Bachelor 21 - Nick Viall - General Discussion - *Sleuthing Spoilers* #3

My interpretation of sincere takes on different meaning in terms of the show.
What I believe the meaning to be is not "looking for that soul mate", but the sincere ability to work with TPTB and production and make the desired show.
When sincerity is looked at from this angle, and finding a successful match takes a back seat to making a successful ratings season, it takes on a different meaning. IMO

Seabear wrote:IMO the cast was originally picked with Luke in mind. However once Nick was announced as Bachelor MF, Elan and others actively were soliciting for women to apply who were interested in Nick. I don't know how much of the cast was adjusted but I think Nick and Luke have entirely different lifestyles and values and would appeal to different types of women. I imagine some fairly major casting changes and several late additions were made. CH has made it clear that they expect the ever so sincere Nick to find his HEA. 4th times a charm.
JMO

I hope you're right, but personally, I question whatever CH/TPTB say.
Ok if Nick finds his soul mate, but they'll happily make him out to be a looser if he doesn't.
Either way they will have a compelling story.

Beagle wrote:
[snipped]
Will he get rejected again?

This could really be the most dramatic season ever.    

OMG.....NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Imo the party line by CH has repeatedly been reported that Nick is the most sincere guy in the quest for his HEA and that is why the cast him. Therefore IMO TPTB will make certain Nick chooses someone or if he doesn't I expect his edit to make it look like always the bridesmaid never the bride. Since Nick is a willing puppet, I don't expect him to fight production so his edit should not be a surprise to him IMO. Either way IMO they cast Nick for his ability to bring drama and a polarizing affect of getting people talking pro and con.

I will say I don't buy any of what they are selling and I am very curious to see how the season transpires.
all JMO

GuardianAngel wrote:If my son wanted to date / get engaged to someone I didn't like, I don't think it would matter what my opinion was, and we are very close. Actually this did happen. I didn't have the hear to say I told you so, because it was such a nightmare.

Going to HTD's we always see parents favouring the F2. Does the lead really make their choice on who the parents like rather than the one they want? I hope not. It has to be their choice regardless of what anyone thinks, including family. If it's the wrong choice, then IMO it was meant to happen for a reason.

All the family can do is offer advise and opinions IMHO.

Yes I agree that the lead will already hv made up their mind, usually before that point, and will choose who they want regardless. It might actually go in their favour too if the lead happens to like going against family consensus & had done in the past on other issues. I think of Jojo's whose family seemed to favour Robbie and made that clear to her. Crikey just imagine what JoJos brothers would make of Nick if she brought him home.  
Kaitlyns sister favoured Sean even though she was a Nick fan. Also I remember how Des's brother was to Sean Lowe & how that seemed to really change their story from that point on. I guess family does play a part but maybe it just adds a bit of doubt but not the deciding factor.  
I think I also agree with Kasha saying she wd wonder at the lifestyle & career prospects of Nick if I was the parent. I mean there may be some very tough questions about career plans heading Nick's way if he is about to propose to someone. Hoping he sails through them all of course being a die hard fan. It will be compelling viewing that's for sure. All imo. :skating:

Hmmm, the HTDs....lots to ponder....
Yes, at the age of 36, parents might have higher expectations for Nick's career and stabilty. I know that I would need convincing if my daughter was in the mix.
Preconceived opinions of Nick are a real possibilty. The guy has already been on 3 shows and has gotten lots of press (not necessarily good press). I know I have opinions.

Does the feedback from the families really matter? I think that families only spend a very limited amount of time meeting the lead or meeting the F1 and F2. I think that sometimes the contestants' families serve as a needed sounding board or cheerleader. I think that meeting the different families is important to the lead, and they can see red flags of family incompatibilities. I think when the F1 and F2 meet the lead's family, that the lead typically has made up their mind and barring the family saying that they hate the guy/girl, I think they just nod and smile and say follow your heart.

I have watched Jojo's MTP dates multiple times, because watching Robby interact with her family always makes my heart happy. The scene of Jojo's father being moved to tears by Robby's chat and the complimentary opinions of Robby voiced by her family make me smile, knowing that they knew he was genuinely in love and was "husband material". But in the end she followed her own heart and chose the "New Years Eve Date". so, yeah, unless they come out with overwhelming evidence that the guy or girl is horrid, then it's just a visit edited mostly for drama. IMO

MiaHawk wrote:Hmmm, the HTDs....lots to ponder....
Yes, at the age of 36, parents might have higher expectations for Nick's career and stabilty.  I know that I would need convincing if my daughter was in the mix.
Preconceived opinions of Nick are a real possibilty. The guy has already been on 3 shows and has gotten lots of press (not necessarily good press). I know I have opinions.

Does the feedback from the families really matter? I think that families only spend a very limited amount of time meeting the lead or meeting the F1 and F2.  I think that sometimes the contestants' families serve as a needed sounding board or cheerleader.  I think that meeting the different families is important to the lead, and they can see red flags of family incompatibilities.  I think when the F1 and F2 meet the lead's family, that the lead typically has made up their mind and barring the family saying that they hate the guy/girl, I think they just nod and smile and say follow your heart.

I have watched Jojo's MTP dates multiple times, because watching Robby interact with her family always makes my heart happy.  The scene of Jojo's father being moved to tears by Robby's chat and the complimentary opinions of Robby voiced by her family make me smile, knowing that they knew he was genuinely in love and was "husband material". But in the end she followed her own heart and chose the "New Years Eve Date".   so, yeah, unless they come out with overwhelming evidence that the guy or girl is horrid, then it's just a visit edited mostly for drama.  IMO

IA Mia. Still, I think you're dealing with a different set of circumstances for Nick.
JoJo's family made their assessment of Robby vs. Jordan after only a one-day visit. Easier for JoJo to ignore. She feels she sees a side of him the parents don't.
In Nick's season if the parents are viewers, as you note, they will already have assessed Nick for three seasons of the show. Yes, the woman can make the case the real Nick is not as he's portrayed on television. but he is not an unknown.

SueSt wrote:

MiaHawk wrote:Hmmm, the HTDs....lots to ponder....
Yes, at the age of 36, parents might have higher expectations for Nick's career and stabilty.  I know that I would need convincing if my daughter was in the mix.
Preconceived opinions of Nick are a real possibilty. The guy has already been on 3 shows and has gotten lots of press (not necessarily good press). I know I have opinions.

Does the feedback from the families really matter? I think that families only spend a very limited amount of time meeting the lead or meeting the F1 and F2.  I think that sometimes the contestants' families serve as a needed sounding board or cheerleader.  I think that meeting the different families is important to the lead, and they can see red flags of family incompatibilities.  I think when the F1 and F2 meet the lead's family, that the lead typically has made up their mind and barring the family saying that they hate the guy/girl, I think they just nod and smile and say follow your heart.

I have watched Jojo's MTP dates multiple times, because watching Robby interact with her family always makes my heart happy.  The scene of Jojo's father being moved to tears by Robby's chat and the complimentary opinions of Robby voiced by her family make me smile, knowing that they knew he was genuinely in love and was "husband material". But in the end she followed her own heart and chose the "New Years Eve Date".   so, yeah, unless they come out with overwhelming evidence that the guy or girl is horrid, then it's just a visit edited mostly for drama.  IMO

IA Mia. Still, I think you're dealing with a different set of circumstances for Nick.
JoJo's family made their assessment of Robby vs. Jordan after only a one-day visit. Easier for JoJo to ignore. She feels she sees a side of him the parents don't.
In Nick's season if the parents are viewers, as you note, they will already have assessed Nick for three seasons of the show. Yes, the woman can make the case the real Nick is not as he's portrayed on television. but he is not an unknown.

Yes, I agree this is not a "normal" season. Lots more potential "baggage". it is definitely going to be an interesting one.

I think the potential for drama is there.
I also think tptb could use the idea of potential drama on HTDs to hype the epi.
IMO
1. Families know Nick is the Bach and if they are opposed due to their show perception of him AND if the daughter is influenced by her family opinion, why would she still go on the show?
2. Jen's mom posted in this forum.  Her comments about Nick were positive -an example of how some people separate a tv show from reality or may have never viewed Nick as a villian or polarizing.
3. I think families should always ask tough questions on this show (like Catherine's mom asked Sean) because their daughter is 1 of 4 - very unnatural - and could potentially get engaged.  If the questions focus on Nick's previous appearances then I think it's too much like meeting show super fans instead of the family of a girl he could possibly marry. Like they see him as a reality tv person instead of taking the time to get to know him in person. Big red flag.

I agree that many families would be leery of a 36 year old man leaving a viable career to seek fame (with no discernible talent) marrying their daughter. However, I wonder whether this line of questioning will even make it into the edit, assuming it gets brought up in conversations on the HTDs. I guess it depends on what kind of an edit they decide to give Nick.

I think being 36, on two previous shows, and still single, tells me just maybe he really is looking to settle down. He's not married yet at that age, pushing 40. As opposed to when I see younger contestants 23 24 yrs old, I definitely don't see them on the show looking for someone to settle down with.

He has a ton of work experience behind him, he has been modelling, plus, if all else fails, Salesforce loves him, he can go back any time he wants. He has 7-10 years over some previous leads as far as working history. I'm not concerned about his work ethics.

Right now he seems to be a professional cast member of the Bachelor shows. That would bother me as a parent of a potential f1. I hope you're right that he's wanting to settle down, GA. I'm not so sure about that but I guess we'll see next season.