Re: Bachelorette 7 - THE EDIT - Discussion

by noobsleuth Sat Jul 09, 2011 3:26 pm

ironcat wrote:
noobsleuth wrote:
CarrieAlexander wrote:Just typing out loud here..The edit is what makes the person who they are on this show.

We have nothing else to judge the person off of but their edit character because we don't know them in real life. I don't think it's fair to compare Ben and JP to each other when it comes down to who is better, whether it's for Ashley or just in general. People are going to like who they like for their own personal reasons whether the edit (or spoilers) influence that or not.

At this point in the season we should have developing stories for both men, and it should be individual of one another, whether the story will include Ashley is probably going to end up being understood in hindsight. JMO of course. So what do our edits show us thus far?

Totally JMO.

TPTB do this thing which they have become quite good at actually but have not quite perfected. In the past few seasons the F2 has been one of the top choices for the next lead. They show the F1 as a one dimensional character. No outstanding traits or quirky cute habits. TPTB DO NOT want America to "fall in love" with the F1... that's the lead's job. However, the F2 is always shown to be very honest with their emotions (which we can all respect) and we see a more fun side to them. We see their quirks, we see them in more interactions with other people in the house, they are shown in the outtakes being goofy, sometimes they have a sad history that's highlighted to tug on our heartstrings. TPTB want America to "fall in love" with the F2 so that by the time the next season comes around everyone is clamoring for them to "get" the role and throngs of contestants are lined up to fall in love with them.

However, I say they have not perfected this technique quite yet. Chantal was edited perfectly to be the next lead. They succeeded, everyone loved her and wanted to see more of her. However, they did a terrible job with Emily. They made her too one dimensional that most turned against her and Brad when he chose her over Chantal. This season they are doing a much better job. We can see how JP is falling in love with Ash. We see them kind of in their own little world. While his character is pretty one dimensional (all Ashley, only Ashley) we can understand why it might be him in the end. Then there is Ben. His relationship with Dino is even topping Jash LOL. Ash and Ben are always having a good time. They are having a good mix of romance and fun. But we need to realize they are trying to show us why anyone would love Ben not just Ashley. With JP (jealousy and all) they are trying to show us that he is a very Ashley specific character. Helps they left in her comments "Ben is the total package" (next Bach, don't you just love him?), "JP is the total package for me" (he's mine hands off!)

:awesome:

I have to strongly disagree with the bolded. Emily was the fan favorite of the general unspoiled viewing public throughout the show. Most viewers were thrilled she was picked (she led by a wide margin in every poll for "Who should Brad pick?"), and any ill will she garnered post show was because of that very uncomfortable ATFR, where some fans thought she was not lovey-dovey enough towards Brad, and were upset she was not willing to move to Austin immediately. Some also felt she threw Brad under the bus by talking about his temper. The only place where she was unpopular throughout the show airing was on the FORT board.

I see what you are saying and I do think you are more correct in your assessment then I was. yes

I agree that Emily was the one that people wanted to see with Brad in the end. (I am not very good with words laugh out loud

) I noticed a strong difference in most opinions after the airing of the ATFR (like you said) I remember reading alot of, "Brad picked the wrong girl" kind of posts under most articles online after that happened.

Sorry, the thought was there in my original post but I wasn't able to communicate it very well. :awesome:

by ironcat Sat Jul 09, 2011 3:41 pm

Sorry, noobsleuth, in rereading your words, I see where you were going, and I misinterpreted your meaning. Fans turned against Emily after Brad picked her, but the reason was not because they were hoping he'd pick Chantal. So we are actually in agreement!! Yay! yes

by Alanna Sat Jul 09, 2011 3:44 pm

Brilliant post, Noob!! I totally think that's the objective- show why F1 is perfect for lead and F2 perfect for everyone else. I mean, look at what we know about JP versus Ben. We know everything about Ben's dad, his career, his hopes, etc. OTOH, we know JP is called Cupcake at work because it's Ashley's weird request, exes made him cry, he hasnt had serious relationships because it plays into Ash's insecurity, he's ready to pop the question to her, and might have a conniption if he sees anyone touching or kissing Ash. Like you said, JP is all Ashley all the time while Ben is more well rounded and a more full fledged character when compared to Mr. Ashley.

by sjcaligurl Sat Jul 09, 2011 3:57 pm

Alanna wrote:Brilliant post, Noob!! I totally think that's the objective- show why F1 is perfect for lead and F2 perfect for everyone else. I mean, look at what we know about JP versus Ben. We know everything about Ben's dad, his career, his hopes, etc. OTOH, we know JP is called Cupcake at work because it's Ashley's weird request, exes made him cry, he hasnt had serious relationships because it plays into Ash's insecurity, he's ready to pop the question to her, and might have a conniption if he sees anyone touching or kissing Ash. Like you said, JP is all Ashley all the time while Ben is more well rounded and a more full fledged character when compared to Mr. Ashley.

I think this part bugs me the most about what we are seeing. If JP is F1, one would think we'd be given more info on him so that we could see what she sees in him beyond him being the best kisser and them having some cutesy cupcake coincidence. Obviously they talk more than we see because she is ultra comfortable with him and they have no hesitation in invading each other's personal space (Ben still seems afraid to touch her even when she tries to lean into him to be held). JP obviously told her his official birth name at some point that we didn't see and on their first date they had obviously discussed his 2.5 year relationship w/his ex. Oddly, neither he nor been seemed to have had really good track records with women - albeit Ben is a few years younger than JP. I'm still not content with the quality of JPs dates compared to the guys she's already sent home. I hope his FD and LCD more than make up for his evening half dates. But back to the point, I would hope that the F1 would have better character development otherwise, if they fail, it will just look like she chose him for the sex! LOL!

by mnmhughes Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:11 pm

sjcaligurl wrote:
Alanna wrote:Brilliant post, Noob!! I totally think that's the objective- show why F1 is perfect for lead and F2 perfect for everyone else. I mean, look at what we know about JP versus Ben. We know everything about Ben's dad, his career, his hopes, etc. OTOH, we know JP is called Cupcake at work because it's Ashley's weird request, exes made him cry, he hasnt had serious relationships because it plays into Ash's insecurity, he's ready to pop the question to her, and might have a conniption if he sees anyone touching or kissing Ash. Like you said, JP is all Ashley all the time while Ben is more well rounded and a more full fledged character when compared to Mr. Ashley.

I think this part bugs me the most about what we are seeing. If JP is F1, one would think we'd be given more info on him so that we could see what she sees in him beyond him being the best kisser and them having some cutesy cupcake coincidence. Obviously they talk more than we see because she is ultra comfortable with him and they have no hesitation in invading each other's personal space (Ben still seems afraid to touch her even when she tries to lean into him to be held). JP obviously told her his official birth name at some point that we didn't see and on their first date they had obviously discussed his 2.5 year relationship w/his ex. Oddly, neither he nor been seemed to have had really good track records with women - albeit Ben is a few years younger than JP. I'm still not content with the quality of JPs dates compared to the guys she's already sent home. I hope his FD and LCD more than make up for his evening half dates. But back to the point, I would hope that the F1 would have better character development otherwise, if they fail, it will just look like she chose him for the sex! LOL!

Last season, we knew Roberto was hot, a baseball player, liked to salsa and liked his mother's food. That was it. :Nod:

by BlondieGal Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:13 pm

sjcaligurl wrote: First she was fixated on Bentley then we see that along with Bentley, she had a strong attraction to JP and has basically said things that make all of the other guys seem like chopped liver. I'm hoping that the guys who left feeling like second fiddle to Ryan or Bentley realize that the 1st fiddle was right there in their face the whole time and those other guys were never really a factor.

Truly I wonder if the men left are fine with JP being the F1, that they were not quite into her as he. Just a thought.

by Guest Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:20 pm

mnmhuges, noob, and Alanna. so true. We only knew that Ashely was really into Roberto, but not too much about Roberto's life.

I also remember on Chris L. HTD..when his dad was saying he and Chris mom 'fell in love at first sight" and Chris says "so did we" and Ali nodded, that Chris had moved ahead of Roberto (in the EDIT). Many said that's why those commments were left in Chris HTD, to show he and Ali were in love. And the kissing in the tower, etc. It was all a smokescreen to attempt to show Chris as F1. Whereas Roberto's HTD was way less serious, dancing, laughing with his family, and his dad questioning if Ali was good enough for his son. And Roberto's HTD was shown half the time that Chris was on the TV screen. All smokescreen again to make the casual viewer think it could be Chris as F1 and not Roberto with the HTD edits.

So, I'm taking the HTD's wth a huge grain of salt. Whoever has the longest and most tender, with no conflict, could be the F2.

by summerluvn Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:23 pm

BlondieGal wrote:
Truly I wonder if the men left are fine with JP being the F1, that they were not quite into her as he. Just a thought.

And maybe they are not as into her as they are into J.P. They all seem to like him as evidenced by the ejectees saying what a great guy he is and the onscreen friendships he has with the remaining guys. Maybe they are following the man code and backing away out of respect for J.P. and his obvious "smitteness".

by Guest Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:24 pm

summerluvn wrote:
BlondieGal wrote:
Truly I wonder if the men left are fine with JP being the F1, that they were not quite into her as he. Just a thought.

And maybe they are as into her as they are into J.P. They all seem to like him as evidenced by the ejectees saying what a great guy he is and the onscreen friendships he has with the remaining guys. Maybe they are following the man code and backing away out of respect for J.P. and his obvious "smitteness".

I so agree and I keep remembering Ashely on Leno when he asked what if none of the guys like or fall in love with you. She said "I only need one". And maybe that's all she really did have?

by Nativenewyorker Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:34 pm

mnmhughes wrote:
sjcaligurl wrote:
Alanna wrote:Brilliant post, Noob!! I totally think that's the objective- show why F1 is perfect for lead and F2 perfect for everyone else. I mean, look at what we know about JP versus Ben. We know everything about Ben's dad, his career, his hopes, etc. OTOH, we know JP is called Cupcake at work because it's Ashley's weird request, exes made him cry, he hasnt had serious relationships because it plays into Ash's insecurity, he's ready to pop the question to her, and might have a conniption if he sees anyone touching or kissing Ash. Like you said, JP is all Ashley all the time while Ben is more well rounded and a more full fledged character when compared to Mr. Ashley.

I think this part bugs me the most about what we are seeing. If JP is F1, one would think we'd be given more info on him so that we could see what she sees in him beyond him being the best kisser and them having some cutesy cupcake coincidence. Obviously they talk more than we see because she is ultra comfortable with him and they have no hesitation in invading each other's personal space (Ben still seems afraid to touch her even when she tries to lean into him to be held). JP obviously told her his official birth name at some point that we didn't see and on their first date they had obviously discussed his 2.5 year relationship w/his ex. Oddly, neither he nor been seemed to have had really good track records with women - albeit Ben is a few years younger than JP. I'm still not content with the quality of JPs dates compared to the guys she's already sent home. I hope his FD and LCD more than make up for his evening half dates. But back to the point, I would hope that the F1 would have better character development otherwise, if they fail, it will just look like she chose him for the sex! LOL!

Last season, we knew Roberto was hot, a baseball player, liked to salsa and liked his mother's food. that was it.

I agree with this last comment in bold. Many people were saying that there wasn't enough information, that we didn't know who he was. At this point this season, we are in much the same place with JP. I think the real JP is there, but has been edited out. TPTB are showing us what they want us to see, which is the romantic, sexy, passionate JP who has fallen for Ashley almost from the beginning, on their first 1-on-1 date.

I am hoping that we get to see a bit more of JP the man, the qualities that will flesh him out for the viewing audience. I will say that we have seen a few glimpses into his character. On JP's second 1-on-1 date with Ashley in Hong Kong, when she told him about Bentley, we saw how well he handled this shocking revelation. We saw kindness, caring, respect. I am sure that inside JP was freaking out more than he let on. He had no idea where this was going. Was Bentley back for good? Would he be competing with him for Ashley? Was she going to tell him something he didn't want to hear? In the end, he got the answer he wanted. Bentley was over and done for good.

Maybe we will have to look harder and JP the man will be revealed in the details, the little moments.

by ironcat Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:48 pm

We may not have seen much regarding JP's likes and dislikes, hobbies and such, but I think what we have seen about him is so much more important, and that is insight into his character. The way he has conducted himself with Ashley and with the other guys tells me he is mature, extremely empathetic, rational, intuitive, personable, unselfish, intelligent, articulate, determined, I could go on and on! (I guess this is why he's my clear favorite.) He's not perfect, we know he's impatient, and not immune to jealousy. For me personally, knowing about these qualities gives me a clearer sense of him than I would have gotten by learning what his favorite flavor of ice cream was, or if he had a pet.

by Guest Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:53 pm

I loved when JP tried to lighten the "Bentley confession" mood and say, "Oh, I thought maybe he'd jump out of the bushes"...lol, so he was prepared for anything with her talking about Bentley. He showed such maturity and confidence, when I bet he was wondering where that was going when she started talking about Bentley. I love his personality everytime he's on the screen. He is Just Perfect, to me.

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