Bachelorette 10 - Andi Dorfman - Episode 10 - Men Tell All - July 21/14 *Spoilers & Sleuthing* - Discussion 2

cindebugg wrote:

eirekay wrote:

cindebugg wrote:How blindsided could he have been?  There was always the chance she wouldn't pick him.  He was up against Josh Murray for crying out loud.  Her type from her hometown.

How blindsided would Josh be if he wasn't F1?  IMO, Andi give both Josh and Nick equal reason to believe they were "the one".  If it weren't for the video, I don't think I could handicap which one comes out on top.  I see positives and negatives with each of these men.

I don't know. I do know that Josh has mentioned several times that she's doing the choosing.  They're showing us he's aware it could end up not being him.

 I thought it was Josh before I knew about the video. B2M group date alone time told me she was already gone for him.

I thought so to cindebugg. in fact I thought she was goner by night 2 in the garden when she practically begging for him to kiss her (ie.. your blushing .. why are you blushing ..and pulling him close.  

MiaHawk wrote:

moflan wrote:I'm basing this on my experience only and in my opinion only, but even after a broken engagement, I didn't speak disrespectfully of my ex and my friends also didn't trash talk him, especially because they didn't know if I would reconcile with him. What would it say about me if the person I thought I'd be marrying was suddenly a jerk? I didn't like his behavior or actions, but I never stopped respecting him or myself. IMO, the "love" was only surface level if one can switch opinions that quickly.

As an aside, I thought it was interesting that what Andi shared from Nick's hometown is that his family was more concerned about him getting hurt than they were about how Andi and Nick were as a couple with a future ahead of them.

This was my take on the bolded.  I felt that at the time of A & N's FD conversation (when that comment was made ITM), Andi already knew that she was going to pick Josh.  She was trying to gauge from Nick how he handled his previous break-ups (knowing that she was going to break up with him) because on his HTD his family said that past break-ups have hit him hard.  I think she was digging up information to keep in mind for the future when she would let him go.  

I also think that perhaps Nick's family didn't fawn over Andi as much as Josh's did.  Like Marcus' brother Conrad said to Marcus: He thought Andi was fun and down to earth (I think those were the 2 comments) and that Marcus didn't have to prove anything to them and Andi didn't have to prove anything to them.  If they were happy as a couple, that was all that mattered.  It is my belief that Nick's family may have had a similar attitude and placed the responsibility for vetting Andi squarely on Nick's shoulders, as they were only spending one day with her. I think Nick's family also voiced a reasonable concern for Nick getting hurt as, at that point, he had only a 25% chance of being her guy.  Others might add that MeAndi didn't feel like the center of attention on Nick's HTD.  But, really, in a household of....how many people?  13?  How could anyone ever be the center of attention.  JMHO.  

I usually agree with you Mia, but this time, I have a different take on that particular episode:
The home town date episode went great. I think Viall family did make Andi feel the center of the attention. They practically invited her into their home almost as a star. Everyone had chance to talk to her. She sat down on mini 1on1 with 4 Nick's sisters to answer their questions. We only got to see 2 of those moments, one with the oldest sister and one with the youngest (and the cutest). She had a talk with both of his parents, even though we only hear Nick's dad inviting Andi for a private conversation after the dinner. So I actually don't buy the story Andi tells in the next episode ... in Dominican Republic. She left the HTD with "family on board, green light, let's go" ... coming to DR with "a doubt how Nick handled the past breakups". I think it was all BS, just for the story plot and as a trigger, to make Nick open up and explain how he changed and matured, so that he can take the new relationship more realistically and with an open heart (with no fear).

As for the post above, I don't think Nick was being disrespectful of Andi in the video, so if he is a heartbroken dumpee, I think he continued stay "classy". I only hear him analytically summing up the ending (if that's what it was) and his 1-2 adjectives with which he describes her can hardly be taken as offenses (it's more offensive if it isn't true, but I read here people talking about Andi with much more colorful adjectives, and it's fine for everyone).
From what we could learn about Nick is that he indeed is very rational and sensible person, who thinks of every action logically and likes to predict the consequences (be ready, know the ground) and only in rare moments when he does become emotional or talks about emotions, he starts to "stutter", ramble.

ironcat wrote:It seems that the only guys who complained about Nick on the (edited) show, or have made less than 100% flattering comments about his behavior post show are those who made it into the top 6.  I suspect that is where the rubber really hit the road and actual feelings for Andi started to get involved.  And I don't doubt that people like Marquel and JJ didn't see any side of Nick but a great one, partly because I imagine Nick knew that neither one ever stood a chance with Andi.

  Marquel's experience with Nick was a much different one compared to some of the others, IMO. I'm not surprised he's cheering him on.

kellkell wrote:Marquel's experience with Nick was a much different one compared to some of the others, IMO.  I'm not surprised he's cheering him on.

True. I just prefer to make to my own opinion and come to my own conclusions of people's character/personality/intentions,..., based on what I see, feel, understand, by trying to envision myself in their situation and how would I react and what might be the right or the best course of action, but since nobody is perfect and we all make mistake, I wouldn't blame anyone for making a bad move, if later they realize and acknowledge the situation. I don't like one guy or hate the other, because "my favorite said so".

I like Nick, I like Josh, I even like Marcus, who openly honest said that he doesn't like Nick ... and he doesn't need to, it's fine ... not all of us get along with everyone, sometimes because we tend to suffer our own insecurities and because people sometimes unconsciously tend to press our "wrong buttons" or sour points... So does that mean I can't like both of them? It certainly doesn't mean that l need to put Nick down for being selfish/arrogant to Marcus, or put Marcus down for calling Nick D*word. They may not see eye to eye, but I have my own eyes to observe.

*Kellkell, to be clear, this is not a response to you, but my comment and opinion I'd like to share with all, I just used your quote to state my view.

sdmom wrote:Can we just agree that Josh and Nick both made friends in and outside of house? Some are better friends with Josh and some with Nick.  There's nothing wrong with it.
ETA: eirekay: looks like we posted at the same time!  

ITA. we can fight all we want. It's Andi's decision who is the best match for her, and we will soon know who she chose. To each his own.

kellkell wrote:

ironcat wrote:It seems that the only guys who complained about Nick on the (edited) show, or have made less than 100% flattering comments about his behavior post show are those who made it into the top 6.  I suspect that is where the rubber really hit the road and actual feelings for Andi started to get involved.  And I don't doubt that people like Marquel and JJ didn't see any side of Nick but a great one, partly because I imagine Nick knew that neither one ever stood a chance with Andi.

  Marquel's experience with Nick was a much different one compared to some of the others, IMO.  I'm not surprised he's cheering him on.

This (Marquel's) was before things got serious. See, all those things were said when there was only six left. That's when things get serious and people's true colors come out. IMO This question from Nick's sister was a red flag. "Can you be you w/out apology". To me it meant, there was a side of Nick that Andi might not like if she sees it "the real him".
Honestly, I didn't care much about what the guys said about him, even the snick didn't bother me. What turned me off and most of the viewers off was 1.what he said himself, with his own words about the others.2 what he said on the plane video 3 FS RC, they both believe that what they have with the Lord can't compare with the other, and should not be concerned. Fine. But, he had to add" I don't know why she just didn't send both home". hummm, this cocky attitude and condescending words about the others is what me and 90% of the viewers don't like about him. Therefore we think he not a good match for Andi who wants someone kind and respectful to others.JMO

Maggenzm wrote:

kellkell wrote:

ironcat wrote:It seems that the only guys who complained about Nick on the (edited) show, or have made less than 100% flattering comments about his behavior post show are those who made it into the top 6.  I suspect that is where the rubber really hit the road and actual feelings for Andi started to get involved.  And I don't doubt that people like Marquel and JJ didn't see any side of Nick but a great one, partly because I imagine Nick knew that neither one ever stood a chance with Andi.

  Marquel's experience with Nick was a much different one compared to some of the others, IMO.  I'm not surprised he's cheering him on.

This (Marquel's) was before things got serious. See, all those things were said when there was only six left. That's when things get serious and people's true colors come out. IMO This question from Nick's sister was a red flag. "Can you be you w/out apology". To me it meant, there was a side of Nick that Andi might not like if she sees it "the real him".
Honestly, I didn't care much about what the guys said about him, even the snick didn't bother me. What turned me off and most of the viewers off was 1.what he said himself, with his own words about the others.2 what he said on the plane video 3 FS RC, they both believe that what they have with the Lord can't compare with the other, and should not be concerned. Fine. But, he had to add" I don't know why she just didn't send both home". hummm, this cocky attitude and condescending words about the others is what me and 90% of the viewers don't like about him. Therefore we think he not a good match for Andi who wants someone kind and respectful to others.JMO

I think it's a defense mechanism. Look at how he was acting versus Josh at that rc. Josh didn't say anything that we saw but his behavior, all up in her face, loudly smacking kisses, etc., were so LOUD without saying a word. Nick otoh seemed timid despite what he was saying. I think he's probably a great salesman but I don't think his confidence is "real" when it comes to women, or at least Andi.

Maggenzm wrote:

kellkell wrote:

ironcat wrote:It seems that the only guys who complained about Nick on the (edited) show, or have made less than 100% flattering comments about his behavior post show are those who made it into the top 6.  I suspect that is where the rubber really hit the road and actual feelings for Andi started to get involved.  And I don't doubt that people like Marquel and JJ didn't see any side of Nick but a great one, partly because I imagine Nick knew that neither one ever stood a chance with Andi.

  Marquel's experience with Nick was a much different one compared to some of the others, IMO.  I'm not surprised he's cheering him on.

This (Marquel's) was before things got serious. See, all those things were said when there was only six left. That's when things get serious and people's true colors come out. IMO This question from Nick's sister was a red flag. "Can you be you w/out apology". To me it meant, there was a side of Nick that Andi might not like if she sees it "the real him".
Honestly, I didn't care much about what the guys said about him, even the snick didn't bother me. What turned me off and most of the viewers off was 1.what he said himself, with his own words about the others.2 what he said on the plane video 3 FS RC, they both believe that what they have with the Lord can't compare with the other, and should not be concerned. Fine. But, he had to add" I don't know why she just didn't send both home". hummm, this cocky attitude and condescending words about the others is what me and 90% of the viewers don't like about him. Therefore we think he not a good match for Andi who wants someone kind and respectful to others.JMO

I love the bolded. This is something we all want in life and especially with the person we are in a significant relationship(chained) with. 

See--I get what sis means and I get Nick. See my statement above. Do I love my husband. Yes. Are there times I want to    of course. More importantly, there are times he wants to      :Furious:     .  But he still loves me!   

This is what makes Nick individually Nick. Love 'em or leave 'em.  
I can absolutely see myself saying many of the things he has said--both blatantly blunt and sensitive. The show did not emphasize his sensitive side as much, but he obviously has a strong one as evidenced with his family.

Didn't Brian and Nick butt heads toward the end?

melanie1 wrote:Didn't Brian and Nick butt heads toward the end?

Post-show they seem to be good friends.

melanie1 wrote:Didn't Brian and Nick butt heads toward the end?

Yes. Brian didn't like Nick at all during filming but it seems they are good buddies now that the show is over.

philphan wrote:

melanie1 wrote:Didn't Brian and Nick butt heads toward the end?

Yes. Brian didn't like Nick at all during filming but it seems they are good buddies now that the show is over.

It seems the same is true for Chris and Nick...