The Bachelorette Season 11 - Kaitlyn Bristowe - *Sleuthing - Spoilers* - Discussion #2

We all have our weaknessess, which producers could use to make a good show.. weaknessess that could make you go crazy in this kind of unnormal situation. I mean how many being part of this show before havent said that you can NEVER imagen what this show can do to you... No contact with the world, no tv, no IT, no papers etc... Only you and your head. Chris felt that rejection always happends to him, Ben felt unlovable, Nick knew what this show can do to you and still went on again... Is this better reasons to be a part of this show than trust issues? I say, if you want to be sure to remain sane, dont go on the show... period! (sorry about my english, I am not englishspeaking)

Miyala wrote:

AllAboutLove wrote:IMO, trust is Shawn's responsibility and here's why:

Shawn chose to go on The Bachelorette.
It's why I find it ridiculous that a guy who has confessed trust issues will quit his job to go on The Bachelorette (25 men, 1 woman)
This is the last show to go on if one has trust issues, imo.

So, do you mean he needs to trust her no matter what she does? Can she act however she wants and he HAS to trust her because it is a responsibility on the show (and with that I dint mean that she did something wrong)? How can trust be a responsibility? He once said that he never expected to fall in love going into the show so I guess his trust issues wasnt that big of a deal for him. Doesnt she also have trust issues? Does it make it wrong of her becoming the bachelorette?

I just mean that...

Trust Issues + The Bachelorette = Recipe for Problems

Yes, with that I agree :cutesmile!:

Alanna wrote:I think they've both screwed up at different places here and in different ways but they seem to have made a decision to move forward and work things through together. She is really self-aware of this in her blogs, which is interesting to read because she seems so flighty as a person at first glance.

Though I do see how Kaitlyn created her own problems and truly is - as CH said in his season opening blog - her own worst enemy - she has done one thing which impresses me and that is she has owned the problems she created and admitted to her mistakes. I can give her some slack for making them because IMO (and she has said this herself) she had no idea going into the role how difficult it would be and how many mistakes can be made - including the fact that there's very possibly no way to get through the role without making some mistakes somewhere along the line.

A couple of things seem to be pretty clear to me; Kaitlyn wanted Shawn from the first time she met him, and while she has made mistakes along the way, Shawn has stayed with her and is willing to work with her to get beyond those mistakes. Some of those mistakes have been pretty big ones but my fascination with this season is that we have people with real flaws trying to find a way to make it work between them in spite of those flows. I can't recall any other season that has this raw or gritty a look into the reality of relationships with all their ups and downs, mistakes and forgiveness.

Miyala wrote:

AllAboutLove wrote:IMO, trust is Shawn's responsibility and here's why:

Shawn chose to go on The Bachelorette.
It's why I find it ridiculous that a guy who has confessed trust issues will quit his job to go on The Bachelorette (25 men, 1 woman)
This is the last show to go on if one has trust issues, imo.

So, do you mean he needs to trust her no matter what she does? Can she act however she wants and he HAS to trust her because it is a responsibility on the show (and with that I dint mean that she did something wrong)? How can trust be a responsibility? He once said that he never expected to fall in love going into the show so I guess his trust issues wasnt that big of a deal for him. Doesnt she also have trust issues? Does it make it wrong of her becoming the bachelorette?

I was the biggest banger of the drum that Kaitlyn didn't owe Shawn any apology as she wasn't his when she had sex with Nick. But she was his, at least she had told him that, so I do get the confusion, though what amazes me is he was over the top going to her room for affirmation after Jared's GDR, but accepted the Nick sex and her saying she would have it again if she wanted to very well. Now, I find it totally idiotic for him to then confront Nick about not being there for Kaitlyn. Shawn has no idea what Nick does or doesn't think, but to me he had to let that aggression out on someone so after stewing for a day or two, he went and confronted Nick. Classic transference behavior. He was really mad at Kaitlyn, but can't risk losing her so he blames Nick entirely instead. So sad on both their parts, because if Kaitlyn really felt that Shawn was the one she shouldn't have needed sex with Nick or Ben IMO. Sad that he is not facing that fact that he is angry with Kaitlyn. I think in the long run, his mature acceptance, then turning around and putting all the blame on someone else could be a problem. At the end of the day, the decision was Kaitlyn's to make and she made it. But then again, I have never been one to blame the person someone cheated with, I think the first person you should blame is the person who cheated on you. That in this case was Kaitlyn. And all her tears and drama meant nothing to me once she decided that hey guess what, I am going to do it again.

Lucas15 wrote:

Alanna wrote:I think they've both screwed up at different places here and in different ways but they seem to have made a decision to move forward and work things through together. She is really self-aware of this in her blogs, which is interesting to read because she seems so flighty as a person at first glance.

Though I do see how Kaitlyn created her own problems and truly is - as CH said in his season opening blog - her own worst enemy - she has done one thing which impresses me and that is she has owned the problems she created and admitted to her mistakes. I can give her some slack for making them because IMO (and she has said this herself) she had no idea going into the role how difficult it would be and how many mistakes can be made - including the fact that there's very possibly no way to get through the role without making some mistakes somewhere along the line.

A couple of things seem to be pretty clear to me; Kaitlyn wanted Shawn from the first time she met him, and while she has made mistakes along the way, Shawn has stayed with her and is willing to work with her to get beyond those mistakes. Some of those mistakes have been pretty big ones but my fascination with this season is that we have people with real flaws trying to find a way to make it work between them in spite of those flows. I can't recall any other season that has this raw or gritty a look into the reality of relationships with all their ups and downs, mistakes and forgiveness.

I would agree with you Lucas, except that admitting your mistake to just turn around and repeat it doesn't seem like mature behavior. I would have been happy to forgive Kaitlyn had she told Shawn and then not had sex with Nick again. To me all that whining and crying about losing Shawn because of sex with Nick, to turn around and tell him, yes I did it and will do it again before I commit to being a wife, irritated me. To me it made the whole worry about losing Shawn and crying seem false.

I was pleased the Shawn didn't get mad at Kaitlyn for the sex, that he took sometime and decided to stick around, I really admired that. But to then turn around and blame Nick instead is just immature. Kaitlyn and he will both make mistakes in life, they will need to really learn to forgive each other without having someone else to blame for it.

I think Kaitlyn and Shawn have a better chance then A&J who just pretended it would all be okay and never really addressed their issues, but I do worry, that if they are not truly accepting the other persons mistake without needing to blame another and that if Kaitlyn decides that it is okay to just repeat her mistakes as part of her process, it could be bad.

I also think that post AFTR we will actually see the tables turn. Shawn will have women all over him and we will see Kaitlyn as the crazy insecure and needy one. I think it was Alanna who pointed out that all her SM behavior seems to be a message to other women, he is mine, back off ladies.

Not a great foundation for a relationship, especially with two attractive, very sexual and flirty individuals.

If K & N had sex in the FS, it didn't seem like it was meaningful, because of the way they acted on TV before and after the overnight. They appeared to be "friends" more than passionate lovers, or in love. I sensed that K wanted to get rid of N.

Their interaction before and after seemed forced on K part. She didn't look him in the eyes that much. N kept talking and selling himself, but K was just sort of there trying to get through the date. Anywhoo, something was off.

I'm guessing that IF there was more to this date MF would have shown it . Watching this date with N, and how detached she acted, made me wonder WHY she even kept him there after the FS. I guess she needed 2 proposals.

^^^^ Totally agree with this. Kaitlyn did look "checked out" and something was off. There was no passion with Nick. Imho of course.

I bet TPTB wanted Nick to stay around and propose. Kaitlyn gave them just that. ;)

Yeah I don't t really see K reciprocating with Nick when he tells her what most leads usually love to hear.

Does anyone else think that Kaitlyn has to get drunk to sleep with Nick.I think she was the first time and it seemed like there was a lot of drinking on the FS date. JMO.

Rosepetal wrote:Does anyone else think that Kaitlyn has to get drunk to sleep with Nick.I  think she was the first time and it seemed like there was a lot of drinking on the FS date. JMO.

Well IMO drinking has a lot to do with how the cast behaves and that's why there is a never-ending supply of alcohol during production. I do think that Kaitlyn was quite drunk in Dublin on her date with Nick. It's going to be interesting to see if she is sober - or more sober - on her FS with Shawn. My offhand guess would be that she is though if she likes sex a little bit more when she's tipsy my guess could be wrong.

soccermom333 wrote:^^^^ Totally agree with this.  Kaitlyn did look "checked out" and something was off.  There was no passion with Nick.  Imho of course.

I bet TPTB wanted Nick to stay around and propose.  Kaitlyn gave them just that.  ;)  

Well they have a story line to follow and they had to give up on some of the filler (4 HTDs for example) already so they pretty much have to have some sort of HTDs and some sort of MTP and an FRC because without that they don't have a complete show. IMO they are scrambling at this point to get a complete show from a lead who probably just wants to pass Go and skip directly to an F1 RC.

Rosepetal wrote:Does anyone else think that Kaitlyn has to get drunk to sleep with Nick.I  think she was the first time and it seemed like there was a lot of drinking on the FS date. JMO.

She honestly looked trasheddddddd to me on their first 1:1, but a little better on the fs. I think she likes him a lot as a friend and they have some fun banter going, but nothing more imo. I did think it was funny she used Nick's parents' whirlwind courtship to begin justifying her whirlwind engagement/ courtship with Shawn. Umm ok, not sure that's what he meant but nice effort, Kait.