The Bachelor 20 - Ben Higgins - MTP -LCD - FRC - *Sleuthing - Spoilers*

SarahD wrote:I just read that in the TV show unReal (which I haven't seen), the producers make you think they're your bestest friend, they have your back, then the second they get what they need, they totally screw you over. I kind of sense that's what the producers do here. And when you're filming until wee hours in the morning, apparently people are just so tired that hey do what you just want them to do. It's pure manipulation...

That show UNreal is so real.

SarahD wrote:I just read that in the TV show unReal (which I haven't seen), the producers make you think they're your bestest friend, they have your back, then the second they get what they need, they totally screw you over. I kind of sense that's what the producers do here. And when you're filming until wee hours in the morning, apparently people are just so tired that hey do what you just want them to do. It's pure manipulation...

IMO it's exactly what they do.

If you haven't ever seen UnReal you should. The executive producer / creator of the show - Sarah Gertrude Shapiro - used to be a producer on The Bachelor. She gave a very interesting interview here where she talks about her time on The Bachelor. It may seem hard to believe but I believe because she lived the experience.

Lucas15 wrote:

grace8136 wrote:

George1218 wrote:That would make what Ben said about "we put her through he##" true.

But why would Ben willingly put his F1 through hell?

IIRC Ben did indeed say "we put her through He**" - but who is the "we" and why did he say "we" instead of "I"?

Maybe the "we" was Ben and TPTB - and Ben thought he had control over what he did and said to Lauren and thought it was all OK  - but he may well have not known what TPTB were doing to Lauren behind his back. TPTB are perfectly capable, IMO, of lying and telling Ben "Don't worry - Lauren knows what's really going on" and then without Ben's knowledge telling Lauren "Gee - we don't know what's going on here - we thought he loved only you but he's awfully close to JoJo". The result is that Ben didn't do it willingly - he didn't believe he was doing it at all until he actually had private access to Lauren and learned what she had really gone through.
JMHO

Do you remember where he said "we"?

Why do you think he would go along with it, even if he was led to believe Lauren was ok with it? I took the hell to mean the backlash on SM and how it will seem that his F1 "wins" Ben by 51%. It's not exactly a romantic fairytale for poor Lauren. Shouldn't he have put her first, protected her from all this, if indeed he had 1 true love and not 2?  I was open to fakery until we heard all the ILYs plus everything else, but if he did it on purpose, that may be worse for me. I'll watch with your comments in mind on Monday though.

grace8136 wrote:I took the hell to mean the backlash on SM and how it will seem that his F1 "wins" Ben by 51%. It's not exactly a romantic fairytale for poor Lauren.

I took the Hell to mean what happened during filming because Ben expressed it as something that already happened - not something that is going to happen; anything that will or won't be said on SM about a close call on the "win" can't begin until Monday. IMO by 11:00PM Monday, EDT, everyone is going to have a different view of things and the "narrow margin of victory" may either not seem narrow at all, or won't matter to most.
JMHO

When it comes to TPTB and standing your ground on issues, whatever they may be, I think you have to pick your battles.  While I personally wasn't thrilled with all the ILY's and from the edit, his seeming to give TPTB pretty much anything they wanted to work with, that was a problem he himself created (with or without storyboard help) and had to dig his way out of.  Part of that was being in the bubble and falling for whatever they did and threw at him, part because he's a people pleaser, etc.  So IMO, his waiting to tell Lauren until after the proposal about how things went down with Jojo and saying he's engaged, happy and ready to marry her tomorrow in the more recent interviews is part of his protecting her.  He may not have been able to do more publically, regardless of how much he wanted to, without somehow making it worse.  You don't want to be on TPTB's bad side.  He'd already gone rogue with the multiple ILY's during filming so they probably had a tight reign on him during media stuff.  JMHO.

Lucas15 wrote:

grace8136 wrote:I took the hell to mean the backlash on SM and how it will seem that his F1 "wins" Ben by 51%. It's not exactly a romantic fairytale for poor Lauren.

I took the Hell to mean what happened during filming because Ben expressed it as something that already happened - not something that is going to happen; anything that will or won't be said on SM about a close call on the "win" can't begin until Monday. IMO by 11:00PM Monday, EDT, everyone is going to have a different view of things and the "narrow margin of victory" may either not seem narrow at all, or won't matter to most.
JMHO

Well that would point to JoJo because Lauren is currently having a rough go of it on the internet. What he did during filming hurt her AND has already created SM backlash and embarrassment. This forum is relatively kind to Lauren and Ben, other places, not so much.

jmo

Where does this 'Lauren wins by 51%' come from?

Fingersandtoes wrote:Where does this 'Lauren wins by 51%' come from?

I read it in USWeekly. The crew voted.  No, just my thoughts on how rough it will be for Lauren because some on SM may perceive it as less than an ideal way to end up engaged.

grace8136 wrote:

Fingersandtoes wrote:Where does this 'Lauren wins by 51%' come from?

I read it in USWeekly. The crew voted.  No, just my thoughts on how rough it will be for Lauren because some on SM may perceive it as less than an ideal way to end up engaged.

Tbf, the social media comments were going to be brutal regardless. Ben got 8000+ comments when he dumped Amanda. You just have to ignore them. IMO people who comment on other people's social media accounts are just scum. And it will tone down once bachelorette starts airing IMO.

My favourite singer has had her IG filled with racist trash for about 2 years now just because she dates a man some people want with someone else.

And Kristin Bushnell's motherly advice.. Peeps are gonna do and say what they want because of their ignorance . Can't fix that .

Fingersandtoes wrote:

grace8136 wrote:

Fingersandtoes wrote:Where does this 'Lauren wins by 51%' come from?

I read it in USWeekly. The crew voted.  No, just my thoughts on how rough it will be for Lauren because some on SM may perceive it as less than an ideal way to end up engaged.

Tbf, the social media comments were going to be brutal regardless. Ben got 8000+ comments when he dumped Amanda. You just have to ignore them. IMO people who comment on other people's social media accounts are just scum. And it will tone down once bachelorette starts airing IMO.

My favourite singer has had her IG filled with racist trash for about 2 years now just because she dates a man some people want with someone else.  

yes, ITA.. except I think it would be difficult to completely ignore it. It never ceases to amaze me that people say the things they do and even tag the person on SM. My kids start saying, "I know, I know"... before I can get the whole lecture out now.  I'd rather that Ben was an upstanding guy who maybe shouldn't have said quite so much, rather than a wimpy, people pleaser that put TPTB before Lauren. That's just less appealing to me. Ben left Lauren open to way more than he should have imo. I'm not going to place the blame all on the show or even on SM. Whatever the reason, he did that. I was sad for Chris Siegfried too and it took me awhile to think that Des was going to be good for him and really what happened to her was even less in her control, so I'm tough I guess. Of course, that all worked out beautifully, so no reason that Lauren and Ben won't too.

Imo Ben is one of the smartest most true to himself bachelors ever. I have been so impressed with how he has handled interviews and has supported all of the women.
Correct me if I am wrong, but the one thing the lead cannot do is give away the outcome of the show. Telling just one girl ily would do that. MO is that he wanted to say ily to Lauren, so when JoJo said it to him, he said it back - love has many meanings and he cared for her a lot. To Lauren he said, "I've been in love with you for awhile now." The producers then took the story and ran with it.