The Bachelorette 11 - Kaitlyn Bristowe - FRC - ATFR- July 27th - Thread#3 - *Sleuthing - Spoilers*

Kashathediva wrote:

bleuberry wrote:Now I love a good post finale love fest as much as the next girl, but I'm almost sick of K/S - and I'm a fan! Feels like there's not much to see, I've already seen them making out enough, I know they have chemistry. I just wanna see something new from them. I wanna hear about future plans, not just that they're visiting their hometowns and are gonna decide later. You'd think that after months in hiding, they'd have some more concrete ideas or plans in place. I guess I'm bored already and it hasn't even been a week.

This is the result of what you get when you only live in the moment.   literally In    The    Moment.  Reminds me of when I was 17 and the only thing I had to worry about was summer vacay being over.

Kasha, I have a 17 year old daughter and she is eons more mature than K.
1) My daughter has a job.
2) She's volunteered with 3 different organizations this summer.
3) She makes less of a fool of herself on SM.
If my 17 year old behaved like K, I'd be very disappointed. If my 30 year old behaved like K, I'd be very concerned and probably stage an intervention.

Des made it clear in her FRC speech to Chris exactly where she stood with Brooks at the time, and where she stood at that moment as far as her feelings. She stopped him in the middle of his proposal so she could clear the air. IMO one of the best proposals of all time. Pure honesty.

He was very much criticized for being the fall back guy, 2nd choice, plan B, TPTB forced him to propose, he should have run far away from Des blah blah blah.

BTW Des is 2 yrs younger than K and her FRC was when she was 26 years old. Big difference in the maturity level.

^ I haven't checked Des' age before, so this is a nice surprise, that she's so young ... wonderful woman ... and I love her FRC moment, loved her sincerity throughout the season, her trying to connect with each guy, so I was actually taken aback that people found her season boring and other stuff I've read. Maybe because I've seen it a year after a fact knowing the result, but to me it was the best season of US TB show.

To return to the topic, I view it the same as Mia ... and I'm just a few years older than Kaitlyn. But I believe the core of all is not rooted in maturity (or lack of), but in values ... and K (and her fam) values are not in-line with some of ours. I don't want to assume the role of a moralist, but it's JMO.

peggy0221 wrote:I don't buy the RS theory about she has to kept Nick until he almost propose. This is Kaitlyn Bristowe, who breaks rules and proud to be a rebel, no way she was listening to producer.

IMO it was actually because Kaitlyn broke rules that they wouldn't let he break this one. Kaitlyn did an interview with E! - it's here and it's the one titled "Nick or Ben H for next Bachelor?" and at about 1:40 she's asked the question why she let Nick talk and her answer was:

I didn't really want to but I think I'd gotten away with so much throughout the whole season of breaking the rules that they're kind of like well this is the show - usually two people do propose and Andi didn't really give him a chance to say how he was feeling - it was just kind of just cut off so I just kind of went with the format of the show on this one and let him talk.

This is about as definitive a piece of evidence that we're ever going to get that this was a producer driven event - not Kaitlyn's decision.
JMHO

Yes, funny how K always finds an excuse, lays the blame on someone else or flat out lies, to rationalize her behavior. jmo

Nibbles22 wrote:Yes, funny how K always finds an excuse, lays the blame on someone else or flat out lies,  to rationalize her behavior. jmo

Well considering this is a highly edited tv show....I don't think it's too much of a stretch to think that producer's told her she needed to let him talk. I don't necessarily believe that they told her she HAD TO. But I think they probably highly suggested it in the way of saying something along the lines of "look at what happened with andi, he didn't get the closure he needed and didn't get to speak his mind, and look at what happened on afr." I don't think it's a stretch to think there was some producer manipulation going on with the ending.

Having said that...is she passing the blame off...sure she is...but I probably would too.

See ... I actually believe she was "convinced" to let Nick propose ... and it wasn't her "smart idea" ... I actually have no problem with that myself.

But ... there is as but ... if Kaitlyn ever actually felt (which I personally don't believe) the love for Nick (and I'm not talking a romantic love, but as simple as a friendship, then again... I don't believe there ever was from her part) ...
she could let him know - when they were all alone without cameras+mics (and they were in FS, after HTD and after LCD supposedly) - that he isn't her "pick" (and Nick would be able to "play along" at the proposal - since everyone is saying that he can be a great deceiver/manipulator) ... she wouldn't say ILY so far into the game, since she obviously didn't really feel it ... and she would make sure he knows where he stands ... but she obviously didn't care about him then ... as she doesn't care about him now.

You see I actually think he did know on some level. To me, keeping his hands in his pockets, never touching Kaitlyn (other than the first quick hug) spoke volumes to me. He knew it was over IMHO

I don't even care about the proposal anymore. I will always believe she could have fought the producers on it if she really cared, but I'm fine with the notion that she was threatened/bribed to make him propose.

My thing is why tell him she loved him multiple times and ask him multiple times if he would be ready to propose. That's something that Ali has said you're not allowed to do, so Kaitlyn was okay with going against production to give Nick false security and confidence? I just don't get it, but I've come to realize that Kaitlyn just is not a person who thinks before she acts.

leselihau wrote:

Nibbles22 wrote:Yes, funny how K always finds an excuse, lays the blame on someone else or flat out lies,  to rationalize her behavior. jmo

Well considering this is a highly edited tv show....I don't think it's too much of a stretch to think that producer's told her she needed to let him talk.  I don't necessarily believe that they told her she HAD TO.  But I think they probably highly suggested it in the way of saying something along the lines of "look at what happened with andi, he didn't get the closure he needed and didn't get to speak his mind, and look at what happened on afr."  I don't think it's a stretch to think there was some producer manipulation going on with the ending.  

Having said that...is she passing the blame off...sure she is...but I probably would too.  

The entire process is a slippery slope. The lead is basically isolated and the only support or feedback he/she gets are from those they should never be trusting. So they are going to be damned if they do and damned if they don't.
However-
Why damn yourself in the process? This season I feel the lead gave them the leverage to manipulate her to the max. She was her own worst enemy. You can blame it on hormones, you can blame it on booze, you can blame it on fatigue. The bottom line is she gave them more rope than usual to help hang herself.

eliza3 wrote:You see I actually think he did know on some level.   To me, keeping his hands in his pockets, never touching Kaitlyn (other than the first quick hug) spoke volumes to me.   He knew it was over IMHO

I might agree with you ... but he didn't knew it from Kaitlyn's mouth. If Nick ever came to that idea ... he more likely concluded that by himself and not with Kaitlyn's help.

Because after all, Kaitlyn was the Bette ... and as the lead ... she had to be selfish. That's the only reason why Nick even got to be part of this season.

eliza3 wrote:You see I actually think he did know on some level.   To me, keeping his hands in his pockets, never touching Kaitlyn (other than the first quick hug) spoke volumes to me.   He knew it was over IMHO

He specifically said he didn't. He even said that there was a moment when he got nervous and she reached out to hold his hands and say "go on".