object, and you certainly don't play a song that leads her to believe she is F1.

[pbmax]

I am a bit of a prude, so Ocean Romp and Helicopter Speech bothered ME more than it did others. A cluster here have no problem with Juan's behavior, even if/had he "gone all the way" with his F2 and lead her on (not that we will ever know exactly what happened off camera). Guess we all are different in that way.

I'm not a prude. I still have a problem with both the day and evening portion of the LCD. It has everything to do with respect. If you knew you were dumping her in two days, which I believe JP did - Chelsie says that she knew from the second Group date that it was Nikki - you don't make a comment that marginalizes Clare and turns her into an object, and you certainly don't play a song that leads her to believe she is F1.

We didn't really see anything of the day potion of the LCD. Just her in ITM saying he whispered some things to her in that "rare" moment that there were no cameras or mic ( when I heard that I laugh) then they're walking up the mountain. TPTB tickle me so. I choose not to believe them.

[eirekay]

We didn't really see anything of the day potion of the LCD. Just her in ITM saying he whispered some things to her in that "rare" moment that there were no cameras or mic ( when I heard that I laugh) then they're walking up the mountain. TPTB tickle me so. I choose not to believe them.

Jason & Molly's podcast had a good explanation for why a cameraman wasn't in the Helicopter at that moment - they thought that the heli probably landed to drop the cameraman off then went up again so that he could film JP and Clare landing which seems plausible to me. You are right - we didn't see anything else from this date so we don't know if they just buzzed the island for an hour, then landed and walked to the hill top and then went back or if there was more to the date. For myself, I have no problem believing the comment was made. Clare's body language as she went up the hill looked reluctant enough to convince me.

[LibbyBell]

As M & J say, they drop the cameraman off so that he can film the helicopter landing BUT would they have taken off their microphones? I don't believe so-- those packs are many times laced up and taped in place; once they are in place, they stay in place until they are removed for the night. As I was re-watching the LCDs, during the night time portion Clare asks Juan Pablo whether he knows her well enough to make the choice. He goes and an talks blah, blah, blah, etc... and then Clare stops him and says-- That's what I need to know, I don't need you to tell me "I like kissing, I like kissing" I need to know other things. IMO, IF he had said I like f-ing you, she would have said it here instead of "I like kissing". IF the statement was so offensive to her, she definitely would have added it to the conversation that she was having with Juan Pablo; no way she would have left it out. Absent plausible video or audio of Juan Pablo actually saying this-- I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt. He is innocent until proven guilty and we ALL know that TPTB can do some pretty good editing; they've done it in the past and I don't doubt that they will continue to do it until they are made to stop. I know some will disagree, I readily admit that this is IMO.

[eliza3]

As M & J say, they drop the cameraman off so that he can film the helicopter landing BUT would they have taken off their microphones? I don't believe so-- those packs are many times laced up and taped in place; once they are in place, they stay in place until they are removed for the night. As I was re-watching the LCDs, during the night time portion Clare asks Juan Pablo whether he knows her well enough to make the choice. He goes and an talks blah, blah, blah, etc... and then Clare stops him and says-- That's what I need to know, I don't need you to tell me "I like kissing, I like kissing" I need to know other things. IMO, IF he had said I like f-ing you, she would have said it here instead of "I like kissing". IF the statement was so offensive to her, she definitely would have added it to the conversation that she was having with Juan Pablo; no way she would have left it out. Absent plausible video or audio of Juan Pablo actually saying this-- I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt. He is innocent until proven guilty and we ALL know that TPTB can do some pretty good editing; they've done it in the past and I don't doubt that they will continue to do it until they are made to stop. I know some will disagree, I readily admit that this is IMO.

I totally agree with you. I remember during Des's season Catherine said something what appeared to be inappropriate (when they covered her mouth with that cloud) I for one initially thought I knew what she had said (sometimes my brain - and I assume others - hears what they THINK someone said) Anyway - Catherine tweeted out that that is not what she said at all. So if TPTB would do that to the golden child Catherine - why wouldn't they do it in this situation?

[LibbyBell]

Thanks eliza  :Biggrin:

[notarose]

We didn't really see anything of the day potion of the LCD. Just her in ITM saying he whispered some things to her in that "rare" moment that there were no cameras or mic ( when I heard that I laugh) then they're walking up the mountain. TPTB tickle me so. I choose not to believe them.

Jason & Molly's podcast had a good explanation for why a cameraman wasn't in the Helicopter at that moment - they thought that the heli probably landed to drop the cameraman off then went up again so that he could film JP and Clare landing which seems plausible to me.  You are right - we didn't see anything else from this date so we don't know if they just buzzed the island for an hour, then landed and walked to the hill top and then went back or if there was more to the date.  For myself, I have no problem believing the comment was made.  Clare's body language as she went up the hill looked reluctant enough to convince me.

She must have just said no cameras because they were wearing mic pacs. I'd have to go back and rewatch the scene.

As to saying something of a sexual nature or other , it was obviously something she found offensive. Sharleen was not offended when JPG bit her lip as example of what 1 woman likes and another doesn't. Continuing on the topic of sex in this season, I believe life partners need to see each other as sexy otherwise a relationship can go platonic over time. Sex is just 1 component in a marriage, for both procreation and pleasure, but it is a necessary component without which you have a friend without benefits. Sexual compatibility includes boundary compatibility - in other words, that you enjoy the same things. Foreplay includes talk that needs to appeal to both parties and that will differ from couple to couple. If someone marries they first sexual partner, they learn together. If both have had a few previous partners, they bring their likes into the new relationship and share.

[docnash14]

As M & J say, they drop the cameraman off so that he can film the helicopter landing BUT would they have taken off their microphones? I don't believe so-- those packs are many times laced up and taped in place; once they are in place, they stay in place until they are removed for the night. As I was re-watching the LCDs, during the night time portion Clare asks Juan Pablo whether he knows her well enough to make the choice. He goes and an talks blah, blah, blah, etc... and then Clare stops him and says-- That's what I need to know, I don't need you to tell me "I like kissing, I like kissing" I need to know other things. IMO, IF he had said I like f-ing you, she would have said it here instead of "I like kissing". IF the statement was so offensive to her, she definitely would have added it to the conversation that she was having with Juan Pablo; no way she would have left it out. Absent plausible video or audio of Juan Pablo actually saying this-- I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt. He is innocent until proven guilty and we ALL know that TPTB can do some pretty good editing; they've done it in the past and I don't doubt that they will continue to do it until they are made to stop. I know some will disagree, I readily admit that this is IMO.

I have posted this tweet by Anna previously but think it's pertinent to your points.

Anna C. Galavis ‏@annagalavis Mar 10

We talk a lot @Clare_Crawley and we know exactly what happend that is why Is a same that our conversation was not on tv #Bachelor how weird?

[Guest]

As M & J say, they drop the cameraman off so that he can film the helicopter landing BUT would they have taken off their microphones? I don't believe so-- those packs are many times laced up and taped in place; once they are in place, they stay in place until they are removed for the night. As I was re-watching the LCDs, during the night time portion Clare asks Juan Pablo whether he knows her well enough to make the choice. He goes and an talks blah, blah, blah, etc... and then Clare stops him and says-- That's what I need to know, I don't need you to tell me "I like kissing, I like kissing" I need to know other things. IMO, IF he had said I like f-ing you, she would have said it here instead of "I like kissing". IF the statement was so offensive to her, she definitely would have added it to the conversation that she was having with Juan Pablo; no way she would have left it out. Absent plausible video or audio of Juan Pablo actually saying this-- I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt. He is innocent until proven guilty and we ALL know that TPTB can do some pretty good editing; they've done it in the past and I don't doubt that they will continue to do it until they are made to stop. I know some will disagree, I readily admit that this is IMO.

Great post LibbyBell. ITA

[Aunties_Love]

We didn't really see anything of the day potion of the LCD. Just her in ITM saying he whispered some things to her in that "rare" moment that there were no cameras or mic ( when I heard that I laugh) then they're walking up the mountain. TPTB tickle me so. I choose not to believe them.

Jason & Molly's podcast had a good explanation for why a cameraman wasn't in the Helicopter at that moment - they thought that the heli probably landed to drop the cameraman off then went up again so that he could film JP and Clare landing which seems plausible to me.  You are right - we didn't see anything else from this date so we don't know if they just buzzed the island for an hour, then landed and walked to the hill top and then went back or if there was more to the date.  For myself, I have no problem believing the comment was made.  Clare's body language as she went up the hill looked reluctant enough to convince me.

Very true, she definately wasn't charging up that slope. Almost like JP was "dragging her". I do believe what Clare has said as we've also seen some not so good moments with JP and other women too so it is quite believeable.

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