Andi Dorfman & Josh Murray - Bachelorette 10 - General Discussion

mindless wrote:I think it's fine to say you dislike someone, but essentially calling them bad people or the kind of people you "don't associate with", is just really arrogant. Saying it in public next to your fiancée, who has probably had sex with both of those people, makes you look like a bitter fool. JMO.

Alanna wrote:How did this become Andi's fault?? It's not like she's his mom, not like he listens to her either these days, but what should Andi have said or done? Naughty Corner on the Sad Chair for you, Josh!

mindless wrote:I think it's fine to say you dislike someone, but essentially calling them bad people or the kind of people you "don't associate with", is just really arrogant. Saying it in public next to your fiancée, who has probably had sex with both of those people, makes you look like a bitter fool. JMO.

Ash2214 wrote:I truly don't understand it. We all sit here judging who is good or bad and we don't even know these people. Andi had almost two months worth of experiences with Juan Pablo and Nikki is her close friend. Josh has heard all of that.

You're all asking Josh who does he think he is to judge who is good or bad, technically, aren't we all doing the same? At least Josh has real life experiences to go off of in regards to Juan Pablo. We all sit here judging people that we don't even know.

Just like you all don't like Josh or Andi, Josh doesn't like Juan Pablo.

stuckinsc wrote:Okay, so I don't post in the fan thread, but I do feel the need to say this here.  

I have had two mother-in-laws and one almost mother-in-law.  I have seen my mother be the nosy always in her kids's business mother-in-law.  

My almost mother-in-law didn't become MIL partly because I couldn't stand that we didn't get along and also because it wasn't fair to my boyfriend and the tension of she and I not getting along hurt my relationship with him.  Over five years we went from being the "perfect" couple as all our friends told me to two people who were making each other miserable.  It didn't feel good to feel like I was never enough.  At the end of the day, I could have done more to make get along with her, but I wasn't willing to back down and neither was she.  That is both of our faults.  I did spend lots of time with her and her family, so in no way did I try to separate her son from her, but I wasn't willing to back down on my beliefs.  I will say at 22 I thought I knew everything and if it had been even ten years later I might not have felt so strongly about not backing down.  

That relationship did teach me how important it was to me to get along with MIL.  And my two have both been awesome, to the point the first one actually encouraged me to divorce her son because she hated what we were going through and hated to watch her son be mean.  We were great friends and I loved her as much as my own mother.

My second MIL has been as wonderful and a real rock for me as I lost my father and had issues with my own mother and family.  She has been wonderful about telling me that mothers should not hurt their children the way my mother does to me.  

But in both those cases my awesome MILs let me set the pace of my relationship with them.  They looked for me to guide them on how close I wanted to be with them.  They were both very sensitive to the fact that I had a mother and they in no way wanted her or me to feel that they were trying to replace her.

My mother was the opposite.  She expected to be included and was upset when she wasn't it.  If she was not acknowledged as mother and given her due, she would be angry and either pout, cry or be nasty. She loves but with a price and has not always been easy to get along with.

The difference I saw in my life and the women who have set the examples is that the best relationships came when the DIL or even SIL reached out and tried to involve the MIL in their lives.  It made a huge difference.  And I know for me is what I want and need.

I see Josh definitely reaching out to the Dorfmans a lot.  We have seen little of Andi with the Murrays.  Yes, it is harder because they are farther away, but as I have stated my MIL is over six hours away, so it can be done.  I don't know why the interaction hasn't happened, but I would love to see Andi reach out to spend more time with the Murray woman.  Right now she may be busy with weddings stuff, but she isn't working so her schedule is much more flexible than it will be if she starts working again.

I am not blaming her, but I do think if she was to make the effort to spend more time in Athens or Tampa or maybe arrange a Dorfman/Murray ladies spa weekend or something in ATL it could make a big difference.

Again, she is not to blame, but being the one to extend the olive branch can make a big difference in the long run.

All of this as always is in my opinion.

MiaHawk wrote:

nannymargie wrote:

Bet2Win wrote:Just caught up reading this thread and smgate.  If I were Josh's mother, there are several things that would cause me concern as his mother and I would discuss these things with him:

1.  The way Andi spoke to JPG after the FD.
2.  The way Andi spoke to Eric, and yelled at the rest of the guys.
3.  Sleeping with another man within a few days of getting engaged to my son.
4.  The hypocrisy she exhibited at the AFTR with Nick regarding what happens in the FS is private ~ she outed what happened in the FS with JPG.

If MM had this type of conversation with Josh, I could see it being problematic for Josh.

Well I guess Andi speaks her mind and good for her.  Could she handle things better  sure but we have all done things that we regret and which we could do different.

As far as #3 I am sure she would be more worried about pictures of Aaron on the internet of him with a girl.  To be honest I would think more of Andi knowing that she was completely honest with Josh about what happened with Nick knowing that Josh could have walked away and not propose. It was up to Josh on what he wanted to do with that information.  MM said that everyone has a past and Josh and Andi's relationship started the day he put a ring on her finger.

I just pop in from time to time to read, and I don't really follow all of the stuff very closely.  I'm not entirely sure what is or is not an issue these days for Andi and Josh, and quite frankly, I don't even care to speculate.  But, the line I've bolded above caught my eye.  

It's true that MM, Josh, and Andi can all have the mindset that Josh and Andi's relationship started the day he put a ring on her finger, and that's fine with me if they choose to look at it that way.  It's a weird reality tv dating show.  That's their perogative.  However, Andi's character didn't just appear on the day she got her ring. Her character is something she's been building her whole life. Her character is what has been the driving force behind all of her actions (as listed by the OP above). You can say that "Andi and Josh" started the day of the proposal, but "Andi" started 27 years prior. She is who she is. A relationship might change her in small ways, but her core had already been established way before she ever laid eyes on Josh. MM and Josh can choose to turn a blind eye to what occurred in Andi's life prior to the proposal, but, really, they're fooling noone but themselves.  And every time there's just a morsel of friction between any of them, MM and Josh will turn and look over their shoulders at those little red flags they chose not to acknowledge. When somebody shows you who they are, you should believe them. Rose-colored glasses do no good.    

GuardianAngel wrote:

soccermom333 wrote:

luvlady345 wrote:

But the thing is Andi/Nikki are friends so we as fans don't know what is going on behind the scenes.....

Exactly!  Andi and Nikki are very good friends and clearly talk.  Obviously we don't have the whole story and clearly Juan and Nikki are not together... IMO.  ;)  Andi wants Nikki in her wedding.  ;)

I can tell you I wouldn't be her friend if she said that about my other half. I give Nikki a lot of credit. Who said Nikki/JPG are not together??

Ash2214 wrote:I truly don't understand it. We all sit here judging who is good or bad and we don't even know these people. Andi had almost two months worth of experiences with Juan Pablo and Nikki is her close friend. Josh has heard all of that.

You're all asking Josh who does he think he is to judge who is good or bad, technically, aren't we all doing the same? At least Josh has real life experiences to go off of in regards to Juan Pablo. We all sit here judging people that we don't even know.

Just like you all don't like Josh or Andi, Josh doesn't like Juan Pablo.

Kashathediva wrote:I think if these quotes are false, it will come out in the wash very soon and be refuted.