Andi Dorfman & Josh Murray - Bachelorette 10 - General Discussion #2

MeAndi has been around for a long time It's definitely not a new thing.

For some strange reason I can actually believe CH didn't know. I do believe that Andi and Josh were a proper couple for several months. You don't live together and do everything together for a showmance. In light of that it makes sense that they'd want to keep their problems to themselves out of respect for the relationship, though I'm sure Andi told her girlfriends. I just don't see them running to the producers until they were 100% done and I don't think they were at the premiere. They did spend all the holidays together and with both families, and I don't believe they'd go that far unless there was still some hope. Maybe they were 99% done, but as long as either of them were hoping to keep trying or hoping to keep up appearances, then I don't see them telling the producers. Andi is quite insecure and concerned about what other people think, so it just doesn't seem like her to admit she "failed" until it was inevitable. And that's probably why she's totally disappeared and went into hiding. She's ashamed about failing and being caught on a lie. She's scared of the backlash. I may not like her, but I do feel sorry for her, because she must be a mess right now.

Then again someone did blab to RS, so if it wasn't someone in production, then who was it? A friend of a friend?

adani4804 wrote:Ok so I feel like some things need to be cleared up for me to understand this crazy weird situation. I have a few points to note & maybe someone can weigh in to help me process it all:

1. Andi and Josh seemed fine through the holidays. Although many noticed a change in their SM interactions in November, they were together at family related functions through the holidays. If you were on the verge of a breakup and knew the end was near (as in first week of January), I just do not think you would do the holidays as a couple (especially considering how close each of them are to their families). As long as neither of them posted anything about there whereabouts, it could have stayed on the DL that they were spending the holidays apart. If the couple was having serious troubles, you would not force your entire family to go along with the act if you were contemplating ending your engagement. Again, this is an engagement, its a bigger deal than just breaking up.

2. Andi and Josh seemed fine on the way to the Bachelor premier...posting pictures on the airplane....one noted Josh had an Advocare call before the premier and when someone asked about the time of an event, Andi chimed in in the background to give Josh that info. Again, a couple getting along.

3. At the premier, they were taking photos with fans...took pic with Neil Lane flashing the ring. I can't see Andi taking a pic with Neil Lane, showing off her huge rock, knowing she was going to have to give it back because they were going to release a joint statement announcing their breakup shortly after.

4. Yes, the interviews on the red carpet seemed awkward. They were dodging the wedding plans discussions, saying they had kinda put that on hold when at one point they were flying to NY to look at wedding gowns and Andi made like she was getting excited about getting the planning started. Although I too noticed a change in their interactions during the fall, they seemed to get back on track through Christmas & NYE and acting like a normal couple up until that red carpet event.

5. So considering all of that, even if they were putting on an act for the franchise and pretending to be the happy couple, the timing of the breakup is even more weird. Say they had to keep up appearances until the kickoff of the new Bachelor show....why announce a couple of days later that you are breaking up, knowing you just put on a show of love days earlier. It seems dumb to me...PR wise....why not just go back to Atlanta, start doing things separately, let the rumor mill start about no sightings of Josh and Andi together lately...is there trouble in paradise...blah blah blah? That could have carried on for a couple of weeks. They could avoid the questions, give vague answers when asked about the other, and let the tabloids speculate the demise of their relationships for a couple of weeks.  Then they would not look like complete fake jerks for putting on an act to all of their fans at a premier and announce they are splitting up 2 days later. Again, you are ending an engagement, it's not something to take lightly. You can't act fine on Monday and then on Wednesday say, yea, in the last 2 days we have decided it is best for us as individuals to separate as a couple. You don't make a decision to end an engagement in 2 days unless something major happened to change the relationship.

That's what is so confusing to it all...the timing. For 2 people who seem to have a decent fan base and enjoy having the benefits that have come along with it, it's risky to end the engagement the way they did. That's why I believe something major happened either at the premier or the day after to change things between them. Maybe it was an issue that had come up before, they worked through and then came back up in a bigger way at that premier. In addition, although I think CH knew of the breakup before the announcement, I don't think he knew too long before the announcement. No way do they let the opportunity slip by to have a one on one with Andi to discuss what happened...especially considering the show the 2 of them put on at the premier.

I don't know....it is all so weird.  

I'm so glad you brought up these points because I feel the same way. I have followed this couple so closely throughout, including reading this forum, following both on all SM as well as their family.  The way it ended is what is most confusing for me because of all the points you made.

I'm not sure what changed in the fall to make them less affectionate towards each other in their posts etc., but I agree with those of you that think up until their 6 month anniversary things were pretty great between them. Maybe it was just still the honeymoon phase, I don't know.  This fall, they were posting less and they weren't using the affectionate words towards each other in their captions.  Looking back, I feel the strain may have started right around Veterans Day and the time they did the LA Travel shoot, which were within one week of each other. Something started to seem off then. If things weren't perfect and they were working on their issues, it would make sense that they don't post all the cute, affectionate MCM, WCW's and affectionate hashtags. That is something you tend to do when you are feeling giddy and over the moon about each other. it doesn't mean that they wanted to call it quits as far back as then, just that they were working on some things, IMO.

One thing I noticed in the last two months that was telling to me was  Andi wasn't favoriting tweets. She had been pretty consistently favoring things up until mid to late December, but then pretty much stopped. Josh, however, continued to favorite many fan tweets regarding them as a couple.

Their happiness during the Thanksgiving celebrations with both families seemed genuine to me. I wouldn't think that you would involve both families to this degree if you know a split is imminent, so at least at that point, I think they were still hopeful for their relationship and future together. I agree with you, adani4840, that over Christmas Andi and Josh could very easily have celebrated with their individual families separately if they were truly emotionally done with each other. They didn't really post to SM and kept their activities mostly on the down low as you said, so they could have managed. But they still spent them together, and that says something to me. They chose to still be together. And to me at least their time spent with the Murrays in Tampa and the whole "crew" in KC  seemed pretty happy. I did find it interesting that they posted nothing about the Dorfmans being with them in Vegas for Christmas Eve and Christmas Day. But we did get the one Holiday IG photo that Andi posted talking about how blessed she was to be surrounded by both new and old love. Also, supposedly a fan tweeted that they saw Andi and Josh "cuddling" on the plane from Vegas to KC, so it sure sounds like they were still doing ok at that point too.

New Years Eve was another thing. I thought it was odd that Josh only posted the photo of the guys, vs. him and Andi. They looked happy and comfortable together in the pic that Andi posted, but you didn't see any fan postings of them together at the party all night, whereas you saw quite a few of Josh with female fans. At the same time, Josh's closest friends, Chad and Jay both posted pics of themselves hanging out with Andi, so Josh must have been close by the whole time too. I wonder if that was a good or bad night for them? The next day Andi posted her New Years Resolution and said her heart was full. Would she say that if she knew she was ending things with Josh? Just seems odd. They were also spotted having dinner at a fancy restaurant with the Dorfmans the Friday night before flying to LA for the premiere. Was this just one of their normal weekly family meals? If they were planning to split, why would Josh be there too and not just Andi? If this was their way of breaking the news to her parents,  why do it in public at a fancy restaurant and not in the privacy of your own home where you can show your emotions more openly. Doesn't make sense.

Adani4804, I was the one who posted about the Advocare conference call the night before the Bachelor Premiere, and yes they were together, and Josh seemed in good spirits. Much was made about them apparently going their separate ways for dinner that night, but I don't believe it was because they were in a fight, because I had just been on a phone call with him. Josh probably wanted to hang with Brian and Dylan, and ANdi wanted to hang with the ladies from her season. That seems understandable, but in hind sight, maybe something was wrong there.  

So that leads me to the actual premiere night. I definitely felt Josh seemed uncomfortable at times, especially in the CH nterview. But at other times, like on the red carpet in candid video shots, he was laughing and goofing off. How can there be such a contrast? I also felt that Andi seemed over the top at points and over compensating. I saw a disconnect with Josh towards Andi but the way she was always looking up at him and holding on to him, made me convinced she was either still in love with him and holding on for dear life, or she was being manipulative and controlling, wanting him to just follow along on her cue to get through their "farce".  Had they decided at that point things were definitely over, and they just needed to get through the night, or were they just on shaky ground with things they were working through and something happened at or after the premiere that just caused them to call it quits? I can't decide but want to believe that latter.

Supposedly RS didn't get word about the impending split until Tuesday morning.  This could be consistent with what I said above. I know there were rumors about there being trouble before, and they were likely doing their best to work through some issues, but RS did not comment on problems between them until after the premiere, which makes me think that the actual break-up was more sudden vs. planned ahead of time. I don't think they would purposely plan to call it quits three days after the premiere and right when two magazine cover stories were coming out. I think if this was all a planned out break-up, they would have gone home to Atlanta and waited the announcement out for a few weeks. I think something happened between them that was the last straw, and they emotionally ended it quickly. JMHO.

I find it to be quite telling that in his yahoo blog (sorry I don't know how to do links) CH is quick to say TPTB did not know of an impending break up at premiere, then says we should not feel deceived by the performance at the premiere, followed by a split days later. Based on his personal experience, he understands having to keep up appearances "knowing full well what is going to come a few days later."  

I just read the attempted denial of the impending break up as an admission TPTB knew they were done and were forced to put on one final display at the premiere.

nutty1 wrote:Reality Steve said he heard talk of it for a few days before the breakup, so it wasn't a sudden thing after the red carpet event.

I thought he said he heard only on Tuesday morning, after the premiere, but still a few days before the breakup. I may be wrong though.

For the record, MeAndi doesn't have the privilege of having her unique nick name all to herself.

This was started, Season 4, and I'm so sorry I forget who the original poster was (on the other board but here as well). It started with DeAnna who was very similiar to Andi in behavior and selfishness. She was nicknamed MeAnna.

When I think of the similarities it's telling of the casting job. DeAnna is happily married with a beautiful little girl. They all get over it sooner or later.

albean99 wrote:I don't think it was sudden. I heard that there was rumors of trouble going around Tampa for a while before the breakup. Perhaps the very public appearance put them over the edge and they didn't want to pretend anymore. I was also suprised by the timing but don't think it means it was something that wasn't well thought out. If they thought there was a shot at a reconcilation they could have said it was a trial separation and not a split. Sorry but I just don't see it happening.

Just curious what your sources are. Rumors would make sense if they were trying to work through issues, but hearing rumors that a breakup was coming is a different story. Can you clarify which it is?

GuardianAngel wrote:For the record, MeAndi doesn't have the privilege of having her unique nick name all to herself.

This was started, Season 4, and I'm so sorry I forget who the original poster was (on the other board but here as well). It started with DeAnna who was very similiar to Andi in behavior and selfishness. She was nicknamed MeAnna.

When I think of the similarities it's telling of the casting job. DeAnna is happily married with a beautiful little girl. They all get over it sooner or later.

Didn't know that, but still, what I don't get, and I'm saying that with all seriousness, because I really don't understand, is how everyone knows she is selfish?

GuardianAngel wrote:For the record, MeAndi doesn't have the privilege of having her unique nick name all to herself.

This was started, Season 4, and I'm so sorry I forget who the original poster was (on the other board but here as well). It started with DeAnna who was very similiar to Andi in behavior and selfishness. She was nicknamed MeAnna.

When I think of the similarities it's telling of the casting job. DeAnna is happily married with a beautiful little girl. They all get over it sooner or later.

I never watched DeAnnas season but on Jason Mesnicks podcast (I think he was on her season) he also said that Andi is exactly like Deanna

edenpol wrote:

GuardianAngel wrote:For the record, MeAndi doesn't have the privilege of having her unique nick name all to herself.

This was started, Season 4, and I'm so sorry I forget who the original poster was (on the other board but here as well). It started with DeAnna who was very similiar to Andi in behavior and selfishness. She was nicknamed MeAnna.

When I think of the similarities it's telling of the casting job. DeAnna is happily married with a beautiful little girl. They all get over it sooner or later.

Didn't know that, but still, what I don't get, and I'm saying that with all seriousness, because I really don't understand, is how everyone knows she is selfish?

We watched two seasons of her on TV. It shone through loud and clear IMHO.

This couple started on the wrong foot. Whatever the timing of the ending, it was doomed anyway. "Love story" starting with a fiancé sleeping with another guy and looking too much into celebrity and power, what would you expect ? Some people were fans of them but some others were not and didn't drink the koolaid.
The masquerade is over as it should be.
I have never liked Andi ( too fake and famewhore) and couldn't care less about Josh ( didn't find him attractive and was not into his personality).

I'm sorry but Andi wasn't the first one and won't be the last one to sleep with a guy she didn't choose. I believe Ashley did it also, and she is now married with a kid. And many previous Bachelor/ette contestants have gone to the "glamorous life style" after the show, designing and what's not, and there is nothing wrong with that. Catherine did that, Sean was on dancing with the stars! And again, there's nothing wrong with that. They went to a reality show that people watch, of course they will become famous, and of course they will get many opportunities, and some people get caught in that and some don't, I don't think that shows anything from a person's personality. Hey, if I'm seeing a person falling in love on my tv I will want to stay updated with him and will love to see him on other projects, that means nothing.
I didn't find Andi do be mean or selfish, not on JP's season or her season, and hey, I might be wrong, but what I saw in her is a strong woman that knows what she wants.