Episode 8 (HTD's) - 2/18 - Bachelor 17 - Discussion - Spoilers

I know that they had the Tierra show to produce but would it have hurt them to have included a few more meaningful moments between Sean with Catherine and Lindsay - even if they had been brief snippets? The average viewer doesn't fill in the blanks with the other forms of content and uh, "the research" that we have at our disposal here.

Back in the day at Fort, I believe there was someone who tracked the screen time of the contestants...Tierra, along with AshLee and Desiree, must be easily be in the top 3. I think Daniella had more ITMs than either Lindsay or Catherine, too. It's just bizarre that both of the F2 are seen as unknowns at this point.

sophienette wrote:In the past, the hits on my blog seemed to have matched with fan favourites (based on things like twitter followers) and of course the drama makers... Removing the spoiled F1 (Jef, Cat, Courtney, JP...) of course!

Em's season was won by Sean by a mile over Arie.

Ashley's had more for Constantine until he left, way ahead of Ben.
This season... (removing Cat and Tierra who got hits from drama and are way on top)
1) Selma
2) Ashlee
3) Sarah
4) Lindsey
5) Lesley
6) Desiree

Another titbit, Cat is 3rd all-time views, after JEMKI and JEF, but way before Courtney (who was F1 and drama).

I think it is interesting that Lindsey is quite far considering she is spoiled F2. And Desiree, if she really is a fan favourite, well...
Ashlee is definitively getting people interested.

Thanks sophienette. I think that's very telling. Lindsay is buried despite being spoiled f2. My friends treat her as a drama filler. Not serious. Usually the dumb stunts are pulled by girls who have no chance. Been a change the last few seasons--Jef, skateboard--Lindzi, horse--but most seasons the beer can eating, manripping, singing has been done by non-serious contenders. The brides dress just buried Lindsay. And getting so drunk the 1st night.

I guess the women I know haven't caught up yet.

As far as Catherine? She is spoiled f1 but I don't blame my friends. 7 weeks in she has been the invisible woman. Last week on the group date she got a few quality minutes on the beach to relate the tough tale about dad. But in the jeep, who was shotgun? Des. Who got time alone on the swing? Des. Who got the rose? Lindsay.
That's all they've seen. I understand why they think she is a pretty dress filler.

Laurabadora14 wrote:Sean definitely has some tells in my opinion when he's with Catherine. That might be because I'm looking for them but oh well. :giggle:

Ashley had a ton of tells with JP so that was no surprise that she chose him but I think there is something similar here. Its much more subtle here because they show so little of her but he always seems different with Cat. He actually is enjoying each moment with her. I think if people just mute it they would see it because he is saying what he is fed but his actions seem to be stiff except with Catherine. It will be interesting to see what the response is over the next two weeks when the front-runners for most are gone...

I often wonder whether what I see is because I am aware of the spoilers and I see what I am expecting to. Some times I do see it, but there have been many times that even knowing the spoilers I didn't necessarily see a connection or the possibility of a lasting relationship. This time it is so clear to me that it amazes me that others don't see anything.

Some of my friends are starting to notice Catherine and how Sean is with her since the numbers have started dwindling. They still generally think Des is F1 but last weeks preview threw them and now they are not so sure. Like you, I am curious to see how the views of the general public will change after the episode tonight. Most of my unspoiled friends are just confused because even though Sean has told them he is "falling for" all of his F4, they don't see it with AshLee; they think he just likes to kiss Lindsey but can't believe he could trully be interested in the drunk, make out bandit who showed up in a wedding dress; and they think that because they have not seen much of Catherine earlier and they had their only date so late, that she is being edited to make it farther or she is being set up to be the next Bette.

Sprite wrote:

twinkletoes143 wrote:

Barbarossa wrote:

ThankMeLater wrote:I noticed some unspoiled people think Des as f1 and AshLee as f2. Some even think AshLee could be f1.

That's ALL I'm hearing from every unspoiled I know. Apparently others hear know folks who are seeing deeper into the edit.
My group tells me Ashlee has "too many issues". If I mention Catherine the only response I get is "is that the Asian girl?" If I mention Lindsay it's something negative "drunk" "ditz" (eye roll) "the bride?"

Many will be surprised I think.

Well, tonight will be Desiree's last episode, and I was thinking the "trailer trash" brother will be way more popular than Desiree after this episode. The asian one will have more screen time and by then I hope your friends will know her name. :shocked!:

Anyhow, I never remember any family member putting The Bachelor on the spot, like Desiree's brother did. I was cringing when the brother said "You are just a playboy!" after Sean said, "I'm crazy about your sister". Well Sean, you were crazy about Tierra, Desiree, Catherine and etc. The brother has the balls to say the things that are on many people's minds.

The one family I remember made me the most uncomfortable was during Brad1 when he took his F3 (Bevin?) home, and her father basically told him he wasn't good enough for his daughter because he didn't have a good enough education and that her ex husband was better even though she divorced him. I have never felt so bad for a lead because you could see it really upset and hurt Brad.

With regard to Desiree's brother, of all the people to call a playboy, he picks the religious, celibate guy. I also wish that families and viewers would just accept that some things said are just the standard line that the producers must have to carry on the show. The "journey", "opening up", "falling for multiple people"/"crazy about" multiple people, etc. are just part of the show...like CH's "this is the final rose" schtick. If they told the truth and said I'm not interested in you...you can go home now...there wouldn't be a show and then who would we be making fun of?

Bevin was Andy's F2

Bettina was Brads 1st F3

Jeepers wrote:

Sprite wrote:

twinkletoes143 wrote:

Barbarossa wrote:

ThankMeLater wrote:I noticed some unspoiled people think Des as f1 and AshLee as f2. Some even think AshLee could be f1.

That's ALL I'm hearing from every unspoiled I know. Apparently others hear know folks who are seeing deeper into the edit.
My group tells me Ashlee has "too many issues". If I mention Catherine the only response I get is "is that the Asian girl?" If I mention Lindsay it's something negative "drunk" "ditz" (eye roll) "the bride?"

Many will be surprised I think.

Well, tonight will be Desiree's last episode, and I was thinking the "trailer trash" brother will be way more popular than Desiree after this episode. The asian one will have more screen time and by then I hope your friends will know her name. :shocked!:

Anyhow, I never remember any family member putting The Bachelor on the spot, like Desiree's brother did. I was cringing when the brother said "You are just a playboy!" after Sean said, "I'm crazy about your sister". Well Sean, you were crazy about Tierra, Desiree, Catherine and etc. The brother has the balls to say the things that are on many people's minds.

The one family I remember made me the most uncomfortable was during Brad1 when he took his F3 (Bevin?) home, and her father basically told him he wasn't good enough for his daughter because he didn't have a good enough education and that her ex husband was better even though she divorced him. I have never felt so bad for a lead because you could see it really upset and hurt Brad.

With regard to Desiree's brother, of all the people to call a playboy, he picks the religious, celibate guy. I also wish that families and viewers would just accept that some things said are just the standard line that the producers must have to carry on the show. The "journey", "opening up", "falling for multiple people"/"crazy about" multiple people, etc. are just part of the show...like CH's "this is the final rose" schtick. If they told the truth and said I'm not interested in you...you can go home now...there wouldn't be a show and then who would we be making fun of?

Bevin was Andy's F2

Bettina was Brads 1st F3

Thanks. I wasn't sure since I am usually really terrible with names...all those B's are confusing.

NCGalBecca wrote:I know that they had the Tierra show to produce but would it have hurt them to have included a few more meaningful moments between Sean with Catherine and Lindsay - even if they had been brief snippets? The average viewer doesn't fill in the blanks with the other forms of content and uh, "the research" that we have at our disposal here.

Back in the day at Fort, I believed there was someone who tracked the screen time of the contestants...Tierra, along with AshLee and Desiree, must be easily be in the top 3. I think Daniella had more ITMs than either Lindsay or Catherine, too. It's just bizarre that both of the F2 are seen as unknowns at this point.

Don't mean to spam the thread, but this has been my whole point, Becca. During Ben's season, I completely dismissed Nicky (and so did everyone else) when she got the same number of dates and group roses as Catherine before hometowns. She was a dress filler.

It's been odd.

My friends don't see Des as a contender .. She went from confident to needy after her 1st 1n1 .. A down hill slid in her confidence

They see Ash as just too intense and with issues

Lindsay as should be blonde .. No depth to her .. Just giggly and kissy face

Cat as a bit of a mystery it curious about her

So far Sean's episode is all about Tierra drama and the search for the next. Bachelorette. Producers are probably campaigning for Desiree and Ashlee for the next Bachelorette due to lots of ITM interviews and the solid storyline. I have no idea why Lindsay was chosen to carry the show. I mean Lindsay is more Bachelor Pad material than Bachelorette.


The only light at the end of the tunnel for me is Sean telling Catherine that he was afraid that she was friendzoning him. He keep on saying that even on articles and interviews. She was the invisible woman in the first few episodes because she was not really putting herself out there as a serious contender, heck she was even rooting for Lesley as F1. Catherine is a Johnny come lately, but not like the others Sean's attraction for her didnt fizzle if reports are correct. The real love story after all start after this whole thing ends, the show and promos. I am just annoyed that editors and producers chose to showcase other characters like Tierra or Ashlee, storylines that I really do not care about. :/

I think people are going to fall in love with Cat in this and the next 2 episodes :)

Jeepers wrote:My friends don't see Des as a contender .. She went from confident to needy after her 1st 1n1 .. A down hill slid in her confidence

They see Ash as just too intense and with issues

Lindsay as should be blonde .. No depth to her .. Just giggly and kissy face

Cat as a bit of a mystery it curious about her

Your friends are bright. Cause that's exactly the edit the women have gotten and they have read it perfectly. If I wasn't spoiled, I would have misread it entirely.

sophienette wrote:I think people are going to fall in love with Cat in this and the next 2 episodes :)

Shame it's only going to happen after 7 weeks. They could have sold the Tierra Show and still given us a chance to know the f2 girls.
This wasn't necessary.

Barbarossa wrote:

NCGalBecca wrote:I know that they had the Tierra show to produce but would it have hurt them to have included a few more meaningful moments between Sean with Catherine and Lindsay - even if they had been brief snippets? The average viewer doesn't fill in the blanks with the other forms of content and uh, "the research" that we have at our disposal here.

Back in the day at Fort, I believed there was someone who tracked the screen time of the contestants...Tierra, along with AshLee and Desiree, must be easily be in the top 3. I think Daniella had more ITMs than either Lindsay or Catherine, too. It's just bizarre that both of the F2 are seen as unknowns at this point.

Don't mean to spam the thread, but this has been my whole point, Becca. During Ben's season, I completely dismissed Nicky (and so did everyone else) when she got the same number of dates and group roses as Catherine before hometowns. She was a dress filler.

It's been odd.

Thanks for sparking an interesting discussion, B. In any other season, I think that most sleuthers would agree that something went off the rails behind the scenes based on the edits. From my viewpoint, I do think it was Cat and Dez with Dez ahead before HTDs. Montana started the downward spiral for her, and I think she never regained ground once Cat started making headway.

I see the disaster that is Dez' date as a producer ploy to move Sean away from choosing her. I think he was genuinely confused and is indecisive, so Shay and the producers guide him into "what's best for him."

I reserve the right to modify opinions after the show, but that's my theory.