Bachelor 22 - Arie Luyendyk Jr - Episodes - Mar 6th ATFR - #2 - *Sleuthing Spoilers*

I will apologize in advance if this (and probably some other posts I will make today) seem to jump around, but after reading what's been posted during and after watching last night's episode I feel like I want to comment on many posts. I'd like to take these two first:

agentcurls wrote:

littlereddress wrote:I think Lauren does not believe Arie ever really loved Becca and that is why she is so quick to take back Arie.  She feels he was truly in love with her all along.  All my opinion.  

If Lauren was watching the show back and saw what I saw UNSPOILED, then yes, she would see that Arie didn't love Becca (facial exp, body language, emotions, etc) and that he really was DIFFERENT with her.

agentcurls wrote:So, lots of Becca love on here...for these reasons:

1) She's a great person
2) She was edited to be a really great person
3) She was the first name as an F1 spoiler and so naturally many attached themselves to her with vigor (I have been guilty of this in the past!)

Watching Unspoiled really helps you stay objective about the show and the outcome and I can see why Arie fell for Lauren. I saw a more reciprocal relationship in terms of communication. She was asking him how he was doing, checking in, and really making an effort to get to know him. She was also endearingly vulnerable with him and if she didn't let him know how she was feeling with her words, she let him know in her emotions. And to see him being really vulnerable with her as well was just really great to watch!

IMO it's really difficult when you're spoiled to avoid the trap of seeing what you want to believe instead of seeing what the show gives us with no bias towards who you think is the F1. It's a bit like reading body language - IMO it's always better (especially in the context of this show) to turn the volume off so voice overs and mood music don't distract you from what is actually on screen. This season especially there were tons of visual clues that showed the attraction between Arie and Lauren - many more than normal. The way he looked at her; the micro expressions when she said certain things; the sometimes crazy things he did when he was around her (like standing up and walking away). IMO if Lauren watched the show (and IIRC from things she said they did except for the finale episode on Monday) she would have no doubts about Arie and his feelings because it's been in full display on my TV screen ever since the Ft Lauderdale episode.

docnash14 wrote:

Aria wrote:

GuardianAngel wrote:I'm not sure what's there to laugh at when two people were in love and they go their separate ways.

As much as I disliked Andi, that was sad for many reason, personally I wouldn't laugh. MO

Key is that I don't think any of us believe it's love. Like Sharleen said in her blog, if you can't have conversations with the other person and you can't articulate your connection, it's probably just chemistry that you're confusing for love. IMO.

Not sure that none of us thinks it's love.  

Well doc I think you're right about that - some of us do think it's love. While I normally agree with Sharleen this is one time when I don't. IMO the fact that someone can't articulate why they feel the way they feel about someone doesn't mean that those feelings aren't love - in fact I think those things that we can articulate are probably not love - they are things that may look rational (on paper) to our brain but not make sense to our heart. Rational articulation of our feelings just seems to me to be so sterile. I can think of many things about my wife that I love about her but in and of themselves none really explains why I love her - I just do.

GuardianAngel wrote:What happened to the engagement at some hotel in L.A??

albean99 wrote:snip
So was that the real proposal or was RS right about them doing it earlier?

IMO there were two proposals - the one filmed at the LA hotel (which RS reported) and the one we saw live. IMO the reason they went with a live proposal instead of the filmed one was that it happened last night with everyone watching - thus leaving no doubt that the proposal was anything other than the latest and most current feelings between Arie and Lauren. And in typical TPTB fashion of wash / rinse / repeat of story lines, they did this (to good effect) between Ben and Lauren and just decided to do it again.

Aria wrote:

grace8136 wrote:Lauren told JKimmel they are already planning their wedding! I'm surprised CH didn't ask them about that.

I'm not. CH basically treated them like an afterthought and even open skepticism with his "I don't know how to react to that. Do I clap?" after the proposal.

And, oh, Lauren. Oh sweetie. You just started dating the guy 7 weeks ago. Isn't there anyone with a single brain cell in your life that can tell you to, you know, actually get to know the guy before you walk down the aisle?! I get the urgency to get married at the ripe old age of 26, but this is how you end up as a Jade, stuck in an unhealthy marriage. IMO.

Well that was 7 weeks longer than Becca did when she accepted his proposal

I’m seriously side eyeing their immaturity with “we are getting married right away! This year!!!!!” after all that drama. They’ve been together like what? 8 weeks? After he chose and was “engaged” to someone else? When they haven’t spent more than what? A couple safe house visits together? After someone else was hurt so badly? With all the shadiness of those calls to Lauren before the breakup to make sure she was a sure thing? Without Lauren even watching the finale to get a full picture here? They are being immature and eradic in their attempt to prove everyone wrong.  

I give Jason and Molly a lot of respect for how they handled things post show. Jason took ownernership for how he handled things wrong and how he hurt Melissa. I have yet to see this same behavior with Arie. And Jason and Molly moved at a real world pace and didn’t make massive declarations with silly “make up” proposals and bold outcries or immediate moves and marriage. I’ll wager their maturity helped them actually make it; I’m not seeing the same maturity here with switcheroo 2.0. 

I’m seeing a lot of posts defending Arie and Lauren stating how obviously Arie loved Lauren as compared to Becca. I agree. The chemistry between Arie and Lauren was alway leagues above anything he had with Becca. No doubt. That doesn’t mean they are good people, or that this is a great situation to just throw yourself in with silly “we are getting married!!!” bs the way they have. It looks idiotic and yes, disrespectful. They can be the most amazing in wuv couple and I still won’t like them for this immature display.

ReneeM wrote:Lauren may have won the electoral college but Becca won the popular vote

Your sense of humor is wicked. I am

northernviewer wrote:

Aria wrote:

grace8136 wrote:Lauren told JKimmel they are already planning their wedding! I'm surprised CH didn't ask them about that.

I'm not. CH basically treated them like an afterthought and even open skepticism with his "I don't know how to react to that. Do I clap?" after the proposal.

And, oh, Lauren. Oh sweetie. You just started dating the guy 7 weeks ago. Isn't there anyone with a single brain cell in your life that can tell you to, you know, actually get to know the guy before you walk down the aisle?! I get the urgency to get married at the ripe old age of 26, but this is how you end up as a Jade, stuck in an unhealthy marriage. IMO.

Well that was 7 weeks longer than Becca did when she accepted his proposal

Getting engaged and getting married are two separate things. Becca never said they were planning a wedding. I think the engagement itself with Lauren was stupid since both have broken engagements and, you know, Arie was engaged to another women just 7.5 FREAKING WEEKS AGO. But, as Kimmel said, "you get the ring free if you get engaged now, so okay, do that" but "SLOW THE H*L DOWN". No other successful couple started planning their wedding literally days afterwards. You take a few months to build a relationship, because as any of the couples will tell you, you've been in a bubble so far. The real relationship starts now. So take a second. Get to know each other. Then, if you still still feel in a couple of months that you love each other and are compatible, by all means! IMO.

Y

Aria wrote:

northernviewer wrote:

Aria wrote:

I'm not. CH basically treated them like an afterthought and even open skepticism with his "I don't know how to react to that. Do I clap?" after the proposal.

And, oh, Lauren. Oh sweetie. You just started dating the guy 7 weeks ago. Isn't there anyone with a single brain cell in your life that can tell you to, you know, actually get to know the guy before you walk down the aisle?! I get the urgency to get married at the ripe old age of 26, but this is how you end up as a Jade, stuck in an unhealthy marriage. IMO.

Well that was 7 weeks longer than Becca did when she accepted his proposal

Getting engaged and getting married are two separate things. Becca never said they were planning a wedding. I think the engagement itself with Lauren was stupid since both have broken engagements and, you know, Arie was engaged to another women just 7.5 FREAKING WEEKS AGO. But, as Kimmel said, "you get the ring free if you get engaged now, so okay, do that" but "SLOW THE H*L DOWN". No other successful couple started planning their wedding literally days afterwards. You take a few months to build a relationship, because as any of the couples will tell you, you've been in a bubble so far. The real relationship starts now. So take a second. Get to know each other. Then, if you still still feel in a couple of months that you love each other and are compatible, by all means! IMO.

DeAnna talked about her wedding plans with Jesse at their AFTR. This very much reminds me of that. DeAnna trying so hard to make a bad thing good.JMO.

sosleepy wrote:I’m seriously side eyeing their immaturity with “we are getting married right away! This year!!!!!” after all that drama. They’ve been together like what? 8 weeks? After he chose and was “engaged” to someone else? When they haven’t spent more than what? A couple safe house visits together? After someone else was hurt so badly? With all the shadiness of those calls to Lauren before the breakup to make sure she was a sure thing? Without Lauren even watching the finale to get a full picture here? They are being immature and eradic in their attempt to prove everyone wrong.  

I give Jason and Molly a lot of respect for how they handled things post show. Jason took ownernership for how he handled things wrong and how he hurt Melissa. I have yet to see this same behavior with Arie. And Jason and Molly moved at a real world pace and didn’t make massive declarations with silly “make up” proposals and bold outcries or immediate moves and marriage. I’ll wager their maturity helped them actually make it; I’m not seeing the same maturity here with switcheroo 2.0. 

I’m seeing a lot of posts defending Arie and Lauren stating how obviously Arie loved Lauren as compared to Becca. I agree. The chemistry between Arie and Lauren was alway leagues above anything he had with Becca. No doubt. That doesn’t mean they are good people, or that this is a great situation to just throw yourself in with silly “we are getting married!!!” bs the way they have. It looks idiotic and yes, disrespectful. They can be the most amazing in wuv couple and I still won’t like them for this immature display.

Arie and Lauren are quite possibly the biggest idiots to ever be on the show, and that's saying something. IMO.

brownravens wrote:I must confess i'm very confused as to why Lauren is getting off so easy. I know that Arie is the one that made the commitment to Becca etc but based off their own comments on JKL Lauren and Arie had waaaaay more contact than was implied at ATFR. Like this is not a cute love story it's a story of people cheating which I am not about.

I am also a firm believer in leopards not changing their spots. If Arie as been unable to maintain fidelity in the past, and this is how he and Lauren got together then yikes.

If my fiancee contacts his ex in secret without telling me, that's definitely cheating in my book. A lie is a lie is a lie. JMO

@missnana I think Arie told Becca. But he wasn’t honest about why and that it was about getting back with her, not easing his guilt.

Listening to Lauren on JKL, she is as self centered as Arie. Perhaps they are perfect for each other? 

I know I personally have no respect for her lack of empathy for Becca. 

All JMO.

Some seem to believe that it means that Becca wanted to be the Bachelorette and went along with everything because of that or that she knew about it all along and I'm not buying either of those theories, @docnash14 I also think that even if Arie felt he had to let them film the breakup, he still could have been a lot more empathetic with Becca plus he could have left sooner. Sometimes you have to think about the other person.

I found the 2nd proposal just plain creepy to watch. I kept thinking of all the things he said to Becca the first time. Maybe better to have just talked about the other one and showed her ring. Maybe they have to have the proposal on tv to get a NL ring? Lauren's ring isn't to my taste but I'm sure she's happy with it.

JK had a very valid question about why get engaged so quickly. I laughed when he said that they did it to get the NL ring. I just hope they don't rush into marriage to show everyone that they're really in love.