Andi Dorfman - The Bachelorette 10 - Discussion - #2

Mia, two great posts!    

sara11 wrote:

MiaHawk wrote:

Ladybug82 wrote:

Will have to agree to disagree.  She just seems to want to be the center of attention all the time.  IMO, doesn't matter who from, as long as someone is fawning over her.

When I listened to Andi say that (she felt) Josh did not support her, I thought This is code for Josh did not continue to fawn over me because he appeared to be supporting her otherwise---roof over her head, food in her belly, travels, etc. I think any normal man who thought he was dating a hard working attorney, but who ended up with a full time dependent with champagne wishes and caviar dreams would have been a bit taken aback. She is delusional.

IMO when she said josh didn't support or empower her I took it to be about her fashion endevours and her website etc. When she said she didn't support him I took it to mean Advocare, they both obviously didn't understand each others passions in that sense.

Yes, that's what I think too. No JOINT opportunities to actually earn a living as Famous Couple came their way, they had to find other means to support themselves, and neither one picked something that fit the other one's idealized notion of a spouse. Which I completely get. Selling nutritional supplements via MLM, bleck. And being Just Another Girl with t-shirts and a fashion blog, who HAD a law degree, also bleck. Ironically, I feel as disillusioned with them as they are with one another.

Eviebloom wrote:In some ways it seemed to me that Advocare became Josh's first love.

Turning your attention to a new career is preferable to abusing alcohol / drugs, being unfaithful or many other self-destructive ways people in an unhappy relationship dull their pain.  No one would mistake me for a Josh fan, but I have a tough time bashing a man that works hard to support himself and his wife-to-be.  Josh is a former semi-professional athlete with a brother in the NFL so a segue into selling "nutritional" products follows his lifestyle & life experience.  

Josh did seem to support MeandI's moneymaking efforts which evidently revolve around SM marketing, guest appearances, photo shoots, etc.  Maybe he believed her when she initially said she wanted to return to practicing law?  Maybe MeandI whipping up that hideous cheap dress as a "budding fashionista" on the flight to yet another media event convinced him she didn't really know what she wanted.

FLChica wrote:

Eviebloom wrote:In some ways it seemed to me that Advocare became Josh's first love.

Turning your attention to a new career is preferable to abusing alcohol / drugs, being unfaithful or many other self-destructive ways people in an unhappy relationship dull their pain.  No one would mistake me for a Josh fan, but I have a tough time bashing a man that works hard to support himself and his wife-to-be.  Josh is a former semi-professional athlete with a brother in the NFL so a segue into selling "nutritional" products follows his lifestyle & life experience.  

Josh did seem to support MeandI's moneymaking efforts which evidently revolve around SM marketing, guest appearances, photo shoots, etc.  Maybe he believed her when she initially said she wanted to return to practicing law?  Maybe MeandI whipping up that hideous cheap dress as a "budding fashionista" on the flight to yet another media event convinced him she didn't really know what she wanted.

Or that any thought she would ever be a money earning fashionista was delusional, and as others have said, he thought he was getting a career woman and that together they would build their future financial security together, and instead he got a dependent to claim on his tax return.

jlccaz wrote:

sara11 wrote:

MiaHawk wrote:

When I listened to Andi say that (she felt) Josh did not support her, I thought This is code for Josh did not continue to fawn over me because he appeared to be supporting her otherwise---roof over her head, food in her belly, travels, etc. I think any normal man who thought he was dating a hard working attorney, but who ended up with a full time dependent with champagne wishes and caviar dreams would have been a bit taken aback. She is delusional.

IMO when she said josh didn't support or empower her I took it to be about her fashion endevours and her website etc. When she said she didn't support him I took it to mean Advocare, they both obviously didn't understand each others passions in that sense.

Yes, that's what I think too.  No JOINT opportunities to actually earn a living as  Famous Couple came their way, they had to find other means to support themselves, and neither one picked something that fit the other one's idealized notion of a spouse.  Which I completely get.  Selling nutritional supplements via MLM, bleck.  And being Just Another Girl with t-shirts and a fashion blog, who HAD a law degree, also bleck.  Ironically, I feel as disillusioned with them as they are with one another.

What ever happened to the concept that you get up in the morning and do an honest day's work and collect a check for it? There is honor to working hard even when you're not 100% in love with your job. Do you think the coal miners loved their jobs? Do you think doctors love being sleep deprived? Do you think toll booth attendants love the fumes? Geez. Why this need to get something for nothing, to game the system, to hit it big with the next big thing? Just get over yourself and come to grips with the fact that you're just not that special. You are a worker bee just like the person next to you. Nothing in life is free. Go work an honest day for what you want. Including a paycheck. Including a relationship that works. Including a character that you can be proud of. Stepping down...

^Stepping up to Mia's . Agree with every word.

FLChica wrote:

Eviebloom wrote:In some ways it seemed to me that Advocare became Josh's first love.

Turning your attention to a new career is preferable to abusing alcohol / drugs, being unfaithful or many other self-destructive ways people in an unhappy relationship dull their pain.  No one would mistake me for a Josh fan, but I have a tough time bashing a man that works hard to support himself and his wife-to-be.  Josh is a former semi-professional athlete with a brother in the NFL so a segue into selling "nutritional" products follows his lifestyle & life experience.  

Josh did seem to support MeandI's moneymaking efforts which evidently revolve around SM marketing, guest appearances, photo shoots, etc.  Maybe he believed her when she initially said she wanted to return to practicing law?  Maybe MeandI whipping up that hideous cheap dress as a "budding fashionista" on the flight to yet another media event convinced him she didn't really know what she wanted.

I'd like to believe that IF Andi had fashion talent (subjective thing I guess), was working very hard designing, sewing, and showcasing her work, that Josh MAY have been more supportive of her changing course. But just the fact that she was sewing her red carpet dress on the plane shows me that she was't really taking this new "passion" very seriously. Because if she was determined to make a great impression with that dress, it would have been impeccably sewn long before she boarded the plane. IMO, she didn't show any evidence of being committed to this new "passion". I'm not even talking about whether the dress was nice or not (color, style, sewing technique). I'm talking about being passionate enough about something that you take up the hammer and hammer day in and day out to try to make your dream a reality.

I have a hobby. I think of it as my "passion". When I am engaged in that "passion" I lose all sense of time and space. I am completely lost to it. It is like another force comes through my body and I am powerless to it. Hours pass, quickly and effortlessly. I am in my happy place. If I could, I would make it my full time job and get paid for it. For now, it is my hobby, and I just do it because I love it. I imagine that if Andi were going to try to make a go of the fashion thing as a real career, she'd have to have a similar life force running through her and her commitment level to it would have to be a 10 out of 10. The sewing on the plane thing...that was a 5 out of 10 at best. Sorry.

MiaHawk wrote:

jlccaz wrote:

sara11 wrote:
IMO when she said josh didn't support or empower her I took it to be about her fashion endevours and her website etc. When she said she didn't support him I took it to mean Advocare, they both obviously didn't understand each others passions in that sense.

Yes, that's what I think too.  No JOINT opportunities to actually earn a living as  Famous Couple came their way, they had to find other means to support themselves, and neither one picked something that fit the other one's idealized notion of a spouse.  Which I completely get.  Selling nutritional supplements via MLM, bleck.  And being Just Another Girl with t-shirts and a fashion blog, who HAD a law degree, also bleck.  Ironically, I feel as disillusioned with them as they are with one another.

What ever happened to the concept that you get up in the morning and do an honest day's work and collect a check for it? There is honor to working hard even when you're not 100% in love with your job.  Do you think the coal miners loved their jobs? Do you think doctors love being sleep deprived? Do you think toll booth attendants love the fumes?  Geez. Why this need to get something for nothing, to game the system, to hit it big with the next big thing?  Just get over yourself and come to grips with the fact that you're just not that special. You are a worker bee just like the person next to you. Nothing in life is free. Go work an honest day for what you want. Including a paycheck. Including a relationship that works. Including a character that you can be proud of. Stepping down...

Somehow, somewhere all along the line, society has gotten used to the "entitlement" card. 
There are a lot of people out there who are in for a very rude awakening.

But how could someone whole heartedly support something that is nothing but a get rich quick scheme, that is not proven? I understand them both not wholeheartedly supporting the other.... Would I want my some to be husband doing Advocare, no just like I wouldn't want him doing amway (I think that's what it was back in the day) or any of the pyramid things....

I agree with you, it would be very hard for me to be supportive of Advocare on so many levels. (mostly from the health prospective)
But it would be equally as hard for me to be supportive of someone not having a job and just floundering, as I see Andi. 
These are two people who both simultaneously made some major career readjustments. This was another huge stress issue to deal with in a new relationship that neither probably expected.

luvlady345 wrote:But how could someone whole heartedly support something that is nothing but a get rich quick scheme, that is not proven?  I understand them both not wholeheartedly supporting the other....  Would I want my some to be husband doing Advocare, no just like I wouldn't want him doing amway (I think that's what it was back in the day) or any of the pyramid things....  

Yeah, I kind of agree. I absolutely think that people in a relationship should support and empower each other, but I also think that they should have the ability to be honest with each other about their capabilities and talents. I don't necessarily think that Andi is talented enough to be a fashion designer, and I don't think that shilling Advocate is a respectable profession. I think that you can support a person, without supporting every single of their stupid decisions. Sometimes, you need your loved ones to tell you that you're on a wrong path and that doesn't mean that the love isn't there.

I think that was what was partly wrong with their relationship. They both just wanted complete adoration and weren't willing to accept any criticism about themselves.

If I truly loved someone, after expressing my opinions, I would support them in doing whatever they believed to be the right thing to do at that time. If it failed, fine, at least I supported him, because I love him, and he would learn. I would expect the same in return. I don't think I would fall out of love because of his chosen profession unless it was illegal or whatever.

If there are a variety of things that he wants to do, jumping from one idea to another that I don't feel I can support him, then I start to dislike him.

She tweeted one sketch of a tshirt that she was working on. I haven't seen anything further about her so called fashion venture. What other work related projects has she been working on? Her lack of support came through with the tweet about cuddling. That was her way of showing everyone, she's not crazy about this new venture. It's not good enough for her but at the same time, she doesn't have any motivation to take anything on.

At least he is trying to make his business work, whether some agree with the product or not. She hasn't done much of anything as far as work, for over 1 yr.