Bachelor 19 - Juelia Kinney

I was surprised that his family said very few people knew the manner of death (that he shot himself), they brought it up a few times that Juelia 'outed' this on TV.

I feel for them, this can't be easy. I'm sure it's still SO raw but I hope in time they can come to the realization that mental illness is real and that it wasn't a few fights with his wife that led to it.

I wish Juelia hadn't gone into detail, and I wish his family hadn't either.

eirekay wrote:

Kashathediva wrote:That's not surprising. 
There are three stories to every situation. 
Unfortunately, Juelia, herself made a bad decision when choosing this show to air private, family issues.  Key words being private issues.

I think Juelia's error was in going into too much detail.  She could have simply said "My husband committed suicide and I was overwhelmed with a new baby and a terrible grief to cope with."  That would have elicited a great deal of sympathy from Chris as well as everyone else.  The details really don't belong in this setting nor was Chris comfortable in hearing them.  That part of the conversation should have taken place much later in the relationship if it progressed that far.

I was wincing as she described her husband's last night and thinking "His poor family having this televised."  To me, it shows a total lack of consideration and a great deal of self absorption.  

I agree she went into way too much detail. I also feel that it was too soon for her to be on this show after her husband's suicide. I sort of feel like she exploited the situation (I'm sure with a lot of encouragement from TPTB) to gain sympathy from Chris in order not to get sent home. There was no reason that Chris needed to know that information at this stage of their relationship. Had she lasted longer on the show and had a one on one date, perhaps that would have been the time to tell him. If you read the letters, you can see that there is bad blood between her and her husband's family. I think it was in the letter the sister wrote, but she said that Juelia would not allow them to see the child. That makes me so sad because in the end, it's the child that suffers the most

Sable wrote:

eirekay wrote:

Kashathediva wrote:That's not surprising. 
There are three stories to every situation. 
Unfortunately, Juelia, herself made a bad decision when choosing this show to air private, family issues.  Key words being private issues.

I think Juelia's error was in going into too much detail.  She could have simply said "My husband committed suicide and I was overwhelmed with a new baby and a terrible grief to cope with."  That would have elicited a great deal of sympathy from Chris as well as everyone else.  The details really don't belong in this setting nor was Chris comfortable in hearing them.  That part of the conversation should have taken place much later in the relationship if it progressed that far.

I was wincing as she described her husband's last night and thinking "His poor family having this televised."  To me, it shows a total lack of consideration and a great deal of self absorption.  

I agree she went into way too much detail.  I also feel that it was too soon for her to be on this show after her husband's suicide.  I sort of feel like she exploited the situation (I'm sure with a lot of encouragement from TPTB) to gain sympathy from Chris in order not to get sent home.  There was no reason that Chris needed to know that information at this stage of their relationship.  Had she lasted longer on the show and had a one on one date, perhaps that would have been the time to tell him.  If you read the letters, you can see that there is bad blood between her and her husband's family.  I think it was in the letter the sister wrote, but she said that Juelia would not allow them to see the child.  That makes me so sad because in the end, it's the child that suffers the most

Agree with all of the above.

I am going to defend Jeulia (a little bit anyway). I can only guess the producers kept whispering in her ear to tell Chris about how she became a widow. (If you read the letters, the husband's family refers to her as his former wife. As far as I know, they were married when he died which makes her a widow.) She MAY have found it somewhat cathartic to discuss this - who knows. I think it's sad that the husband's family is so negative toward their granddaughter's mother. For the love of God, there is a child involved - just get along. Reality Steve sure knows how to stir up trouble!

Sorry but I have no pity for Juelia. I don't care if producers prod you or whatever. Have some class, do not discuss the details of your daughter's fathers suicide. That is out there now and she has no control over how or when Ireland learns of this.

I had defended her before the season that maybe this helped her grief. But what I saw on my tv is a self-centered woman who seems only to care for herself. She left this daughter that she loves so much to go on a dating show where she seemed to have no interest in the lead but a great interest in furthering herself.

I read some say that the in-laws should have to bend over backward to be nice to her to see their granddaughter/niece. Really, what kind of a mother keeps her child from the only link that she has left to her father? To me Juelia sounds as ill as Justin, which in my experience does happen that like attracts like. By her own words Juelia knew the night before that he had a gun and was threatening suicide and did nothing.

I just can't dislike the woman anymore and personally while his family might have gone too far, they had been silent about her and everything else until she outed the details of his death, which was incredibly wrong.

If someone had said stuff like that about my sister you can be darn sure I would defend her memory and I acknowledge my sister had issues, but to do that is a complete lack of class.

If doing that is what you have to do to stay on tv, then get off tv. I am so sick of the producers made them do it excuse. The producers can't make you do anything, they suggest, they try to persuade, but everyone has a moral compass. I don't think this woman cares for anyone but herself and that includes her daughter.

I am truly sad for her child and hope her mother's parents are good people since her mother won't let her near her father's family.

I was able to sleuth out this cast person before she was recognized on the forum for making it to this season. 
The issue of her husband's passing was not easy to find. I had to dig. 
When I found out the situation, I was saddened on many levels. 
First, I went through a personal family tragedy at basically the same age. So I could identify with the family. 
Second, tv is not the place to grieve. Third, this show is the last place to grieve.(process)
Fourth, the family had chosen to deal with the tragedy on a very private level, so this format is not the place to grieve. 
Fifth, people in general have difficulty dealing with death, their own personal issues and more so how to deal with others. Most do not want details. 
They only want to reach out and make the one suffering know they care and then change the subject to deal with their own discomfort. 
Going into details was wrong on so many levels.(see reasons 2-5 above). 
It was a horrible mistake going on this show. There are so many constructive ways to deal with pain, death, grief. MF is not one of those ways.

stuckinsc wrote:Sorry but I have no pity for Juelia.  I don't care if producers prod you or whatever.  Have some class, do not discuss the details of your daughter's fathers suicide.  That is out there now and she has no control over how or when Ireland learns of this.

I had defended her before the season that maybe this helped her grief.  But what I saw on my tv is a self-centered woman who seems only to care for herself.  She left this daughter that she loves so much to go on a dating show where she seemed to have no interest in the lead but a great interest in furthering herself.  

I read some say that the in-laws should have to bend over backward to be nice to her to see their granddaughter/niece.  Really, what kind of a mother keeps her child from the only link that she has left to her father?  To me Juelia sounds as ill as Justin, which in my experience does  happen that like attracts like.  By her own words Juelia knew the night before that he had a gun and was threatening suicide and did nothing.  

I just can't dislike the woman anymore and personally while his family might have gone too far, they had been silent about her and everything else until she outed the details of his death, which was incredibly wrong.

If someone had said stuff like that about my sister you can be darn sure I would defend her memory and I acknowledge my sister had issues, but to do that is a complete lack of class.

If doing that is what you have to do to stay on tv, then get off tv.  I am so sick of the producers made them do it excuse.  The producers can't make you do anything, they suggest, they try to persuade, but everyone has a moral compass.  I don't think this woman cares for anyone but herself and that includes her daughter.  

I am truly sad for her child and hope her mother's parents are good people since her mother won't let her near her father's family.

I agree w/every word of your post!

First and foremost, I think Juelia had no business being on this show.  She is still grieving and was not in an emotionally stable place to be on this show at this point in time, imo.  Yes, TPTB exploited her situation as only they can do, but she first made the decision to go on this show in the first place, so shame on Juelia and TPTB equally.  They both hold the blame for exploiting this very sensitive situation in the worst way possible.  Where are Jeulia's friends and family in all of this?  Did they think it was a good idea for her to do this show now?  I don't know, perhaps they counseled her and advised her not to do the show, but she did it anyway?

How did it get to the point where she won't allow the family of her deceased husband to see their child?  That greatly disturbs me.  That is her decision and her decision alone, and it is going to negatively impact the child most of all.  To me, that is a decision of an emotionally immature and selfish person.

I think it's very possible that she could have gone home the week she chose to tell Chris about her husband's suicide, but exploiting her situation saved her for at least a week.  She was just a "matter of time" girl, and she bought herself another week by exposing the intimate details of her husband's suicide.  I basically think that she sold her soul to the devil all for one more week on the show.  Now that she is out of the bachelor bubble, I wonder if she's regretting any of her actions and decisions?

stuckinsc wrote:Sorry but I have no pity for Juelia.  I don't care if producers prod you or whatever.  Have some class, do not discuss the details of your daughter's fathers suicide.  That is out there now and she has no control over how or when Ireland learns of this.

I had defended her before the season that maybe this helped her grief.  But what I saw on my tv is a self-centered woman who seems only to care for herself.  She left this daughter that she loves so much to go on a dating show where she seemed to have no interest in the lead but a great interest in furthering herself.  

I read some say that the in-laws should have to bend over backward to be nice to her to see their granddaughter/niece.  Really, what kind of a mother keeps her child from the only link that she has left to her father?  To me Juelia sounds as ill as Justin, which in my experience does  happen that like attracts like.  By her own words Juelia knew the night before that he had a gun and was threatening suicide and did nothing.  

I just can't dislike the woman anymore and personally while his family might have gone too far, they had been silent about her and everything else until she outed the details of his death, which was incredibly wrong.

If someone had said stuff like that about my sister you can be darn sure I would defend her memory and I acknowledge my sister had issues, but to do that is a complete lack of class.

If doing that is what you have to do to stay on tv, then get off tv.  I am so sick of the producers made them do it excuse.  The producers can't make you do anything, they suggest, they try to persuade, but everyone has a moral compass.  I don't think this woman cares for anyone but herself and that includes her daughter.  

I am truly sad for her child and hope her mother's parents are good people since her mother won't let her near her father's family.

Good post. I agree, especially the effect on the young daughter.

IMO, the whole issue of what should have been said and when about the husband should have been avoided because she should not have gone on the show in the first place. I see a woman who is still in the grieving process (anger stage) and not ready to date\have a relationship, much less air all of this on national TV. That she is still grieving this horror I understand; what I don't understand is the notion that handing such a sensitive and (should be) private issue over to the Fleissian exploitation machine is somehow supposed to be therapeutic or help her with grieving process.

Kashathediva wrote:I was able to sleuth out this cast person before she was recognized on the forum for making it to this season. 
The issue of her husband's passing was not easy to find. I had to dig. 
When I found out the situation, I was saddened on many levels. 
First, I went through a personal family tragedy at basically the same age. So I could identify with the family. 
Second, tv is not the place to grieve. Third, this show is the last place to grieve.(process)
Fourth, the family had chosen to deal with the tragedy on a very private level, so this format is not the place to grieve. 
Fifth, people in general have difficulty dealing with death, their own personal issues and more so how to deal with others. Most do not want details. 
They only want to reach out and make the one suffering know they care and then change the subject to deal with their own discomfort. 
Going into details was wrong on so many levels.(see reasons 2-5 above). 
It was a horrible mistake going on this show. There are so many constructive ways to deal with pain, death, grief. MF is not one of those ways.

Good post and ITA.

Sable wrote:

stuckinsc wrote:Sorry but I have no pity for Juelia.  I don't care if producers prod you or whatever.  Have some class, do not discuss the details of your daughter's fathers suicide.  That is out there now and she has no control over how or when Ireland learns of this.

I had defended her before the season that maybe this helped her grief.  But what I saw on my tv is a self-centered woman who seems only to care for herself.  She left this daughter that she loves so much to go on a dating show where she seemed to have no interest in the lead but a great interest in furthering herself.  

I read some say that the in-laws should have to bend over backward to be nice to her to see their granddaughter/niece.  Really, what kind of a mother keeps her child from the only link that she has left to her father?  To me Juelia sounds as ill as Justin, which in my experience does  happen that like attracts like.  By her own words Juelia knew the night before that he had a gun and was threatening suicide and did nothing.  

I just can't dislike the woman anymore and personally while his family might have gone too far, they had been silent about her and everything else until she outed the details of his death, which was incredibly wrong.

If someone had said stuff like that about my sister you can be darn sure I would defend her memory and I acknowledge my sister had issues, but to do that is a complete lack of class.

If doing that is what you have to do to stay on tv, then get off tv.  I am so sick of the producers made them do it excuse.  The producers can't make you do anything, they suggest, they try to persuade, but everyone has a moral compass.  I don't think this woman cares for anyone but herself and that includes her daughter.  

I am truly sad for her child and hope her mother's parents are good people since her mother won't let her near her father's family.

I agree w/every word of your post!

First and foremost, I think Juelia had no business being on this show.  She is still grieving and was not in an emotionally stable place to be on this show at this point in time, imo.  Yes, TPTB exploited her situation as only they can do, but she first made the decision to go on this show in the first place, so shame on Juelia and TPTB equally.  They both hold the blame for exploiting this very sensitive situation in the worst way possible.  Where are Jeulia's friends and family in all of this?  Did they think it was a good idea for her to do this show now?  I don't know, perhaps they counseled her and advised her not to do the show, but she did it anyway?

How did it get to the point where she won't allow the family of her deceased husband to see their child?  That greatly disturbs me.  That is her decision and her decision alone, and it is going to negatively impact the child most of all.  To me, that is a decision of an emotionally immature and selfish person.

I think it's very possible that she could have gone home the week she chose to tell Chris about her husband's suicide, but exploiting her situation saved her for at least a week.  She was just a "matter of time" girl, and she bought herself another week by exposing the intimate details of her husband's suicide.  I basically think that she sold her soul to the devil all for one more week on the show.  Now that she is out of the bachelor bubble, I wonder if she's regretting any of her actions and decisions?

Agree with all of the above, but the bolded is the saddest part of all of it. That child started life with a heavy emotional burden, losing her father to suicide.

stuckinsc wrote:Sorry but I have no pity for Juelia.  I don't care if producers prod you or whatever.  Have some class, do not discuss the details of your daughter's fathers suicide.  That is out there now and she has no control over how or when Ireland learns of this.

I had defended her before the season that maybe this helped her grief.  But what I saw on my tv is a self-centered woman who seems only to care for herself.  She left this daughter that she loves so much to go on a dating show where she seemed to have no interest in the lead but a great interest in furthering herself.  

I read some say that the in-laws should have to bend over backward to be nice to her to see their granddaughter/niece.  Really, what kind of a mother keeps her child from the only link that she has left to her father?  To me Juelia sounds as ill as Justin, which in my experience does  happen that like attracts like.  By her own words Juelia knew the night before that he had a gun and was threatening suicide and did nothing.  

I just can't dislike the woman anymore and personally while his family might have gone too far, they had been silent about her and everything else until she outed the details of his death, which was incredibly wrong.

If someone had said stuff like that about my sister you can be darn sure I would defend her memory and I acknowledge my sister had issues, but to do that is a complete lack of class.

If doing that is what you have to do to stay on tv, then get off tv.  I am so sick of the producers made them do it excuse.  The producers can't make you do anything, they suggest, they try to persuade, but everyone has a moral compass.  I don't think this woman cares for anyone but herself and that includes her daughter.  

I am truly sad for her child and hope her mother's parents are good people since her mother won't let her near her father's family.

100%. It seemed pretty apparent to me that the family had tried very hard not to judge Julia's decisions and let her grieve in her own way...until she exploited Justin's death. I have no doubt that the producers encouraged her to talk about it, but (like Jason Mesnick says in his podcasts) you always have a choice. Before I read their letters, I thought that she did it for more screen time and to get a competitive edge and I believe that even more strongly now.

And, I'm being very careful in not blaming her for the suicide (because if he wanted to, he would have found a way), but it seemed like she didn't even try to prevent it or get him help. His best friend wrote that she knew about the gun for 1 year and a half and didn't tell anyone? That's crazy to me. Not only for his safety, but her's and Ireland's as well.

I also call BS on it being cathartic. She could have spoken with friends, family members, people in support groups, etc. There is nothing that Chris, a man she had met 10 days earlier and had barely spoken to prior, could provide her than they couldn't.

I was certainly cringing as I watched Juelia's conversation with Chris. However, I am hesitant to criticize her. There are things I did, and decisions I made, when I was Juelia's age that truly make me shake my head today. But now I'm old enough to be her grandmother. Looking back, I realize I often learned more from my mistakes than from my glories. Juelia still has plenty of time to gain some wisdom from this experience, repair her relationships with her in-laws, and give her daughter some happy stories about her father.