Bachelor 21 - Nick Viall - General Discussion - *Sleuthing Spoilers* #2

Since there is an ongoing convo about this topic, thought it will be good to bring back the interviews that shows what probably truly happened.

Jen gave an interview to Glamour mag (floating around somewhere on this site) and ET, the day before FRC, where she reasonably stated that she didn't want a  proposal. In the season's preview, towards the end,  we hear her say (I assume to Nick during the "proposal") " I was afraid you were going to propose" or something close to that.

I don't know why the producers chose to show it the way they did, but we all know how they manipulate scenes to follow a storyline. I sincerely believe Jen wasn't disappointed about the non-proposal. She is a smart girl, and knew it wasn't the right time. Whatever happened between them after, or when it did, I think her mom gave a clear and true picture of that. IMO.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://www.etonline.com/news/196970_did_nick_viall_break_up_with_jen_saviano_to_be_the_next_bachelor/&ved=0ahUKEwjH1NOnzv3OAhUX4mMKHcUWA68QFggbMAA&usg=AFQjCNEAqUxaEdjvJdT8lI_bv5G2NN3fBA&sig2=_AzAaJ8gXdlqcv5L8ULUvQ

What was clear to me....was TPTB did not want Jen to give her opinion of Nick on AP. She has however been giving her opinion with humor and subtlety on her personal SM....IMO.
JMO

julychild wrote:Since there is an ongoing convo about this topic, thought it will be good to bring back the interviews that shows what probably truly happened.

Jen gave an interview to Glamour mag (floating around somewhere on this site) and ET, the day before FRC, where she reasonably stated that she didn't want a  proposal. In the season's preview, towards the end,  we hear her say (I assume to Nick during the "proposal") " I was afraid you were going to propose" or something close to that.

I don't know why the producers chose to show it the way they did, but we all know how they manipulate scenes to follow a storyline. I sincerely believe Jen wasn't disappointed about the non-proposal. She is a smart girl, and knew it wasn't the right time. Whatever happened between them after, or when it did, I think her mom gave a clear and true picture of that. IMO.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://www.etonline.com/news/196970_did_nick_viall_break_up_with_jen_saviano_to_be_the_next_bachelor/&ved=0ahUKEwjH1NOnzv3OAhUX4mMKHcUWA68QFggbMAA&usg=AFQjCNEAqUxaEdjvJdT8lI_bv5G2NN3fBA&sig2=_AzAaJ8gXdlqcv5L8ULUvQ

I'm pretty sure Ashley said the speech about being afraid. But idk IMO.

I'm sure Jen wasn't expecting a proposal from Nick even if that's what editing wanted us to believe. I wouldn't even be surprised if she was "coaxed" to tell him she loved him by producers at the FRC. Notice how with certain couples, the woman spoke first and with others, the man did. It was obviously arranged by producers that way, depending on whether they wanted to give the appearance of suspense whether a proposal would happen, or whether someone would get dumped.

Since in past seasons, couples were permitted to walk away from FRC still together but not engaged, why do people think this rule was changed, and when?

Lennoxcolinrolland wrote:

julychild wrote:Since there is an ongoing convo about this topic, thought it will be good to bring back the interviews that shows what probably truly happened.

Jen gave an interview to Glamour mag (floating around somewhere on this site) and ET, the day before FRC, where she reasonably stated that she didn't want a  proposal. In the season's preview, towards the end,  we hear her say (I assume to Nick during the "proposal") " I was afraid you were going to propose" or something close to that.

I don't know why the producers chose to show it the way they did, but we all know how they manipulate scenes to follow a storyline. I sincerely believe Jen wasn't disappointed about the non-proposal. She is a smart girl, and knew it wasn't the right time. Whatever happened between them after, or when it did, I think her mom gave a clear and true picture of that. IMO.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://www.etonline.com/news/196970_did_nick_viall_break_up_with_jen_saviano_to_be_the_next_bachelor/&ved=0ahUKEwjH1NOnzv3OAhUX4mMKHcUWA68QFggbMAA&usg=AFQjCNEAqUxaEdjvJdT8lI_bv5G2NN3fBA&sig2=_AzAaJ8gXdlqcv5L8ULUvQ

I'm pretty sure Ashley said the speech about being afraid. But idk IMO.

Bottom line, Lenny, Jen didn't want a proposal. Smart girl. She doesn't need to be pitied for not getting engaged. Nick shouldn't get vilified for not proposing.

In that one thing, at least, they were on the same page.

Seabear wrote:Nick has mentioned repeatedly that AshleyI is one of his close friends. Perhaps she can give Nick some lessons on crying on cue....she is a pro.  I'm very surprised Nick let Jen lay her heart on the line before he flat out rejected her.  Super lame after all his complaints in the past.
JMO

The sun in ones eye and when the place is as hot as there and the sweat is coming believe me the salt in those sweat hurts yours eyes like crazy, so I give the guy a break anyone could see he was sweating from the heat.  JMHO.

Ariela wrote:I have  NO   R-E-S-P-E-C-T  for Nick.

I think he's even a bigger slimeball after BiP. He had MORE time with Jen than he will have with any girl on TB. They get a couple of dates and date others while they are on TB. He just wants to keep "sampling" all the women he can. Yuck, and yuck again. No self respecting women should want him. IMO, he's is a master manipulator.

Many people on TB are FAKE and just want to be on TeeVee. Jen was genuine, and he led her on. Woe is Nick. He couldn't open up to Jen.....What makes him think that he'll open up to 25 wannabees on TV (women on TB)? Imo, he wanted TB gig all along= meh.

Something* happened between picking out the ring and the proposal, it's called a PRODUCER asking him to be the next Bach. Oh, those tears=  
IMO, there is no redemption for Nick. IF he's  serious, he needs to find a woman OFF the TV screen. There are plenty of 30 year old women out there, not on TV, who want to get married. Unless he is sick and has some PUBLIC DISPLAY OF AFFECTION FETISH ON TV, he needs to get off the TV screen because he's stinking up the place....and yes this is all my opinion and in sticking by it

I dont believe they make love that night on the BIP. None of us was there and with the words the mom said about him been respectful I would say they did not go that far. The day was a s hot as hell because even Josh was sweating like a pig so the squinting eyes can be accounted for. IMHO

ironcat wrote:

Fingersandtoes wrote:

ironcat wrote:

But didn't he continue dating her long distance after filming ended anyway (at least until he found out he definitely got the gig as the next Bachelor)?  What's fishy to me is that in past seasons of BIP, there were couples who went to the FRC and didn't get engaged or declare undying love for each other, but exchanged roses and agreed to continue to date in the real world.  Why was this season different, did producers tell Nick that was no longer an option?  Was the reason it was no longer an option because the idea of "Nick as the Bachelor" was already in the cards, and therefore, he needed to cut ties with Jen (on screen if not in reality)?  His kiss off of her, including his comments in the limo were a clear set up for him being the next lead, coincidence or not?  Regardless of what everybody (Nick, Luke, the producers) claims, I still have my suspicions about how the decision really came to be.  Of course Luke doesn't really know anything more than what he was told (lied to?), and neither the producers nor Nick would admit that the possibility of this was in the works all along, because it looks disingenuous, to say the least.

Yes, they dated a few weeks long distance after the filming ended. And the spark wasn't there for him to continue. Many leads have done the same. Ben had something going with Tenley, Kaitlyn with Nick etc.  I'm pretty sure Nick saw these people find 'their person' on their season, and chose to accept the Bach offer for the chance of finding someone he'd have it all with, instead of continuing long distance with Jen, with whom it wasn't there.  

Nick considers Ben one of the most genuine guys he knows, truly a nice person. And Ben could've continued dating Tenley off the show for 'on paper' perfect match, but Ben chose the chance of finding his person on bachelor, and found Lauren. Nick has seen all this happen close up, it might be one of the reasons he took the offer. Jmo.

I'm confused, did Ben and Tenley appear together on BIP?  My point is that in past seasons on BIP, couples went to the FRC and didn't get engaged, but didn't break up either.  Examples of this are Nick/Samantha, Michelle/Cody, and Justin/Cassandra.  None of those couples lasted more than a few weeks/months after airing I don't think.  Why didn't Nick and Jen go this route? Since Nick did continue to date Jen for a few weeks after filming, he obviously liked her enough to want to continue the relationship to some degree.  That's what I'm questioning, whether his breaking up with her, as opposed to just leaving it as a "let's see where this might go in the real world", was orchestrated by production because of an agenda that they had (which Nick may have been privy to).  IOW, maybe he was told by them, "There's still a possibility you might be cast as the Bachelor, but in order to remain in contention, you have to dump Jen on camera.  Continue to date her after filming if you wish, and we'll let you know what we decide.  See ya!"  I sure wouldn't put it past them.

I believe GA post yesterday that he did not know about been the bachelor until he found last monday so, I dont think he did not know on the show.

No..seriously. How does one come to the conclusion Nick wanted and thought he was going to get TB gig? The probability of him getting it was very, very slim. He was seen as an antagonist in both his Bacherlorette gigs, TIB was his third time in the franchise, making him becoming The Bachelor the 4th time and no one has ever gotten The Bachelor gig after being BIP..ever. Him getting the gig was against him, that is why when he was announced most of us were shocked because him getting it was very slim. We knew it, and I bet Nick knew it too. Nick when he falls in love, he falls hard. I saw that on Andi's season, if he truly loved Jen the is no doubt in my mind he would have tried everything to make it work. I have seen Jen, she is a very beautiful woman, but then this goes back to they didn't have a spark. Must he force himself to fall in love to please people? As a Nick fan I lost hope him getting the gig. Nick with all the negativity he gets but one thing about Nick he has always been true to himself no matter what. He can admit his faults and admit his mistakes. He was on TV and told people straight that Andi book is not fiction on his part. She said some truth about him. I am happy he is the type of person to be true to himself, we try pleasing people to make them happy forgetting ourselves.

StacyNor wrote:No..seriously. How does one come to the conclusion Nick wanted and thought he was going to get TB gig? The probability of him getting it was very, very slim. He was seen as an antagonist in both his Bacherlorette gigs, TIB was his third time in the franchise, making him becoming The Bachelor the 4th time and no one has ever gotten The Bachelor gig after being BIP..ever. Him getting the gig was against him, that is why when he was announced most of us were shocked because him getting it was very slim. We knew it, and I bet Nick knew it too. Nick when he falls in love, he falls hard.  I saw that on Andi's season, if he truly loved Jen the is no doubt in my mind he would have tried everything to make it work.  I have seen Jen, she is a very beautiful woman, but then this goes back to they didn't have a spark. Must he force himself to fall in love to please people? As a Nick fan I lost hope him getting the gig. Nick with all the negativity he gets but one thing about Nick he has always been true to himself no matter what. He can admit his faults and admit his mistakes. He was on TV and told people straight that Andi book is not fiction on his part. She said some truth about him. I am happy he is the type of person to be true to himself, we try pleasing people to make them happy forgetting ourselves.

Are you saying you don't think Nick wanted the Bachelor gig and they had to twist his arm?  

He may not have thought he would get the gig, may have given up hope of that ever happening when he decided to go on BIP, but that doesn't mean that as filming progressed and the producers saw how well received he was by his castmates while his adversary Josh was mistrusted, how he came across as the voice of reason and confidante to everyone, how logical it was and easy it would be to give him the "hero" edit this time, that they didn't start bouncing around the idea of making him the next Bachelor amongst themselves.  And who knows what hints they might have dropped to him behind the scenes during filming since we know he's very chummy with some of production?  Not disputing any insider information anyone here might have received, but I also am smart enough to know that neither Nick nor anyone connected with the show would be well served to divulge that choosing him as the lead was anything other than a last minute decision made because of overwhelming positive fan reaction to him once the show was airing.  So it wouldn't surprise me to find out that they are all lying/covering their asses about how and when the decision was reached.

And just to clarify, there's a difference between knowing FOR SURE, and hoping/anticipating there was a possibility it could happen. In Nick's case, I think it was the latter, and he didn't know for sure he was TB until last Monday but his fingers were crossed.

Nonina430 wrote:Relaxing, I don't understand your post. Modeling is an occupation.
A quite lucrative one if I may add. In time.Many times it leads to
other opportunities such as acting etc. I don't see a prob
with making a living off of your good looks, lucky those. 

This is from way back and off topic so just a quick comment to clarify ... I totally agree.  Didn't mean to disparage the profession of modelling.  I respect and applaud anyone who can build a fun, successful non-traditional career out of a natural, in-born trait be it based off appearance, athletic skill, artistic abilities etc.  Lucky them for sure  and I have not doubt it takes a lot of courage and hard work to succeed in doing that.  JMO.  

That's not really what I meant to comment on at all so I'll just say I miss the days when following a castmember's sm was a way to see quick glimpses of what people were doing in their lives and learn more about them and their interests and personalities rather than offering them a platform to post their posed photoshoots and shirtless selfies and filtered faces - JMO . I'd rather see a glimpse of a real life.  JMO again.

I get that many people do the same, I guess with Nick it's a turn off because he's a guy I least would have expected it from and who seemed to have more going for him than his looks pre-show but became all about them (IMO) after being on tv. Just one of many things that makes me not a fan of him as Bachelor.  JMO.

There's no doubt Nick and Jen had intimate relations in the fantasy suite. It's Nick! Sexy times are his logo/brand! IMO.