The Bachelor 20 - Ben Higgins - Episode 5 - Discussion - *Sleuthing - Spoilers*

bachfan29 wrote:I guess I'm weird because i am really not buying the preview and him being in love with the both of them. You don't go from being all about Lauren to loving them both. Plus there is a difference between being in love and loving someone.

This was Andy Baldwin's season. part two. 2.0

I don't really buy the promo either or how he acted about it on Bach Live. This season has been completely spoiled, as it usually always is, but this one is so obvious in who he chooses that tptb have to do some kind of damage control! They need to create doubt. They need to have Ben throw us off as much as possible. Even if RS didn't spoil Lauren as F1, I think it's obvious who he wants!

I think this is all evidence of TPTB controlling things more than ever. No surprise after last season upset foiler and that there likely isn't one now.

This.  I mean I cannot speak for past bachelors/ettes, but the amount of control they put over him is insane.  I know that is what he signed up for.  **edited**imo they absolutely did not want him to defend Olivia in any way.  Chris even put the words in his mouth before he said it.  He knew that was what they wanted him to say so he awkwardly repeated it.  
As far as Jubilee, I do not think he was mean at all when he sent her home.  She was extremely rude to him.  He didn't let her go because she didn't "stroke his ego" enough.  She was intriguing to him, but she was not someone he wanted to be with.  Should he have kept her past the point the producers made him?  No.  That would be unfair to all involved.  

Again, I am not saying he should be getting pity for the amount of control placed upon him, **edited** that he has very little control over the way he is presented right now.  From his "role" on BL, to his social media accounts, he is little to no say.

^
ITA re he's completely controlled about what he says and how he acts or uses social media. And he was fully aware of this when he signed the dotted line.

Saying that Ben had no control over how he responded on a LIVE show is a cop out.  He could have been gracious and a gentleman or a mean puppet.  His choice.
Same for the way he eliminated Jubilee.  Genuine empathy would have been nice.  Fine for him to let her go BUT he set her up for the fall.  And he was angry.  She was not rude, blunt yes, confused yes, rude no.
Ben has to own his own actions.  Edit or not.  Same as everyone else. Time to let a little air out of his overly inflated EGO.
Humility is a good look on everyone.  Even Ben10.

JMO

Possible scenario for Lauren B snd JoJo .. Especially after Bens question to Jason .. And his blindsiding comment to JoJo this week.....

It may be that Lauren is the one to leave at the end .. Possible on her own and early .. Leaving JoJo to be F1 .. But in a crazy twist .. Ben does a blindside and sends JoJo home .. And really goes after Lauren and she does end up as F1 .. Which would be somewhat similar in ways to a Jason switch....

Jeepers wrote:Possible scenario for Lauren B snd JoJo .. Especially after Bens question to Jason .. And his blindsiding comment to JoJo this week.....

It may be that Lauren is the one to leave at the end .. Possible on her own and early .. Leaving JoJo to be F1 .. But in a crazy twist .. Ben does a blindside and sends JoJo home .. And really goes after Lauren and she does end up as F1 .. Which would be somewhat similar in ways to a Jason switch....

that would be entertaining though

Jubes edit was a whiny .. Not confident .. Constantly needing reassurance .. Etccccc... . Her comment about not wanting to hold his hand .. Made and heard by all the others .. Certainly was good reason for him to say what he did to her .. She was quite a bit petulant towards him .. In her edit .. Most unloveable ...............

Just watched this episode, I like Olivia regardless how TPTB edited her. I do think she is socially awkward, but at least she is there fighting Ben and doing her own thing, instead of dissecting everything else like almost all other girls.

I don't particularly like JoJo, think she could be bitchy at times, but at least she is not fake. She says it like it is, and I still think she is the one that made Ben feels the most comfortable. Ben could fall head over heels for Lauren B, but I think JoJo fits him best. Just remind me Des may have always thought Brooks is her type, but in the end, it is Chris that she needs.

I dislike Lauren B more and more, the way she talks with other girls scream arrogant and hate that she talks differently in front of Ben. When she is with the girls, it screams "I'm above you all and I know Ben so well", but when she is with Ben, she is all "I'm just a sweet innocent girl worries to get hurt". And I still don't see any depth about this girl, which really is the biggest no no for me.

Don't ask me exactly what Lauren did that made me feel that way, this is what my eyes and my guts see. I know this is a very unpopular opinion, but I'm believe what my guts tell me.

Seabear wrote:Saying that Ben had no control over how he responded on a LIVE show is a cop out.  He could have been gracious and a gentleman or a mean puppet.  His choice.
Same for the way he eliminated Jubilee.  Genuine empathy would have been nice.  Fine for him to let her go BUT he set her up for the fall.  And he was angry.  She was not rude, blunt yes, confused yes, rude no.
Ben has to own his own actions.  Edit or not.  Same as everyone else. Time to let a little air out of his overly inflated EGO.
Humility is a good look on everyone.  Even Ben10.

JMO

Oh, I meant my comment was about him selling the sl that he fell in love with two women, he was conflicted and confused etc. not about his comments re Olivia, or not simply letting Jubilee go, but he decided he wanted an apology from her. That's all on him. But his comments re F2 are completely controlled.

I didn't think Ben was mean in the least about Olivia. He chose not to answer the question when given the option by CH. Olivia herself talked about her dragon breath in the mornings, what if she does have bad breath, is Ben supposed to lie about it? As far as SM, Olivia alone has dug her own grave, she's flipping whacked with her nonverbal connection with Ben.

I love Jubilee, Ben told her he felt she was pulling back, his saying to her what is he supposed to think when she won't hold his hand was in response to her telling him she isn't pulling back. She asked him point blank if he sees a future with her, he said no. He was being kind by not taking her further knowing the process was getting to her, and knowing he wasn't going to choose her in the end.

I don't think ego had anything to do with either scenario.

eversotrue wrote:

sophienette wrote:

nutty1 wrote:I feel so much better seeing it. It is so sliced and diced!!

That first sentence is cut, right? "I told 2 women this week that I love..."

Yeah, the "them" is cut out.

If there is a "them"... ;)