Off Topic/Miscellaneous Subjects - Discussion

Kashathediva wrote:IDK--if I want bottled water (and it's generally to carry on a walk/hike or in the car) I buy whatever is on special at the CVS or Shoprite and runs about 3 bucks a case or less if on special. Just me, but I have a lot better things to spend my $ on and still left over to give to a charity.

Around here it gets more complicated. When I needed a case to keep volunteers on a garden project hydrated, I went for the cheap. And geez those bottles are flimsy; wouldn't want one in my purse; wouldn't trust it. But if I'm buying for another reason, and confess I rarely buy bottled water, I do think about the environmental impact (always bad, plastic is the worse) and other ideals like supporting local small businesses, and those that support my charities. Even if on pure dollars and cents direct donations are more efficient, I also think of the economic and environmental impacts. Not every purchase, because sometimes you are just flying through a store, but when I do get the chance I am influenced by how dollars can be more than dollars, and a vote. I have a heavy dislike for cheaper is better, and a heavy dislike for large conglomerate corporations, and vote against that often.

Chacharo wrote:
I hope that cause marketing is not the wave of the future. Bonafide charities are having a hard enough time since the economy tanked and they don't need the competition right now from for-profit businesses using charity as PR.

I don't think it is real competition. It is a way of getting donations from people who otherwise wouldn't donate. It shouldn't affect the decisions made by someone sitting down with a checkbook at all.

Some people never, ever make a direct donation. They attend charity events, buy cause marketed products, and browse silent auctions, but it is like they always need to be a consumer, and never just a quiet donor. I saw a lot of those types when I was working fundraising. It's just different strokes for different folks.

Chacharo wrote:

I don't think comparing the cost of PW to Smart Water really works - Smart Water has electrolytes added for whatever reason - something like Vitamin Water which has made some people very rich (fiddy cents anyone?). I believe I have read somewhere that PW is natural spring water - which brings to mind the question for me of where is it harvested from? I don't really trust bottled water I guess.

It isn't really a direct comparison, obviously. Just an example of how many purchase decisions involve factors far beyond the cheapest way to consume A.

Kashathediva wrote:IDK--if I want bottled water (and it's generally to carry on a walk/hike or in the car) I buy whatever is on special at the CVS or Shoprite and runs about 3 bucks a case or less if on special. Just me, but I have a lot better things to spend my $ on and still left over to give to a charity.

Someone from Utah said if you go in the store to buy a bottle of People Water it is the same price as all the other bottled water, and cheaper than a few. I think someone said either $1.29 a bottle. Maybe someone who remembers that conversation better than me can clarify it.

Kasha I am sorry to hear about your nephew. It sounds like they found a great way to memorialize his life.

In other disclosures, the company has revealed that so far that $8k "prepaid" donation in April 2012 represents the totality of their contributions to well charities.

Just the fact that none of us smart people (at least as smart as typical purchasers, LOL) can parse that blog post shows they are not ready for prime time on cause marketing much less national distribution.

Are they saying that the liters number represents their 6 month production as well? Otherwise drop for drop pledge is all wrong.

An average well delivers approximately 1,000 liters of clean water a day. Based on this estimate, we meet our Drop 4 Drop commitment for that particular well after 6 months. We then look to either drill a new well, repair a well, or establish a purification system at another location. Thus, our Drop 4 Drop initiative is concerned with developing (or restoring) new sources of clean water. After a source has produced water that meets our Drop 4 Drop commitment, we proactively look for a new project. We do not count a well’s residual water output in determining whether we meet our Drop 4 Drop commitment.
I would also like to point out that we are proactive. We try to build a well prior to selling the water that will be associated with that well.

SIX MONTHS = 182 days approximately times 1000 liters per day = 182,000 liters sold at something like $2 per liter (that's quite generous to the estimation, as their retail price online is much higher).

Applying the $2/liter estimate**, Gross revenues for the six months would be $364,000 which sounds about right for their stage of mostly regional distribution. And in that six months, they donated $8,000 to Generosity Water for one well.

So for now, 8k/364k would mean 2% donation rate or perhaps 4 cents of every purchase for last year? If they step up to national distribution, then I suppose they will need to fund wells much more frequently than one every six months.

Today, and thinking about online retail, 24 pack of 500ml/16.9oz sells now for $45 (!!!), that 's a whopping $3.75 per liter, which is outrageous. At those prices, gross revenues would be $682,500, and the $8,000 donation about 1.2%. So that's the range, I guess.

All of which is to say that the blog is a step in the right direction for me, and they should put some of that on the label because it is hardly intuitive from the on-label pledge, which states:

FOR EVERY BOTTLE PURCHASED PEOPLE WATER WILL GIVE AN EQUAL AMOUNT OF CLEAN WATER TO A PERSON IN NEED

So, I guess every time they sell 182,000 liters, this triggers a new donation sufficient to cause an existing well to start producing 1000 liters per day again (following funding of repairs), or alternatively, construction of a new well? Still don't really get it. Sigh. It is not a workable pledge at the purchaser level. It is catchy, but I predict will not survive national distribution and the scrutiny that comes with dealing with national outlets with actual compliance function.

Kimmy wrote:They do put up numbers but people will still read them the way they want to.

Kimmy, have they put up #'s of how many cents per bottle sold they donate? If so, I've missed it and would love to read the document. If you have an article or can direct me to one, I'd appreciate it. TIA!

jlccaz wrote:In other disclosures, the company has revealed that so far that $8k "prepaid" donation in April 2012 represents the totality of their contributions to well charities.

Just the fact that none of us smart people (at least as smart as typical purchasers, LOL) can parse that blog post shows they are not ready for prime time on cause marketing much less national distribution.

Are they saying that the liters number represents their 6 month production as well? Otherwise drop for drop pledge is all wrong.

An average well delivers approximately 1,000 liters of clean water a day. Based on this estimate, we meet our Drop 4 Drop commitment for that particular well after 6 months. We then look to either drill a new well, repair a well, or establish a purification system at another location. Thus, our Drop 4 Drop initiative is concerned with developing (or restoring) new sources of clean water. After a source has produced water that meets our Drop 4 Drop commitment, we proactively look for a new project. We do not count a well’s residual water output in determining whether we meet our Drop 4 Drop commitment.
I would also like to point out that we are proactive. We try to build a well prior to selling the water that will be associated with that well.

SIX MONTHS = 182 days approximately times 1000 liters per day = 182,000 liters sold at something like $2 per liter (that's quite generous to the estimation, as their retail price online is much higher).

Applying the $2/liter estimate**, Gross revenues for the six months would be $364,000 which sounds about right for their stage of mostly regional distribution. And in that six months, they donated $8,000 to Generosity Water for one well.

So for now, 8k/364k would mean 2% donation rate or perhaps 4 cents of every purchase for last year? If they step up to national distribution, then I suppose they will need to fund wells much more frequently than one every six months.

Today, and thinking about online retail, 24 pack of 500ml/16.9oz sells now for $45 (!!!), that 's a whopping $3.75 per liter, which is outrageous. At those prices, gross revenues would be $682,500, and the $8,000 donation about 1.2%. So that's the range, I guess.

All of which is to say that the blog is a step in the right direction for me, and they should put some of that on the label because it is hardly intuitive from the on-label pledge, which states:

FOR EVERY BOTTLE PURCHASED PEOPLE WATER WILL GIVE AN EQUAL AMOUNT OF CLEAN WATER TO A PERSON IN NEED

So, I guess every time they sell 182,000 liters, this triggers a new donation sufficient to cause an existing well to start producing 1000 liters per day again (following funding of repairs), or alternatively, construction of a new well? Still don't really get it. Sigh. It is not a workable pledge at the purchaser level. It is catchy, but I predict will not survive national distribution and the scrutiny that comes with dealing with national outlets with actual compliance function.

OK, math!

I'll take your 182,000 liters per well, but not what follows. As posted by someone else $2 is higher than the retail price in their local stores, and you have to remember that they are almost never going to be selling at retail; 99% is probably wholesale or some negotiated bulk deal at a reduced price. But the funny thing is that my math comes out to a lower donation per purchase than yours ...

I think the number consumers will understand is the amount per liter and I posted before that my instinct long ran towards just 1 or 2 cents per liter bottle, so if a well costs $3000-$4000 and we divide that by 182000 liters that would be 1.6 - 2.2 cents per liter bottle, or .08-1.1 cents per 500ml bottle (more typical) . But is that what a well really costs? $3000-$4000? Regardless, the idea that is pennies on the dollar has probably always been right, but the difference is that to me as a business person that is totally reasonable, because they are taking off the gross, at the top, and not from net profit (which they probably don't even have).

I am wondering if the $8,000 on the website was the special fundraising they did for Generosity water during the run of the show, a little thing for fans. I really do not think it represents their cummulative dollar commitment to wells to date. Don't they already have two wells built in Ghana and the one in Nicaragua?

For those of you who might have just finished watching Brian Williams on nightly news here is the story he did regarding 9 yr old Rachel Beckwith and her idea on charity and providing water for Ethiopia.

http://www.charitywater.org/

A whole different perspective on charity, huh?

My nephew's charity was born from a personal idea.
My own brother died at age 18 yrs old almost 33 yrs ago. I was 22 and had been married just 6 weeks. A scholarship was formed and a deserving h.s. senior was awarded a scholarship for the next 30 yrs in my brother's memory.
So upon my nephew's passing (at age 18 exactly 6 weeks following my daughter's wedding), it was suggested to my brother-in-law about the memorial scholarship that had helped so many.
Pay it forward.

Kashathediva wrote:For those of you who might have just finished watching Brian Williams on nightly news here is the story he did regarding 9 yr old Rachel Beckwith and her idea on charity and providing water for Ethiopia.

http://www.charitywater.org/

A whole different perspective on charity, huh?

PW isn't a charity and never has been. Half of what PW is doing is to bring attention to the cause, in my opinion, and that has value, too.

I actually prefer that they started a for-profit business as a way to help them fund their charitable goals than if they had started a charity and had to pay themselves from the donations. All my fundraising work has been for no-overhead entities; I absolutely hate the high salaries those who run big charities get paid.

Kashathediva wrote:
My nephew's charity was born from a personal idea.
My own brother died at age 18 yrs old almost 33 yrs ago. I was 22 and had been married just 6 weeks. A scholarship was formed and a deserving h.s. senior was awarded a scholarship for the next 30 yrs in my brother's memory.
So upon my nephew's passing (at age 18 exactly 6 weeks following my daughter's wedding), it was suggested to my brother-in-law about the memorial scholarship that had helped so many.
Play it forward.

That is so sweet.

I believe in pay it forward.

Kashathediva wrote:For those of you who might have just finished watching Brian Williams on nightly news here is the story he did regarding 9 yr old Rachel Beckwith and her idea on charity and providing water for Ethiopia.

http://www.charitywater.org/

A whole different perspective on charity, huh?

My nephew's charity was born from a personal idea.
My own brother died at age 18 yrs old almost 33 yrs ago. I was 22 and had been married just 6 weeks. A scholarship was formed and a deserving h.s. senior was awarded a scholarship for the next 30 yrs in my brother's memory.
So upon my nephew's passing (at age 18 exactly 6 weeks following my daughter's wedding), it was suggested to my brother-in-law about the memorial scholarship that had helped so many.
Play it forward.

Yup. Water for People also great.

And, drop in the bucket, Cassie's group. Allow me to sincerely genuflect to this crap show and Jef of the One F Vanity, in gratitude for raising my own awarenes. My 12 year old is going to do a class then school wide clean water community service project. It's an awesome cause for children especially. Very relateable ... when combined with ending the "addiction" to purchased water bottles. Combining this cause with launching yet another plastic "spring" water bottle company is a farce at best, and sort of cynical at its core.

Kashathediva wrote:For those of you who might have just finished watching Brian Williams on nightly news here is the story he did regarding 9 yr old Rachel Beckwith and her idea on charity and providing water for Ethiopia.

http://www.charitywater.org/

A whole different perspective on charity, huh?

My nephew's charity was born from a personal idea.
My own brother died at age 18 yrs old almost 33 yrs ago. I was 22 and had been married just 6 weeks. A scholarship was formed and a deserving h.s. senior was awarded a scholarship for the next 30 yrs in my brother's memory.
So upon my nephew's passing (at age 18 exactly 6 weeks following my daughter's wedding), it was suggested to my brother-in-law about the memorial scholarship that had helped so many.
Pay it forward.

I love that video, Kasha. Rachel