Nick Viall - Bachelorette 11 - *Spoilers - Sleuthing* - Discussion #6

mindless wrote:

chasingpavements wrote:I don't think they need a story - what was JP's story? what was Chris's story? All they need is the "I feel unlovable b/c no girl has loved me back".

JP was a "latin lover" single dad. Chris had the whole 'farmer with no one to date in his hometown' thing going for him. Both of those story lines are a lot more compelling and easier to work with than a handsome 26-year-old thinking he's unlovable because one 20-year-old girl dumped him a couple of years ago.

Ben is too young. Does anyone know what the youngest Bachelor lead was? I hear some saying Nick is too old, but Chris S. was 33 and Brad was like 36.

rosesrREd wrote:

mindless wrote:

chasingpavements wrote:I don't think they need a story - what was JP's story? what was Chris's story? All they need is the "I feel unlovable b/c no girl has loved me back".

JP was a "latin lover" single dad. Chris had the whole 'farmer with no one to date in his hometown' thing going for him. Both of those story lines are a lot more compelling and easier to work with than a handsome 26-year-old thinking he's unlovable because one 20-year-old girl dumped him a couple of years ago.

Ben is too young.  Does anyone know what the youngest Bachelor lead was?  I hear some saying Nick is too old, but Chris S. was 33 and Brad was like 36.

I believe that both Jesse Palmer and Andrew Firestone were 26 as well. Maybe 27.

mindless wrote:

chasingpavements wrote:I don't think they need a story - what was JP's story? what was Chris's story? All they need is the "I feel unlovable b/c no girl has loved me back".

JP was a "latin lover" single dad. Chris had the whole 'farmer with no one to date in his hometown' thing going for him. Both of those story lines are a lot more compelling and easier to work with than a handsome 26-year-old thinking he's unlovable because one 20-year-old girl dumped him a couple of years ago.

Yeah, but there wasn't anyone out there thinking that guys like Sean Lowe, Andrew Firestone, or Travis have trouble finding women. All you need to do is get dumped one time and they can make a quick 20-min segment about that. Maybe add something about how it's hard for him to open up because both women who he loved didn't love him back. I don't think the typical viewer cares too Much about that.

mindless wrote:

GuardianAngel wrote:IA it's all about ratings, however what will Ben's story be? They haven't focused on him at all. The f2 heartbreak really wasn't heartbreaking.

Nick on the other hand, they have a ton they can use.

Yeah, I don't really get the appeal of Ben H. as a lead either from a production point of view. He's good-looking enough to get the younger crowd crushing on him, but that's about it. His fear of being unlovable made most people roll their eyes I think. His heartbreak wasn't convincing at all, he doesn't have any tragic/interesting background story (that we know of anyway) and he doesn't seem comfortable at all in front of the cameras. I'm sure he's a nice guy in real life, but I don't see lead material. JMO.

Nick has so much more they can work with. For example, I can already see them editing the heck out of things to make it seem like his F1 is having second thoughts. And even though people say they're sick of him now, the show won't air for another 5 months. People will be dying to watch by the time it does.

I doubt that because they didn't like him from Andi's season a year later. Everyone I know IRL who watches the show including my son, can't stand Nick so why would they pick him? Makes no sense to me.

My preference would be Cupcake or Jared but still think one of the Bens has the edge.

mizzoufan wrote: Hi all!!   Nick fan here and think he going to be the next lead. Not sure If i should post here or the fan page

Join us at the Nick fan thread, please!

rosesrREd wrote:

mindless wrote:

chasingpavements wrote:I don't think they need a story - what was JP's story? what was Chris's story? All they need is the "I feel unlovable b/c no girl has loved me back".

JP was a "latin lover" single dad. Chris had the whole 'farmer with no one to date in his hometown' thing going for him. Both of those story lines are a lot more compelling and easier to work with than a handsome 26-year-old thinking he's unlovable because one 20-year-old girl dumped him a couple of years ago.

Ben is too young.  Does anyone know what the youngest Bachelor lead was?  I hear some saying Nick is too old, but Chris S. was 33 and Brad was like 36.

The youngest if I was to guess was Ben F

chasingpavements wrote:

mindless wrote:

chasingpavements wrote:I don't think they need a story - what was JP's story? what was Chris's story? All they need is the "I feel unlovable b/c no girl has loved me back".

JP was a "latin lover" single dad. Chris had the whole 'farmer with no one to date in his hometown' thing going for him. Both of those story lines are a lot more compelling and easier to work with than a handsome 26-year-old thinking he's unlovable because one 20-year-old girl dumped him a couple of years ago.

Yeah, but there wasn't anyone out there thinking that guys like Sean Lowe, Andrew Firestone, or Travis have trouble finding women. All you need to do is get dumped one time and they can make a quick 20-min segment about that. Maybe add something about how it's hard for him to open up because both women who he loved didn't love him back. I don't think the typical viewer cares too Much about that.

I don't think you can compare early leads like Andrew and Travis to leads these days. Back then they didn't recycle contestants and the leads were actual catches, eligible bachelors. The whole point of the show in the first place was to have 25 women vying for the affection of this one "unattainable" catch. Nowadays it's very different. It's all about the story and viewers feeling sorry for the lead. Sean got the job because he was very loved (lord knows why) and he actually got his heart broken. Ben didn't.

mindless wrote:

chasingpavements wrote:

mindless wrote:

JP was a "latin lover" single dad. Chris had the whole 'farmer with no one to date in his hometown' thing going for him. Both of those story lines are a lot more compelling and easier to work with than a handsome 26-year-old thinking he's unlovable because one 20-year-old girl dumped him a couple of years ago.

Yeah, but there wasn't anyone out there thinking that guys like Sean Lowe, Andrew Firestone, or Travis have trouble finding women. All you need to do is get dumped one time and they can make a quick 20-min segment about that. Maybe add something about how it's hard for him to open up because both women who he loved didn't love him back. I don't think the typical viewer cares too Much about that.

I don't think you can compare early leads like Andrew and Travis to leads these days. Back then they didn't recycle contestants and the leads were actual catches, eligible bachelors. The whole point of the show in the first place was to have 25 women vying for the affection of this one "unattainable" catch. Nowadays it's very different. It's all about the story and viewers feeling sorry for the lead. Sean got the job because he was very loved (lord knows why) and he actually got his heart broken. Ben didn't.

Eh, people THINK he was heartbroken. That's all that matters. I listened to a bunch of podcasts and blogs (including after buzz) and they all talked about how Ben was on the verge of tears at the MTA because he still loved her and he was truly heartbroken. Everyone talked about how crazy Kaitlyn was for letting Ben go, although it was pretty obvious he was never a serious contender.

Seems pretty much like Sean 2.0 to me. Sean also got over Emily pretty quickly, if you read his book and listen to what Kristily said on after-buzz at the time. He was 100% over her at the time of the MTA, since she didn't even return his call, but people couldn't tell! People will mostly believe what TPTB tell them to believe.

mindless wrote:

GuardianAngel wrote:IA it's all about ratings, however what will Ben's story be? They haven't focused on him at all. The f2 heartbreak really wasn't heartbreaking.

Nick on the other hand, they have a ton they can use.

Yeah, I don't really get the appeal of Ben H. as a lead either from a production point of view. He's good-looking enough to get the younger crowd crushing on him, but that's about it. His fear of being unlovable made most people roll their eyes I think. His heartbreak wasn't convincing at all, he doesn't have any tragic/interesting background story (that we know of anyway) and he doesn't seem comfortable at all in front of the cameras. I'm sure he's a nice guy in real life, but I don't see lead material. JMO.

Nick has so much more they can work with. For example, I can already see them editing the heck out of things to make it seem like his F1 is having second thoughts. And even though people say they're sick of him now, the show won't air for another 5 months. People will be dying to watch by the time it does.

If Nick became Bachelor, I do think the non fans, atleast some of them, will still watch in hopes that he gets crushed again (this time as the lead) and fans will watch hoping and praying he gets his happy ending. I agree with you that I also can already see the edit as well making it seem like the F1 will back out at the last second (per usual scenario he had with both leads). That made me queasy as fan to just even type out as a possible scenario.

mindless wrote:

chasingpavements wrote:I don't think they need a story - what was JP's story? what was Chris's story? All they need is the "I feel unlovable b/c no girl has loved me back".

JP was a "latin lover" single dad. Chris had the whole 'farmer with no one to date in his hometown' thing going for him. Both of those story lines are a lot more compelling and easier to work with than a handsome 26-year-old thinking he's unlovable because one 20-year-old girl dumped him a couple of years ago.

That is the thing he didn't sell his "heartbreak" regarding Kaitlyn well at all or the show didn't depict it that way. 26 is definitely on the younger side for Bachelor, I think he would be the youngest Bachelor I think the the others have been at least 30 when filming. The Bachelorettes have been 25-27 age range for the most part so Kaitlyn, a late 29 was actually older than the typical Bachelorette so I guess they could break pattern this time as well and go young with the Bachelor. I am fine with Ben H being Bachelor if that is what it is but they definitely haven't set him up very well as has been done in past seasons. I don't think they have set Nick up either but again they didn't have to as his story speaks for itself without needing any pimping. My gut says it will be the initial name dropped Ben H, just like last season with Chris S. Arie and Nick were both later thrown in to that mix (IMO to keep people guessing) until they made the announcement. Nick doesn't seem to be acting any different in regards to the "Bachelor" topic than he did last year and even giving the same answers "honor if asked, would have to think it over, talk to family." With all of that said, I have to admit there is definitely info/material out there that cannot discount Nick as being in high consideration.

The youngest Bachelor lead was Jesse Palmer, who was 25, next youngest was Matt Grant at 27, then Firestone, who I think was 28. Ben F was 29. I don't think it's that Ben H. is chronologically too young, as he seems very mature, but that he appears to not have a lot of relationship experience. That said, based on the BIP aftershow, I think he's still the leading contender for the role, which surprised me, because I really thought they were starting to lean toward Nick. I agree that between Nick fans who would be watching for a happy ending, people who don't like him who would be watching to see him knocked off his pedestal, and "wrong reasons" watchers who would be hoping to see him get humiliated yet again, Nick would have a large built in audience, but it seems that the producers still find casting him enough of a risk to continue to try to "sell" Ben H as the one all the fans are clamoring for, as they were doing last night on the aftershow.

My feeling storyboard wise if Nick came back as the lead they are going to do to him similar as what was done to him in the past. Translate that to mean he could simply reject both women at the end of his lead season.