Episode 6 - 2/05 - Bachelor 17 - Discussion - Spoilers

veg_out wrote:I can understand the issues with Sean. His "I'm crazy about you" to every girl reminds me of Brad (hope he doesn't get in the same hot water!) who also enjoyed kissing girls and saying the same thing to most of them (I still heart him). Actually, Sean reminds me often of Bradford.

I digress. We're at the part of the season where the lead tends to fall from grace a bit in everyone's eyes as viewers adopt favorites and the lead holds onto or lets go of people at the show's bidding that don't align with the viewers' preferences. Knowing that Sean bent to the producers' whims last season and the way the show manipulates, I take much of his words and actions as offspring of prodding.

I do worry that the fickle edit suggests that Sean really was enjoying the ride and didn't get serious until next week. I imagine that his big sis will smack some sense into him. If Sean really is honest that he wants to stay celibate and maybe marry his F1, then I don't begrudge him the make outs. It does eerily feel like Emily's season at times, but we all knew she wasn't in it to marry.

Yes, this is that time of the season when the lead starts to piss people off. However, can he really help it? He's simply going by TPTB handbook on how to handle difficult situations.
When in doubt, make out
When in doubt, tell them how great they are
When you have nothing to say in PI, say things like, "wonderful", "amazing", or "see them as my wife"
To take up time say things like, "honestly" or "to be honest"
To make a boring season better, love on the evil one.
etc.

I still wonder if he is looking to marry someone from this show. The dates (I know made by producers) certainly don't give off the vibe of wanting to sit down and dig deeper. Almost all of them up until this point have seemed like they are going to extremes to detract from anything serious. Sean said (in a PI) during his time with Lesley on the first GD that every time they were about to kiss she would say something funny or change the subject. This is like the theme for the season. I think the extreme dates (rock climbing, concerts, theme parks with teenagers, relay races, volleyball games, pranks, etc) are making the season lack intimacy. I can't bring myself to develop strong feelings about this season. The only thing that everyone (besides us) is talking about is Tierra. It seems like the show is talked about more when there are things to hate about it. The CBS show 3 was a good example of a show that does everything "right" and flopped because while it was refreshing there wasn't much to discuss. JMO

I also wonder about the moving issue which I know is already being discussed. I think Ash and JP worked out because both made compromises and moved to support the other person. If Sean is hell bent on staying in TX I think it's going to be a problem for any of the relationships except for maybe Ashlee who already lives there. If someone really wants to find a spouse on this show, where to live cannot be a sticking point... it will never work. I hope we get to hear this addressed because we usually don't get to. Or...when in doubt, pull at Stork and pick the one who lives closest to you.

Noob - I've said many seasons ago that MF definitely tries to use the ol' "shock and awe" tactic to distract the audience. Keep everybody focused on Tierra (or Courtney or Vienna) so that they won't pay too close attention to the not-so-exciting lead :Nod:

noobsleuth wrote:

veg_out wrote:I can understand the issues with Sean. His "I'm crazy about you" to every girl reminds me of Brad (hope he doesn't get in the same hot water!) who also enjoyed kissing girls and saying the same thing to most of them (I still heart him). Actually, Sean reminds me often of Bradford.

I digress. We're at the part of the season where the lead tends to fall from grace a bit in everyone's eyes as viewers adopt favorites and the lead holds onto or lets go of people at the show's bidding that don't align with the viewers' preferences. Knowing that Sean bent to the producers' whims last season and the way the show manipulates, I take much of his words and actions as offspring of prodding.

I do worry that the fickle edit suggests that Sean really was enjoying the ride and didn't get serious until next week. I imagine that his big sis will smack some sense into him. If Sean really is honest that he wants to stay celibate and maybe marry his F1, then I don't begrudge him the make outs. It does eerily feel like Emily's season at times, but we all knew she wasn't in it to marry.

Yes, this is that time of the season when the lead starts to piss people off. However, can he really help it? He's simply going by TPTB handbook on how to handle difficult situations.
When in doubt, make out
When in doubt, tell them how great they are
When you have nothing to say in PI, say things like, "wonderful", "amazing", or "see them as my wife"
To take up time say things like, "honestly" or "to be honest"
To make a boring season better, love on the evil one.
etc.

I still wonder if he is looking to marry someone from this show. The dates (I know made by producers) certainly don't give off the vibe of wanting to sit down and dig deeper. Almost all of them up until this point have seemed like they are going to extremes to detract from anything serious. Sean said (in a PI) during his time with Lesley on the first GD that every time they were about to kiss she would say something funny or change the subject. This is like the theme for the season. I think the extreme dates (rock climbing, concerts, theme parks with teenagers, relay races, volleyball games, pranks, etc) are making the season lack intimacy. I can't bring myself to develop strong feelings about this season. The only thing that everyone (besides us) is talking about is Tierra. It seems like the show is talked about more when there are things to hate about it. The CBS show 3 was a good example of a show that does everything "right" and flopped because while it was refreshing there wasn't much to discuss. JMO

I also wonder about the moving issue which I know is already being discussed. I think Ash and JP worked out because both made compromises and moved to support the other person. If Sean is hell bent on staying in TX I think it's going to be a problem for any of the relationships except for maybe Ashlee who already lives there. If someone really wants to find a spouse on this show, where to live cannot be a sticking point... it will never work. I hope we get to hear this addressed because we usually don't get to. Or...when in doubt, pull at Stork and pick the one who lives closest to you.

It was "addressed" last night via Twitter:


anitafajita‏@anitafajita
@SeanLowe09 Do you think you're going to move to LA?? Please don't. Dallas is where it's at hollaaa.

12hSean Lowe‏@SeanLowe09
@anitafajita love dallas. Not leaving.

Thanks julychild! :WAVEY:

northernviewer wrote:

richmondrose wrote:

northernviewer wrote:I'm still disgusted with Sean for how he let Sarah go. That was a new low in Bach history. Can't believe it's pretty much being ignored and he's getting a pass on it.

I'm not watching this season but sounds like a heartless way to let Sarah go. Maybe his sister should give him a slap upside the head for his bad behaviour.

It was bad richmondrose. He came and got her when she was with all the girls, chatting and having fun. He took her out told her he was letting her go blah blah blah... and then she had to go back in to face them all and tell them she had to leave. Totally centred her out and she was devasted as she just wanted to be normal and be let go at an RC. It was the worst way possible to let her go!

Sounds to me like TPTB is trying to generate a large fan base for Sarah to possibly become the next Bachelorette. I say this because TPTB did something similar when they had Deanna "dump" Jason after letting him propose at the FRC. I remember reading somewhere that Jason was initially considered to be a "Lead" bachelor, and needed a strong fan base.

Sarah should have had the same benefit as Selma & Daniela of sticking around an extra 1-2 days at that Lake Louise resort on the company dime and hanging with the girls. They all know they might be cut at the RC, but being cut 2 days before entirely randomly is blindsiding.

OTOH if Sarah asked to go early, and TPTB granted her wish but wanted Sean to off her, then fair enough. As we can see from her PIs/ITMs, she is upset about her plight (guys think she's great but it never works out), not about losing Sean. If she walked, it's because she saw the writing on the wall, as I'm sure she would since she's used to this scenario happening in her life. So her emotional reaction would be the same, either way.

In a perfect world, Sean would tell Sarah early but then give her the choice to stay till the RC or go home now, but we'll never see that ever from this franchise.

Honestly, I think if Sean wanted to spare her the RC, he could have waited till the morning of the RC, and still had the explanatory conversation. Why cut her an entire 2 days prior?

Finally, isn't it part of the formula in these recent seasons that someone is cut (or leaves) midseason out of nowhere (i.e. not at a rose ceremony and not right after a date)? Ben's Casey S. Ali's Rated-R. Emily's Kalon. Ashley's Mickey. The reason for the cut or walk differs each time, but this mid-season plot-point is to be expected.

umngirl wrote:No one I watched with thinks any less of Sean for how he eliminated Sarah. Of course they were sad watching her be sad, but they all agreed that if he wasn't feeling it, it's better for her to not be led on. My roommate's boyfriend watched with us and his comments on it were that Sean had balls to do that, but he appreciated that he got to explain to Sarah the reasons behind it instead of simply letting her go through the rose ceremony.

I wish I could say all his other comments regarding the Tierra situation, but there are a few too many bad words and inappropriateness.

I completely agree with you on this .. Sean is not perfect .. And has said as much himself .. Sarah is a sweetheart .. Sean was not feeling it for her and I am glad as well that he got the opportunity to explain that to her...

NCGalBecca wrote:The combination of keeping Tierra and dismissing Sarah in the manner that was shown really seemed to really disgust people last night. Also, the fact that he keeps telling every girl and viewers the same thing over and over "blah blah is the total package..blah blah could be my wife.." have viewers wondering where his head is at. He's coming across as too fickle. I don't think his date with Catherine clarified the situation with average viewers either as he repeated his regular mantra and did a lot of kissing as he seems to do with everyone.

I've noticed that he never really explains what it is about Tierra that has him so enthralled though. He just makes excuses for her behavior and why he placates her.

I see lots and lots of commentary from viewers referring to him as dumb which makes me sad for him because I don't think that he is at all. It makes you wonder why they edit the show to be so extreme.

I noticed Millsy was trying to defend him and others on the show because the commentary was pretty bad. Folks were bashing the type of dates that have occurred, saying that you have to have a "sad" story to get on the show and it's depressing, calling the contestants all kinds of names. I guess that's what you get when you put so much of the focus on drama.

I've been so dissapointed in the types of dates the ladies are getting with Sean. I was really, really disappointed in the type of date that Catherine got. It makes me wondered if Sean is only in it for promotional reasons. But,that's just my opinon.

NCGalBecca wrote:I hear ya. I just thought it was funny when people called them out on what they thought was wrong with the season and even Sean's actions, they got defensive. Especially the crazy dates - people know what channel TAR and Survivor air on if they want to watch those type of events. I also think they reflected poorly on Sean a little, too.

It's almost like the producers haven't realized that even the average viewer can see through a lot of the "packaged BS" now and aren't falling for it. It's time for new tactics and strategies.

But the viewers are falling for it... look at the numbers. Maybe not the 1% that is online and more aware of the TPTB ways, but that's not the target for the millions they want to tune in each week.

2observe wrote:

NCGalBecca wrote:The combination of keeping Tierra and dismissing Sarah in the manner that was shown really seemed to really disgust people last night. Also, the fact that he keeps telling every girl and viewers the same thing over and over "blah blah is the total package..blah blah could be my wife.." have viewers wondering where his head is at. He's coming across as too fickle. I don't think his date with Catherine clarified the situation with average viewers either as he repeated his regular mantra and did a lot of kissing as he seems to do with everyone.

I've noticed that he never really explains what it is about Tierra that has him so enthralled though. He just makes excuses for her behavior and why he placates her.

I see lots and lots of commentary from viewers referring to him as dumb which makes me sad for him because I don't think that he is at all. It makes you wonder why they edit the show to be so extreme.

I noticed Millsy was trying to defend him and others on the show because the commentary was pretty bad. Folks were bashing the type of dates that have occurred, saying that you have to have a "sad" story to get on the show and it's depressing, calling the contestants all kinds of names. I guess that's what you get when you put so much of the focus on drama.

I've been so dissapointed in the types of dates the ladies are getting with Sean. I was really, really disappointed in the type of date that Catherine got. It makes me wondered if Sean is only in it for promotional reasons. But,that's just my opinon.

I thought Catherine got the best date so far. Sure the blizzard wasn't ideal, but they made the most of it. Their date was private too with no one around like safety crews, actors, crowds, etc.

Throwing in my $.02...

I think Sean had a typical guy moment and panicked when he realized that Sarah saw their relationship going to the hometown date or even further. He probably knew that there were other girls "ahead" of her in his heart. I have often seen men in the Christian culture confront other men if they feel the guy is leading on a woman that he has no intention of getting serious with. It's possible that Sean felt major guilt for misleading Sarah and felt it necessary to break it off immediately.

Unfortunately, I don't think for one moment that Sean put himself in Sarah's position and thought how she could or would take this early rejection in a more hurtful way, being set apart from the other women. Like I said, I think he just panicked and needed to get out as quick as possible. I'm not excusing Sean, but I also don't think he was intentionally being cruel. IMO, he was missing his "sensitivity chip" at that moment in time.

umngirl wrote:

2observe wrote:

NCGalBecca wrote:The combination of keeping Tierra and dismissing Sarah in the manner that was shown really seemed to really disgust people last night. Also, the fact that he keeps telling every girl and viewers the same thing over and over "blah blah is the total package..blah blah could be my wife.." have viewers wondering where his head is at. He's coming across as too fickle. I don't think his date with Catherine clarified the situation with average viewers either as he repeated his regular mantra and did a lot of kissing as he seems to do with everyone.

I've noticed that he never really explains what it is about Tierra that has him so enthralled though. He just makes excuses for her behavior and why he placates her.

I see lots and lots of commentary from viewers referring to him as dumb which makes me sad for him because I don't think that he is at all. It makes you wonder why they edit the show to be so extreme.

I noticed Millsy was trying to defend him and others on the show because the commentary was pretty bad. Folks were bashing the type of dates that have occurred, saying that you have to have a "sad" story to get on the show and it's depressing, calling the contestants all kinds of names. I guess that's what you get when you put so much of the focus on drama.

I've been so dissapointed in the types of dates the ladies are getting with Sean. I was really, really disappointed in the type of date that Catherine got. It makes me wondered if Sean is only in it for promotional reasons. But,that's just my opinon.

I thought Catherine got the best date so far. Sure the blizzard wasn't ideal, but they made the most of it. Their date was private too with no one around like safety crews, actors, crowds, etc.

I agree!