Nick Viall - Bachelor 21 - Episode 7 Feb 13 - *Sleuthing Spoilers*

emusha wrote:snipped..
I have no idea how she interacted with the women but I suspect that she might have rubbed people the wrong way esp if they were spending a lot of time with her. she may in Montreal be used to being in an environment where she's constantly being told how amazing, beautiful and incredible she is snipped..

Just curious, why you say that only happens in Montreal? I would hope every daughter son family member is given some sort of encouragement every day regardless of where they live. Sorry if I'm misunderstanding that POV.

happygolucky wrote:

Lara wrote:

George1218 wrote:I don't doubt that she rubbed some of the girls the wrong way, just that I seriously doubt that she was as bad as some of the girls are implying.  (snipped)

Who has implied it though? (snipped)

Well, implied it was, that's why it's still very much discussed, IMO. Maybe we can blame it all on RS... but any time I read another guess of the "supposed event" it is "implied" (or actually written, always as an opinion) that Vanessa most likely was an instigator, a provoker, that she was badmouthing other girls (RS brought out about DLo, but lets make it plural for the better effect), saying things behind their back (would it make any difference if she said it to them in person?) ... and well, if that's not enough, she was also probably wrong with whatever her stance was on "unknown subject of disagreement", because clearly she can't be right* if "everyone" sided with the other party.

I don't think anyone deserves the hate. I don't know what kind of hate has Rachel received, since I'm not active on SM, but I'm mostly responding to posts here and what is brought to my attention here and I see much love for Rachel, so if I'm more outspoken about Vanessa is because there is a lot of guesses, a lot of opinions ... firstly among the girls in the house ... then comes gossip outside of "the BN house" and ... we read something that suddenly transforms into a fact and characterization of an entitled, whiny, attention-seeking, loud and demanding, cold and b**** of a woman.

Sure, sometimes it's good to be prudent with the smoke ... and look out for the fire ... but sometimes the smoke is just that ... smoke. Luckily I've never been a smoker, but unfortunately there are times when I want to have fun with friends ... and I come home smelling like ashtray. It's the scent that irritates me, so sorry for my rumbling.

i think i have been quite defensive of the other girls and i think that is because i hate it when people assume the reason women don't like other women is because they must be jealous which i keep seeing being thrown at the other girls. Maybe some of them are or maybe they have legit reasons, i guess we won't know.

One thing i do disagree with though *edit* people seem to think Vanessa is definitely this terrible bad guy, I think most have said that we don't know who was right or wrong if anyone was as we didn't see it. I think most times as well emotions are high and people can't escape each other so there is bound to be tension and that comes out in different ways. Even if we did see the argument TPTB could have skewed our perspective of it through editing as well.

I think these are both women who are getting on with their lives and are happy so good for them. I find it interesting as well that even though it was them that had the argument we see no social media or interview clues from either of them alluding to it. I guess Rachel doesn't follow Vanessa on social media though, would be interested to know whether thats the only girl she doesn't follow or if its just her lack of social media awareness and she doesn't follow a few?

coolangel wrote:

AllAboutLove wrote:

happygolucky wrote:It's also interesting that Vanessa, having "no friends" in the house had someone to talk to at all ... and to confide all those negative things she supposedly said about others.

Maybe she was talking in her sleep and the girls took notes so they could rehash them later on SM because that's one way to try to get more followers -- which is the main reason for going on this show if I am not mistaken...  

Honestly, I think I am going to be sick of most of these cliquish girls (okay I am already getting sick of them) by the time they get to go on BIP or whatever other
Bachelor--open-an-envelope event they appear at or blog they start

Maybe they heard her talking to a racoon, parrot, crab or some other animal TPTB had borrowed from the beach to keep Vanessa company since she had no friends
IMO most of these girls will do great on BIP. They'll fit perfectly with Jojo's frat boys IMO. Squad meets Garden  

Oh boy! Now that I think of that it that way I'll definitely be skipping watching BIP!!

Hopefully though after this episode things will be less drama filled....

Who Van was friends with tells me more about her than who she wasnt. Danielle M is a sweetheart and so the two of them getting close makes sense to me. IMO Vanessesa doesnt suffer fools gladly, and i dont see her cosying up to people if she didnt care for them or how they acted. The only ones i even like of the last 8 or so is Vanessa Danielle and Raven and the rest i could take or leave.

Danielle M is also friends with these alleged mean girls who've rallied together in this clique against their common enemy Vanessa though   . I don't think Vanessa's this awful person with zero redeeming qualities, I just think she's not who she presents herself to be. And based on her follow of Rachel and Rachel's lack of follow back, it's not Vanessa who doesn't 'suffer fools gladly'. All JMO.

Vanessa's best friend in the house Danielle M is one of Rachel's biggest fan on twitter, she retweets stuffs about Rachel, called her the "total package" and calls her BIG RACH(i think that is what people that are close to her call her). The dynamics between the ladies is interesting IMO

I actually remember Nick saying at the very start of media that he didn't want the best person just the best person for him (I can't remember which outlet he said this to - maybe Access Hollywood or GMA). When I heard I thought it was a bit odd BUT given the belief that "something went down" with Vanessa and the girls that makes sense that he's doing some version of justifying his choice as he wouldn't have known it would be cut.

How has Vanessa presented herself though? Because we haven't heard anything from her post-show since she's still on the show and as such is not speaking to the media or anyone really. She's told Nick family is important to her and most of her social media suggests that's true. She talks about her students and has since gone back to work and posts a lot of that on her social media.

Even Corinne, in all her shade throwing of Vanessa's having no depth, suggested that all Vanessa talks about is loving her family, having family dinners on Saturday and she's a special education teacher. Aren't all these things true? So what has Vanessa presented of herself that isn't true?

Or is it that some decided all on their own before the season premiered that she was perfect and now due to some rumors and crying and facial expressions have decided that she hasn't lived up to that halo that was put around her, she's being accused of not being true to who she really is? Nothing about Vanessa's life pre-filming seems to have changed really if you go by her social media, IMO.

She's still in Montreal with her friends and family and teaching. So what has she misrepresented? And this is why I've said that it feels like Vanessa is being judged for not living up to some unrealistic expectations that people all on their own created of her. And that's not fair IMO because Vanessa never asked anyone to treat her or act like she's perfect but some are now regarding her like that's exactly what she did. And judging her accordingly as in, "she clearly thinks she's so beautiful and perfect..."

I actually remember Nick saying at the very start of media that he didn't want the best person just the best person for him (I can't remember which outlet he said this to - maybe Access Hollywood or GMA). When I heard I thought it was a bit odd BUT given the belief that "something went down" with Vanessa and the girls that makes sense that he's doing some version of justifying his choice as he wouldn't have known it would be cut.

Or this is Nick who was considered the villain on both of his seasons so IMO, of course he would make it clear that he wasn't going to be interested in the most liked person because that'd be kind of hypocritical on his part wouldn't it? Also, as someone who had the experience he did, he would know that popularity among the contestants during the season is not always a true reflection of who a person is or an indictment on their character.

Vanessa on the show is the same Vanessa in real life so far, IMO. Same banter of making fun of herself, being close to her loyal friends, and just doesn't care to be Ms. Congeniality on tv. There's a bunch of layers with her. It's reflected exactly the same way on her IG. Why does it matter who follows who back anyway? I follow people I don't give likes or comments on IG. Other people will choose not to follow altogether. Different strokes for different folks. It doesn't make a person's intentions bad, imo.

GuardianAngel wrote:

emusha wrote:snipped..
I have no idea how she interacted with the women but I suspect that she might have rubbed people the wrong way esp if they were spending a lot of time with her. she may in Montreal be used to being in an environment where she's constantly being told how amazing, beautiful and incredible she is snipped..

Just curious, why you say that only happens in Montreal? I would hope every daughter son family member is given some sort of encouragement every day regardless of where they live. Sorry if I'm misunderstanding that POV.

I didn't state that this only happens in Montreal, I am referring to her home where she is from which happens to be Montreal....I meant to refer to the comfort zone of the person we were discussing - Vanessa - where she is surrounded by people who adore her - family, friends, coworkers, her community she has grown up in.  

For Vanessa particularly, her comfort zone is Montreal. My main point is not about the city but my goal was to point out that any person - in this case, Vanessa- who is in their comfort zone would be used to a constant affirmation and validation rather than having to "check their behavior" in order to engage in a way that's seamless for the people they are engaging. It is my opinion that when someone is taken out of their comfort zone, socially, they would then have to "adapt" how their behavior comes across whether "strongly" or "too quietly" across to others and try to respond in a way that remains authentic to themselves while also being effective to other people's styles and temperaments. In a heightened environment like Bachworld this applies even more.

IMO when it comes to Rachel and Vanessa's SM follow/lack of follow back, I don't have a problem with either choice and I don't think it implies one suffers fools gladly and one doesn't. Personally, I am mostly a 'Rachel' when I have a huge tiff with someone - in the sense that I let it go but I don't care about having a relationship with them anymore. But I also have tremendous respect for the 'Vanessa's' who choose to let it go and extend an olive branch. I don't think one choice is better than the other and it just depends on one's personality.

What I do have a problem with are people who might not even be involved and who continue to post/like cryptic remarks which keeps SM troll hate against others active IMO. Either come out and say your piece so the other person has a chance to defend themselves or let it go. All JMO.

emusha wrote:

GuardianAngel wrote:

emusha wrote:snipped..
I have no idea how she interacted with the women but I suspect that she might have rubbed people the wrong way esp if they were spending a lot of time with her. she may in Montreal be used to being in an environment where she's constantly being told how amazing, beautiful and incredible she is snipped..

Just curious, why you say that only happens in Montreal? I would hope every daughter son family member is given some sort of encouragement every day regardless of where they live. Sorry if I'm misunderstanding that POV.

I didn't state that this only happens in Montreal, I am referring to her home where she is from which happens to be Montreal....I meant to refer to the comfort zone of the person we were discussing - Vanessa - where she is surrounded by people who adore her - family, friends, coworkers, her community she has grown up in.  

For Vanessa particularly, her comfort zone is Montreal. My main point is not about the city but my goal was to point out that any person - in this case, Vanessa- who is in their comfort zone would be used to a constant affirmation and validation rather than having to "check their behavior" in order to engage in a way that's seamless for the people they are engaging. It is my opinion that when someone is taken out of their comfort zone, socially, they would then have to "adapt" how their behavior comes across whether "strongly" or "too quietly" across to others and try to respond in a way that remains authentic to themselves while also being effective to other people's styles and temperaments. In a heightened environment like Bachworld this applies even more.

This is true of everyone... not just Vanessa ...

I think theres much ado about nothing going on, on SM..
More than likely instigated by BS.