Re: Nick Viall - Bachelorette 10 - Discussion - Thread #7

[Amberish]

I agree that some of Nick's behavior was VERY producer driven. My point is, they probably didn't let Andi in on the secret in hopes to get some juicy reaction from her on ATFR.

I know,   again.

I totally agree which is why I posted what I did a few minutes ago. If you follow my post (even without watching the scene) you can see exactly where CH stepped in to stir the pot to, IMHO, get exactly what they got. And of course they didn't let Andi in on the secret because what they want is that "spontaneous / real" response - that's how they get these things on film. They went to an almost unprecedented length to get drama between F2 and the lead on the ATFR and if CH hadn't stepped in they would have gotten nothing at all.

How is what CH said any different from any other season? He always asks and he always pushes the F2 to discuss "feelings".

Moreover, isn't standard comment or question coming from every F2 related to, "when did you know"? The only difference this season is Nick went further and brought up the act of sex.

Nick knew exactly what he was saying and no way should we point to producers or CH as a reason for Nick saying what he did. Although it might make for good television, Nick chose to say what he did and because he wanted to take a swipe at Andi and Josh.

Seriously, all we really know about Nick is he's the guy that intentionally annoyed passengers in a crowded plan, enough so that a passenger recorded a video to upload on You Tube, and he's the guy that intentionally embarrassed Andi and Josh during the ATFR by letting America know he and Andi had sex.

[isittrue]

I agree that some of Nick's behavior was VERY producer driven. My point is, they probably didn't let Andi in on the secret in hopes to get some juicy reaction from her on ATFR.

I know,   again.

I totally agree which is why I posted what I did a few minutes ago. If you follow my post (even without watching the scene) you can see exactly where CH stepped in to stir the pot to, IMHO, get exactly what they got. And of course they didn't let Andi in on the secret because what they want is that "spontaneous / real" response - that's how they get these things on film. They went to an almost unprecedented length to get drama between F2 and the lead on the ATFR and if CH hadn't stepped in they would have gotten nothing at all.

How is what CH said any different from any other season? He always asks and he always pushes the F2 to discuss "feelings".

Moreover, isn't standard comment or question coming from every F2 related to, "when did you know"? The only difference this season is Nick went further and brought up the act of sex.

Nick knew exactly what he was saying and no way should we point to producers or CH as a reason for Nick saying what he did. Although it might make for good television, Nick chose to say what he did and because he wanted to take a swipe at Andi and Josh.

Seriously, all we really know about Nick is he's the guy that intentionally annoyed passengers in a crowded plan, enough so that a passenger recorded a video to upload on You Tube, and he's the guy that intentionally embarrassed Andi and Josh during the ATFR by letting America know he and Andi had sex.

I wasn't going to respond, but doesn't your post contradict itself - you state that we really don't know Nick but yet you then state that he intentionally annoyed passengers on the plane and intentionally embarrassed Andi and Josh.  If we really don't know Nick - then how do we know what his intentions were, or if he even had any?

Cute puppy by the way.

[Lucas15]

How is what CH said any different from any other season? He always asks and he always pushes the F2 to discuss "feelings".

Moreover, isn't standard comment or question coming from every F2 related to, "when did you know"? The only difference this season is Nick went further and brought up the act of sex.

Nick knew exactly what he was saying and no way should we point to producers or CH as a reason for Nick saying what he did. Although it might make for good television, Nick chose to say what he did and because he wanted to take a swipe at Andi and Josh.

Seriously, all we really know about Nick is he's the guy that intentionally annoyed passengers in a crowded plan, enough so that a passenger recorded a video to upload on You Tube, and he's the guy that intentionally embarrassed Andi and Josh during the ATFR by letting America know he and Andi had sex.

CH asked a very specific question of Andi (did you ever love Nick - or parts of Nick) and it was her answer to that question to hit a nerve in Nick. Had CH not asked anyone anything the discussion between Andi and Nick would have been over is just over one minute and the preceeding 26 minutes of air time devoted to Andi and Nick would have been the anti-climax of the cerntury so I don't blame him for doing something. But I do believe he knew what buttons to push to get a dramatic response from Nick.

I do however agree totally that what Nick said was not blurted out and it wasn't really a question he wanted an answer to (at least I hope not because it was never answered) it was more of a statement with a probable intent to take a swipe at Andi.

[mindless]

I actually think CH was just trying to be helpful by asking specific questions, since Nick seemed pretty much frozen at that point (probably by the chilly breeze wafting from her direction) and wasn't really getting any answers because of it.

[ironcat]

IIRC, Nick was actually surprisingly inarticulate from the moment he got on stage. I found it interesting that when he finally got the audience it seemed he sought for over two months, he got all tongue tied and mumbly. Nerves I guess.

[Acrunch]

I actually think CH was just trying to be helpful by asking specific questions, since Nick seemed pretty much frozen at that point (probably by the chilly breeze wafting from her direction) and wasn't really getting any answers because of it.

He was frozen and stumbling all over himself even before Andi came out on stage and that's not the first time I saw him unable to get words out. Contrary to popular belief, Andi is not responsible for all the wrongs in the world, .

[Alanna]

IIRC, Nick was actually surprisingly inarticulate from the moment he got on stage.  I found it interesting that when he finally got the audience it seemed he sought for over two months, he got all tongue tied and mumbly.  Nerves I guess.

He lost all my sympathy with what he said after, but when they first got on stage, I felt so bad. Regardless of how this all ended, I think he did love her or thought he loved her, at least.

[Lucas15]

IIRC, Nick was actually surprisingly inarticulate from the moment he got on stage.  I found it interesting that when he finally got the audience it seemed he sought for over two months, he got all tongue tied and mumbly.  Nerves I guess.

One thing that I saw on the ATFR was not only that he was tongue tied and mumbled, but as soon as Andi answered CH's question that she never loved Nick, his hands started to shake - with emotion perhaps? Contrary to what many seem to have seen, IMHO it was not Andi's demeanor that made an impact on Nick at the ATFR - it was her answer to that CH question that triggered Nick's emotions.

Do you think that it's possible that Nick was expecting something very different from what happened?

Nick was certainly aware that Jason had "changed his mind" and on an ATFR he had broken up with Melissa and rekindled a relationship with Molly. I would not expect that Nick would have known that Jason and Molly had actually broken up 2 months earlier and the on camera breakup was staged (the handling of which was carefully negotiated by Melissa to be the way she wanted it handled) - to an average viewer it appeared that they broke up on camera.

Bennet had been to Milwaukee and done all the filming and Nick had sent a letter (through CH and the show producers) that set out at least a wishfulness on his part that Andi would reconsider her choice and give them a chance, but he had not really received any answer to his letter and I think Nick could have been expecting that the ATFR would be some sort of reunion between him and Andi instead of a reaffirmation of the breakup that happened in DR. IMHO all the filming and time spent with CH on live TV had to have created some expectations in Nick's mind and while the producers knew exactly what Andi was going to do they would not have told Nick that - they would have allowed him to think otherwise or manipulated him to think otherwise - that's just what they do.

[mindless]

IIRC, Nick was actually surprisingly inarticulate from the moment he got on stage.  I found it interesting that when he finally got the audience it seemed he sought for over two months, he got all tongue tied and mumbly.  Nerves I guess.

Well I think Andi was the only audience he was seeking and instead he got a whole studio full of people and millions at home watching. Any normal person would be nervous in his position. I think it was the first time he was live on television and he was about to meet the woman who had been on his mind every day for the past 4 months after just watching her dump him. Not to mention it was his only chance to get some answers. I think his nervousness just proved how real he was being. That's why I find it so appalling that Andi favoured that tweet about him acting. She may be a pro TV actress, but Nick isn't. No need to project her own behaviour on him. Bit of a narcissistic thing to do.

[ironcat]

IIRC, Nick was actually surprisingly inarticulate from the moment he got on stage.  I found it interesting that when he finally got the audience it seemed he sought for over two months, he got all tongue tied and mumbly.  Nerves I guess.

One thing that I saw on the ATFR was not only that he was tongue tied and mumbled, but as soon as Andi answered CH's question that she never loved Nick, his hands started to shake - with emotion perhaps? Contrary to what many seem to have seen, IMHO it was not Andi's demeanor that made an impact on Nick at the ATFR - it was her answer to that CH question that triggered Nick's emotions.

Do you think that it's possible that Nick was expecting something very different from what happened?

Nick was certainly aware that Jason had "changed his mind" and on an ATFR he had broken up with Melissa and rekindled a relationship with Molly. I would not expect that Nick would have known that Jason and Molly had actually broken up 2 months earlier and the on camera breakup was staged (the handling of which was carefully negotiated by Melissa to be the way she wanted it handled) - to an average viewer it appeared that they broke up on camera.

Bennet had been to Milwaukee and done all the filming and Nick had sent a letter (through CH and the show producers) that set out at least a wishfulness on his part that Andi would reconsider her choice and give them a chance, but he had not really received any answer to his letter and I think Nick could have been expecting that the ATFR would be some sort of reunion between him and Andi instead of a reaffirmation of the breakup that happened in DR. IMHO all the filming and time spent with CH on live TV had to have created some expectations in Nick's mind and while the producers knew exactly what Andi was going to do they would not have told Nick that - they would have allowed him to think otherwise or manipulated him to think otherwise - that's just what they do.

I do think that's a possibility, Lucas.  The producers really knew how to play Nick like a fiddle, and they are certainly not above continuing to manipulate him months after filming ended if it suited them, by hinting to him that Andi might use the ATFR for pulling a Mesnick, or at the very least, indicating that she was having some second thoughts about her decision.   Thinking that he still might have had a chance with her would certainly explain the excessive nervousness and inability to utter coherent sentences for a guy who had previously appeared to have no problem being so eloquent and witty on camera.  And if that is what went down, he no doubt was gobsmacked once again by her behavior, which would have been the opposite of what he was expecting.  Not really surprising to me that his gut reaction after that was to drop the sex bomb.  Evil, evil producers.  

[Sable]

IIRC, Nick was actually surprisingly inarticulate from the moment he got on stage.  I found it interesting that when he finally got the audience it seemed he sought for over two months, he got all tongue tied and mumbly.  Nerves I guess.

One thing that I saw on the ATFR was not only that he was tongue tied and mumbled, but as soon as Andi answered CH's question that she never loved Nick, his hands started to shake - with emotion perhaps? Contrary to what many seem to have seen, IMHO it was not Andi's demeanor that made an impact on Nick at the ATFR - it was her answer to that CH question that triggered Nick's emotions.

Do you think that it's possible that Nick was expecting something very different from what happened?

Nick was certainly aware that Jason had "changed his mind" and on an ATFR he had broken up with Melissa and rekindled a relationship with Molly. I would not expect that Nick would have known that Jason and Molly had actually broken up 2 months earlier and the on camera breakup was staged (the handling of which was carefully negotiated by Melissa to be the way she wanted it handled) - to an average viewer it appeared that they broke up on camera.

Bennet had been to Milwaukee and done all the filming and Nick had sent a letter (through CH and the show producers) that set out at least a wishfulness on his part that Andi would reconsider her choice and give them a chance, but he had not really received any answer to his letter and I think Nick could have been expecting that the ATFR would be some sort of reunion between him and Andi instead of a reaffirmation of the breakup that happened in DR. IMHO all the filming and time spent with CH on live TV had to have created some expectations in Nick's mind and while the producers knew exactly what Andi was going to do they would not have told Nick that - they would have allowed him to think otherwise or manipulated him to think otherwise - that's just what they do.

I do think that's a possibility, Lucas.  The producers really knew how to play Nick like a fiddle, and they are certainly not above continuing to manipulate him months after filming ended if it suited them, by hinting to him that Andi might use the ATFR for pulling a Mesnick, or at the very least, indicating that she was having some second thoughts about her decision.   Thinking that he still might have had a chance with her would certainly explain the excessive nervousness and inability to utter coherent sentences for a guy who had previously appeared to have no problem being so eloquent and witty on camera.  And if that is what went down, he no doubt was gobsmacked once again by her behavior, which would have been the opposite of what he was expecting.  Not really surprising to me that his gut reaction after that was to drop the sex bomb.  Evil, evil producers.  

And while the producers were whispering in Nick's ear about the possibility of Andi pulling a Mesnick and taking him back, they were probably whispering in Andi's ear about how much Nick was obsessed with her and wouldn't let her go. I also think the producers played up Andi's insecurity about Josh and probably planted the seed of doubt in Andi's mind that Josh wouldn't be there for her for the long haul. I agree evil, evil producers, indeed.

[Lucas15]

Do you think that it's possible that Nick was expecting something very different from what happened?

I do think that's a possibility, Lucas...And if that is what went down, he no doubt was gobsmacked once again by her behavior, which would have been the opposite of what he was expecting.  Not really surprising to me that his gut reaction after that was to drop the sex bomb.  Evil, evil producers.  

We will probably never know exactly what the producers did say to Nick (as an explanation for why they were in Milwaukee filming) but I would bet substantially that it was NOT something like:

She's been essentially living with Josh since they got back from filming and she seems to us to be very happy with her decision. Nick we think you need to let this go and move on.

And while the producers were whispering in Nick's ear about the possibility of Andi pulling a Mesnick and taking him back, they were probably whispering in Andi's ear about how much Nick was obsessed with her and wouldn't let her go.  I also think the producers played up Andi's insecurity about Josh and probably planted the seed of doubt in Andi's mind that Josh wouldn't be there for her for the long haul.   I agree evil, evil producers, indeed.  

While I don't think we'll ever know if that was what they did do I also think that's something they would do; they don't stop short of doing anything they can to set two people on a collision course and then creating a stage for that drama to play out. I have observed that I saw Andi as guarded and that's exactly what I would expect from anyone who had been fed a line of BS about an obsession.

[Sponsored content]