Chris Soules - Whitney Bischoff - Bachelor 19 - Discussion

sfrank wrote:

FLChica wrote:And MeandI wanted Nick so much she knocked boots with him in the fantasy suite - before declaring undying love to poor old Josh and accepting that big old Neil Lane ring.  And Des vowed she only loved Brooks - until she accepted Chris's proposal and married him. And Sean told Lindsey, "I love you" - until he proposed to Cat and had their GrownSexy wedding. And Ashley was hopelessly devoted to Bentley and than Ben - until she accepted JP's proposal, married him and had Fordham. 

Andy slept with Bevin before picking Tessa. Ali was heartbroken over Frank  leaving before she choose Roberto.  Jillian needed to talk to CH before deciding she couldn't say yes to Reid and picked ED.  Jason dumped Molly and proposed to Melissa before he dumped her to go back to Molly. We could do this all day. I think it just proves that things arent always black and white. There's confusion and conflicting emotions every season some more than others but it's there - maybe they feel more for one individual above the other but to say its just one person and everyone else is "scripted" is flawed, IMO.

I'm not naive to believe that there aren't storyboards but it's just not realistic to think every lead knows their F1 beyond a shadow of a doubt and there's no conflict. There are feelings involved with both of their finalists,IMO. How could there not be you've met this person's family, you've shared some level of intimacy with them. As many of you have pointed out these aren't actors...the feelings exist on some level. This season I think there was deep conflict within Chris over both women but he made the choice he needed to make.

As with all the aforementioned couples, they live and die on what comes after.
It's possible Whitney and Chris could get married. It's also possible they crash and burn like most couples in the franchise. For now either side can save the "I told you so's" and victory laps- only time will tell.

Good post . IMO per the bold, things are never black and white with this show. I believe once the lead has a good idea of who they have the most interest in and the strongest possible connection with, (some time that happens early on) it's then they start to build the storyboards. I agree that it has to be especially hard when it gets to F4 and HTD and I do believe there are feelings at this point on all levels, feelings of friendships building, genuinely caring, even guilt, knowing that you're going to break hearts and reject these great people that you've come to know so well and who have stuck the journey out with you . I think all the leads are descent caring human beings with good hearts so there's no doubt that it's hard on them carrying it out. We see many a lead cry at the end, while some tend to think it's because they were so in love with that F2, or had a hard time choosing, so conflicted, made a mistake letting them go etc. I tend to think the tears are relief that it's over and guilt from hurting people that they did sincerely care about. jmo

^^^sfrank, I agree with you especially your last paragraph..
Great post 

^^^Jolena... I agree. In my post from earlier this evening I tried to convey that Chris seemed to take his relationships with several woman as far as he could. His relationship with Whitney just progressed faster and further IMO. I also agree with Albean that Jade probably would have lasted longer imo cause he sure looked mighty happy to give her that jacket which was certainly special.

While I  don't think Chris  ever acted in any of his relationships, IMO Becca was not a typical f2 because her 2nd 1 on 1 was so short and instead of focusing on their chemistry like so many f2 in the past, the focus was on her virginity and never being in love and uncertainty in what she wanted. IMO that is not the norm for any f2 that I have ever seen. It's certainly not bad ...just different. And It's what tptb had for film so what they had to go with. I do think Chris liked Becca and that was amped by bubble. But does it matter now? Nope.

IMO what matters is what happens now and next. No guarantees but they look pretty solid to me. And IMO that was sure helped along by having 100 % drama free break at frc. IMO

Sprite wrote:Do we know for a fact that he didn't? I don't remember reading/hearing the answer to this question anywhere in any of the interviews post show. Did I miss that? That is actually one of the questions I most want to know the answer to.

KB_Mom wrote:I am late to the conversation about whether Chris called Whitney's sister for her blessing, but what I recall is in one of the earliest interviews where he was asked,he gave a very short answer that he talked to her,but he did not say whether it was before FRC. In a later interview, he said (paraphrasing) that they had a conversation that involved a lot more than getting her blessing and that basically, as a result of that conversation, all was well. He never specified if it was before FRC.  The vibe I got was that the conversation with the sister, whenever it occurred, is something he wants to keep private and not talk about extensively in interviews, out of respect for the sister's privacy.

I remember it pretty much the way KB_Mom described; of course we never saw any follow-up conversation between Whitney's sister to know exactly how that resolved - or when it was resolved - only that Chris considered the issue resolved. The "when" part is something I doubt we'll ever know but I think the reason we'll never knew is because of the when. IMO there could have been additional conversations on the HTD - perhaps not filmed or if filmed not in the final edit because it would have revealed Chris' choice at the time. If I am to believe the US Weekly article that said Whitney's family was the only one he asked for their blessing from (and I do believe that article because it was spot on with so many other details) then I also have to believe Chris didn't leave things with Whitney's sister the way we saw - there was more said at some point that we didn't see. Getting Whitney's family's blessing was something important to Chris and I doubt he didn't reach an understanding on this.

http://www.tvguide.com/news/the-bachelor-chris-harrison-hometown-dates/

Did Chris ask marriage permission for anyone else?
Harrison: He asked permission in other hometowns too and sometimes we show it and sometimes we don't. With that it was such a moment because he asked her and then Kimberly wasn't quite sure about her answer.

CS also mentioned asking both of Kaitlyn's dads for their blessing in his blog, so no, Whitney's sister was not the only one he asked.

mindless wrote:I really don't think the Bachelorette was decided during taping. CH said Becca's name was brought into the discussion, not that they fought over her, the fight was between Kaitlyn and Britt and supposedly until the last minute. I think Becca was only considered after most of the show had aired and they realized how much viewers liked her, but the thought was dismissed because they figured she couldn't handle it. I think the main reason was that she couldn't fall in love in two months, so it was a "risk for the network". They didn't know back in Bali that she wouldn't even say ILY.

The article to which I referred was this one:

Chris Harrison wrote:This could've changed yesterday. It was a down-to-the-wire, heated debate, and Becca was a part of the debate too. But we all came to the realization that it made no sense. This girl is not ready to take charge and be the Bachelorette. You have to be clear about what you want and even if you're really ready, it's a tough, grueling task emotionally.

I don't think it was decided during taping either, but I do believe it was talked about and debated because IMO it had to be. The problem is one of timing - filming on the next bachelorette season has to start the week the ATFR airs - live - and it's hard for viewers to see a heartbroken F2 on the live show one hour and then applaud her as the next bachelorette an hour later. To keep their best options open the show has to make sure that their options don't make it as far as F2 and they have to do that during filming. As I believe they did this season.

I just see no reason to believe he wanted to pick Kaitlyn over Becca. He was very different around them and much more "going through the motions" with Kaitlyn. They looked positively bored kissing each other. JMO. And she was put in another resort than the others too.

sfrank wrote:

FLChica wrote:And MeandI wanted Nick so much she knocked boots with him in the fantasy suite - before declaring undying love to poor old Josh and accepting that big old Neil Lane ring.  And Des vowed she only loved Brooks - until she accepted Chris's proposal and married him. And Sean told Lindsey, "I love you" - until he proposed to Cat and had their GrownSexy wedding. And Ashley was hopelessly devoted to Bentley and than Ben - until she accepted JP's proposal, married him and had Fordham. 

Andy slept with Bevin before picking Tessa. Ali was heartbroken over Frank  leaving before she choose Roberto.  Jillian needed to talk to CH before deciding she couldn't say yes to Reid and picked ED.  Jason dumped Molly and proposed to Melissa before he dumped her to go back to Molly. We could do this all day. I think it just proves that things arent always black and white. There's confusion and conflicting emotions every season some more than others but it's there - maybe they feel more for one individual above the other but to say its just one person and everyone else is "scripted" is flawed, IMO.

I'm not naive to believe that there aren't storyboards but it's just not realistic to think every lead knows their F1 beyond a shadow of a doubt and there's no conflict. There are feelings involved with both of their finalists, IMO. How could there not be you've met this person's family, you've shared some level of intimacy with them. As many of you have pointed out these aren't actors...the feelings exist on some level. This season I think there was deep conflict within Chris over both women but he made the choice he needed to make.

As with all the aforementioned couples, they live and die on what comes after.
It's possible Whitney and Chris could get married. It's also possible they crash and burn like most couples in the franchise. For now either side can save the "I told you so's" and victory laps- only time will tell.

lexforlife wrote:IMO, after the show is when the relationship actually starts.

sfrank and lex...

lexforlife wrote: IMO, after the show is when the relationship actually starts.

So true and that is exactly what several Bach couples have admitted! They understand that what happened on the show was just "the show". It's why JP is happily married to Ash after all the Bentley drama on the show. It's why Chris is happily married to Des after the Brooks drama on the show. It's why Cat is happily married to Sean after the ILY to Lindsey on the show. I won't mention the Jason-Molly-Melissa drama. :halo:

Chris & Whitney started life after the show with four days together in Iowa, despite stories to the contrary. Not only did they enjoy producer arranged safe house visits, they had multiple unapproved visits they arranged for themselves. We started hearing reports of Whitney quitting her job or changes with her job in February - after living their new life 3 months after the cameras stopped rolling. They continue to move forward with their life as a couple and are doing so in a loving, mature fashion. To quote Whitney's t-shirt, "positive vibes only".

Please stay on topic. Thread is now open.

I think that Whitney and Chris have a very good chance of making it, in part because of how the show ended and the F2. Case in point:
- Chris never slept with his F2
- His F2 never told him she was in love with him
- His F2 focused on Chris' feelings even when he dumped her by telling him what a great HUSBAND he will be knowing full well it was Whitney she was referring to
- His F2 told his sisters and mother that Whitney was ready for marriage and babies and thus reminded them of this (and almost pushed Whitney back into the forefront in their minds) because she knew from Whitney herself how much Whitney was in love with Chris (Chris' F2 response at FRC not only supported him but Whitney as well)
- F2 supported Whitney throughout post-show and publicly stated her support and that they are perfect for each other
- IMO only: these steps by the F2 provide a cleaner break for Chris and Whitney as well as a great foundation to move on from despite a 'conflicted Chris' storyline (real or not). Whitney need not worry at all about the F2 and even if made to feel that Chris felt more strongly about the F2 than Whitney herself she doesn't have to worry because it is unrequited and she was chosen and has a ring on it.

Additionally, and perhaps more importantly, Whitney had a strategy going into the show and post show:
- She told Chris she was there for him and only for him
- She focused only on herself and Chris despite the drama or group dates where Britt had Chris' attention she was patient and, even though it hurt, understood what she was getting herself into
- She tooks notes/journal list of top 5, etc... like a game strategy (b/c TB is pretty much just that)
- On ATFR said she only watched her dates with Chris because it was "a game-time decision"
- She said she came to get a proposal from Chris and she never wavered from that even with her sister. She told Chris she wanted that. She told F2 she wanted that. She got the proposal she went on the show for.
- IMO only: Whitney's strategy was supported by the producers and, if there was any type of storyboard it was the producers working to make sure that WHITNEY got her fairytale ending and getting Chris to get onto Whitney's program as well as the producer's program of getting a proposal at the end of the show. Doesn't mean Chris's feelings are fabricated but I personally feel that, given the wedding crashing date was staged and led by Whitney more than Chris (she was/is the leader on the show between them) that it was planned early on that Whitney (likely the ONLY viable proposal-candidate for Chris out of the group since they knew about Jade's past and Becca lived in SD) would be for Chris and the producers did everything to promote and induce a romantic connection between the two even though Chris was into Britt at the beginning they gave Whitney the most fairy-tale-esque dates/mural on the wall/meeting friends (because no rules this season) and touring his home,etc. -- all necessary things that I am sure Whitney wanted and may have talked about herself to producers to prove to Chris she was 'for real' and get him to solidify his feelings for Whitney in his home environment and get the proposal ending they wanted. It was all about Whitney getting to manifest her vision and she said on numerous times "I am Mrs. Soules. I am engaged to Chris" etc.

Whitney is a go-getter and a planner. She strikes me as someone who has a visionary board (literally) and will make that visionary board become a reality. That is a great thing. She is a solution seeker to obstacles and proved this by having a strategy for the show and post-show and even in regards to her job. She found a solution to being able to still work in the field that she is passionate about and do so from any location. The only way I see Chris and Whitney not making it is if Whitney changes her mind about Chris.

JMHO

flchica wrote:Chris & Whitney started life after the show with four days together in Iowa, despite stories to the contrary. Not only did they enjoy producer arranged safe house visits, they had multiple unapproved visits they arranged for themselves.

Just to keep it straight in my head, I'm pretty sure I heard Whitney say in an interview that she went to Iowa twice while the show was airing, then they went to Iowa for 4 days after the ATFR. Did anyone else catch that in an interview?