Vanessa Grimaldi & Josh Wolf - Bachelor 21 - Discussion

Aria wrote:@TheWrongReasons Totally OT, but are you a Blair/Dan shipper?? I was like their ONE fan, haha!

And I agree with you about the use of "agressive". It's the reason we all accused Lee of being racist as many see it as race-baiting when it used against African Americans. Wills did a great job explaining the history of it and how that word has been used to justify violence and racist policies again them. I can see why Rachel was so pissed. Nonetheless, I'm glad Rachel spoke out and this story can finally die!

Slightly off-topic, but I think people accused Lee of being a racist largely based on these tweets. Keep in mind the tweets were uncovered before the drama with Kenny began airing on the season. These tweets coupled with yes, his not so subtly coded words about Kenny is what convinced people Lee was a racist.

I don't see the word aggressive as being associated with the African American community exclusively.... Indeed, if anything, it could've been more of a reflection of the legal prosecutor persona, which is definitely what first came to mind re Rachel as far as I'm concerned. What word should vanessa have used??

Eta.... I am not familiar with the history of the word, and I'm a New Yorker. I suspect Vanessa would not have been familiar with it either. Rachel is certainly allowed to dislike the word and have a visceral response to its use in her regard, but I don't condemn Vanessa if she felt Rachel's behavior was particularly (omg off to google synonyms....) er - ok, how about hostile? - and wanted to call her on it, and that was the word that came to mind. These two gals were never gonna gel, no matter what words were used, jmo.

Corinne repeated said Taylor was a bully . Every season on these bachelor shows someone is called a bully why is it different this time?

She also said Taylor was an evil swamp monster.

I am curious, too. What would be some other alternate appropriate words?

Aria wrote:@TheWrongReasons Totally OT, but are you a Blair/Dan shipper?? I was like their ONE fan, haha!

And I agree with you about the use of "agressive". It's the reason we all accused Lee of being racist as many see it as race-baiting when it used against African Americans. Wills did a great job explaining the history of it and how that word has been used to justify violence and racist policies again them. I can see why Rachel was so pissed. Nonetheless, I'm glad Rachel spoke out and this story can finally die!

@Aria OT - yes, I'm totally #teamdair - I think we're a small but passionate group I recently became nostalgic for them because of the GG 10 year anniversary and I'm so excited for Penn's new show!

I agree with you in being glad Rachel spoke up - I edited my post to say that just when I saw yours
I also agree that Will explained the "aggressive" thing really well on Rachel's season.

bleuberry wrote:I posted back in February wondering if it was racial due to the way it was swept under the rug. Cant say I'm surprised. JMO.

Danielle's AMA and Rachel's statements are reminding me how much I disliked Vanessa back then. 

Jasmine's interview with Ashley I, recounting the "telling everyone DLo is fake and then icing her out of their clique/pretending there was no room for her in their bedroom" reminded me, haha. I said before that I see her as a more sophisticated mean girl - she's more underhanded and subtle about it and I think she puts on a good show, but if she sees you as competition, watch out. Regina George in sheep's clothing, IMO.

All that hoopla for a year over the word 'bully'? Wow!

I can see why Rachel felt the use of 'aggressive' was offensive to her and Vanessa would do well to remember it in the future IMO. But IMO context is still important. There is zero comparison between Lee and Vanessa using that word IMO. If something is said with no racial implications behind it, is it fair to imply someone is a racist?  Why just Vanessa, I felt many members of this board went through that experience during Rachel's season when words were twisted to make them seem like racists. I still can't believe that Danielle L would stoop so low irrespective of her issues with Vanessa.  

I find bullying and ganging up to be aggressive and if Vanessa felt that was the case, I can see why she said what she said. Even though I don't agree with many things Rachel said in the article, I am glad Rachel cleared up what the word was coz people were running away with all sorts of assumptions with the N-word, C-word, sl*t, etc. Still can't believe all this nonsense was over the word 'bully'. SMH.

All JMO

Well we still haven't heard Vanessa's side of the story. Everything we know so far comes from Rachel and people that weren't even there when the argument happened.
what if Rachel was using aggressive tone towards her and was being a bully (we all saw her eyes rolling couple of times on the show when Vanessa was talking) what was Vanessa supposed to say? So we can't call a POC aggressive even when they are?

https://instagram.com/p/BZkZ5dUnqR6/
Love their friendship and how they are supporting each other when needed.

lleyki wrote:So we finally hear from one of the women directly involved in the situation. And the derogatory word used was "bully". Well okay then. Don't get me wrong, Rachel is entitled to her feelings and if she felt deeply insulted by the accusation then she has a right to those feelings and that is her own truth. But I'm sorry, that being the word/insult that has garnered all this back and forth, almost a whole damn year later, to the point that a major entertainment publication picked it up, is plain ridiculous to me. 

But something tells me, that's exactly why Rachel chose to publicly address the situation this time. Because no matter how much she can't stand Vanessa, I imagine she well knows how damaging and irresponsible it is to let even the suggestion of someone making racial slurs get thrown around. And this was starting to just take on a life of its own based on nothing but some vague, casual comment thrown out by Danielle, that Vanessa called Rachel a "derogatory" word.

- IMO - The funny thing with that was Vanessa felt it first...and, Rachel felt offended by the word "bully"...people's sensitivities vary in different degrees...thus, there is really no right or wrong on this...Thank God!! The situation is actually lighter than I expected...for me, it's not really such a big deal or such big mistakes to be bickering on for so long...people should just move on...so that both, Vanessa and Rachel, can move on with their lives...Lol!!... - JMO -

Listen, V is a handful...I figured that out when she asked Nick was he here just to F*** when they had the best first date in the history of the show (IMO) what a day earlier?  What I don't understand is why Danielle keeps going back to what V said about DLo's desire to be famous because I'm almost positive I saw them at a later time...hand in hand when they were traveling and arrived at a new hotel. I saw V standing behind her with her hands on her shoulders as if they were engaging amicably after that, too. Yes, V's insecurities were coming out when she said what she did about DLo but I just didn't get the sense it was something that remained a barrier between them before she left. Nick was never going to pick DLo and V had nothing to do with that. Nick clearly stated  why he let her go. No, V doesn't play nicely at times but she clearly had a target on her back being his favorite. All you had to do is follow the squad after filming wrapped to see that much. JMO