Bachelorette 16 - Clare Crawley & Tayshia Adams - Media SM - *Sleuthing Spoilers* #2

Norcalgal wrote:@luvstx I've felt it was Zac from the 2nd episode but I could be wrong. Am not going nuts about any one particular guy this season. I want Tayshia to choose who is best for her, not my fav!

But during the HT and overnight dates, we usually have the F1 confirmed through body language, etc.

I think Tayshia and Zac have the strongest connection at this point because their relationship has been more steadily progressing. That said, there is still more to come. It’s still the honeymoon period in all her relationships.
Zac is a sceptic. On his 1-1 he said he didn’t expect to develop feeling while “here”. I do believe he is falling in love but that doesn’t mean he will be in love in 2 more weeks. He has used the term “true love” to describe what he is looking for. That casts even more doubt in my mind that he or their relationship will reach that point by the end of the process. Tayshia’s night visit scene with Bennett shows her desire to hear ILY. Bennett saying it resulted in she keeping the turd LOL so it appears to mean a lot.
Zac’s family visit could also shift things. The way he told his survival story illustrates strong love in his family but also tough love. Zac hasn’t been afraid to correct Tayshia’s misconceptions (ex: she called him shy which he said he was not; he said he recently starting thinking of himself as a husband & father to which she said something like “because the guys in the house are talking about it” to which he said “no, because it my truth”) so I don’t think his family will hesitant either in asking possibly uncomfortable questions.
Thus far Tayshia has been somewhat adored by the guys and, aside from Ivan and Zac, she is often in IMO alpha position. That came through early with her not accepting Ben’s request to talk at an RC leading to Ben ruminating about showing up and when he did finally make a big gesture at her villa she needed him to do a lot of explaining. Seemed to me like she could have said thank you and then get to know each other more instead. More recently with Brendan at the lie detector date he almost overly attempted to convince her he was ready (he appeared a bit shook or made to feel insecure) and she still decided to feign not allowing a kiss - a wee power play.  I think if this trait is her rule rather than her exception IMO she is less compatible with both Ivan and Zac. I also don’t think she is intentional in these things. I see it as an opportunity for growth if she wants a relationship with men like Zac or Ivan. I like her as Bette.  
Read more about this perspective of power in Sharleen’s latest blog. She talks about it as it relates to Bennett and Noah.

I’m 50/50 on Zac being F1 which puts him in my final 2.

@HEA Have to say I never take ANYTHING Chris Harrison says to be the truth. He's promoting and hyping his show.

gabriele wrote:@luvstx I was on the Zac is F1 train for about 5 minutes and am back off it.

RS spoiler + lots of hype = foiler not spoiler

See: Brooks, Tyler C, Peter K

I actually don’t think the hype is out there in the general public for Zac. He has the second to least amount of followers among the final 7 guys (only Riley has fewer). I think the hype is there with certain people in the spoiled crew, but the general public seems fairly neutral on him. I don’t think it’s anything like  Peter K and Tyler C, who were both treated like rockstars. I don’t think we have a single contestant the lead is being shipped with  THAT intensely this season.

I think Zac is F1. It’s a bit of a lackluster ending for me personally, so I would love to be wrong. but I think that just makes the most sense. I just think we’re probably missing details of how they get there. Maybe Zac doesn’t want to propose or her family hates him and she still picks him and that’s why she’s been able to gush about other guys, because she knows there is proof that Zac was her first choice. Maybe she’s the one who dumps Brendan after his family doesn’t show and that’s why she didn’t have to be careful talking about him. Maybe something happened post-season. But I do think it’s Zac as F1.

IMO...The heartbreak at the end comes down to the fact that Tayshia really did have strong feelings for multiple guys. Many of the bachelorettes become laser focused on one guy right out of the gate, but not Tayshia. While I think it is Zac at the end ( the edit and “follow the feet” post show align with that) I think she really had a hard time saying goodbye to her guys at the end.  Ivan and Ben shared some deep emotional stuff with her, so it wasn’t easy to break their hearts. I also think the “engagement vs just date” scenario makes for an emotional roller coaster at the end. Just my 2 cents....as of today.

I'm trying to avoid the F1-F4 thread and follow the edit, so apologies if I'm missing something.

Two things that are question marks for me:
1. In most seasons of the Bette (and even the Bachelor), the person that the lead chases is the one that s/he wants. It doesn't always work out, like Des & Brooks or Rachel & Peter or Deanna & Graham, but s/he is their true F1. Who is Tayshia chasing?

2. The F1/lead relationship usually encounters obstacles towards the end of the journey that they overcome together, i.e., Ashley's family being opposed to JP, Hannah's parents questioning Jed, etc., Peter's mom disliking Madison. The couple must transcend those challenges. Who has obvious obstacles up ahead? Can he resolve them with Tayshia?

Tayshia & F4 men’s conflicts:
Tayshia: Am I ready to get engaged again or do I want to date more?
Zac: Is this true love enough to propose again?
Ben: Am I able to tell her how I feel?
Brendan: Am I ready to propose?
Ivan: Can I get out of the friend zone?

If these are on target, I can see the places where all of these relationships could potentially end by the FRC. Because last episode made it seem like a straight shot to the end–something that happened with Lauren/Arie/Becca right before HTDs–makes me agree with the press that it's a bumpy ride ahead.

@philphan, saw your post after posting mine; looks like we're on the same wavelength

Great questions @veg_out
Answering part of your #2 Obvious obstacles ahead
In the very near future
Ben - bringing in family that has no idea he attempted suicide twice and only his sister knows about 10 yr battle with bulimia. The concept of feeling he has to be perfect in his family. All 3 of these things are a big deal let alone a triple header. Bigger IMO than “here’s a woman I’m falling in love with”. I’m most curious about how this one will play out.
Brendan - small town boy marries first love well known by family. His folks may have never met any other woman he has dated so comfort zone could be a factor. It could be a first step for the entire family.
Zac - a potential fiancé is a long time coming. They are going to thoroughly vet her and not overlook that she is dating other men. He’s special to them and will want more than generic platitudes. I think they will ask Zac grounding questions as well.
Ivan - yep, he’s in the friend zone. He also seems to be less interested. At first he was smitten but appears to have cooled down a bit. There could be a mutual recognition as resolution.

JMO

notarose wrote:Great questions @veg_out
Answering part of your #2 Obvious obstacles ahead
In the very near future
Ivan - yep, he’s in the friend zone. He also seems to be less interested. At first he was smitten but appears to have cooled down a bit. There could be a mutual recognition as resolution.

JMO

I disagree with the bold. The show is seen from the lead's POV. T is def tepid toward Ivan but Ivan doesnt know that. He doesnt know that when T says 'falling in love with multiple men', she means Zac and Ben and not Ivan.
As Jojo observed in the last epi, Ivan is ready to make babies with T right NOW. I doubt he has cooled off.

seton wrote:

notarose wrote:Great questions @veg_out
Answering part of your #2 Obvious obstacles ahead
In the very near future
Ivan - yep, he’s in the friend zone. He also seems to be less interested. At first he was smitten but appears to have cooled down a bit. There could be a mutual recognition as resolution.

JMO

I disagree with the bold. The show is seen from the lead's POV.  T is def tepid toward Ivan but Ivan doesnt know that. He doesnt know that when T says 'falling in love with multiple men', she means Zac and Ben and not Ivan.
As Jojo observed in the last epi, Ivan is ready to make babies with T right NOW. I doubt he has cooled off.

Good point. I’m now leaning more toward your POV

@philphan I agree the "follow the feet" idea has served us well in determining F1.  I am just not sure how to apply it this time. The reported timing of SHV's suggest Zac because he was SM quiet each time.  However I'm not sure he posts much in general so IDK.  I have also seen others post things which are throwbacks or not in real time so again, IDK.  I do see Zac as being one to initiate affection, 
who most boldly shows his interest.  However I see him pursuing Tayshia while Tayshia pursues Brendan.  I'm wondering if Brendan turns out to be her Reid or some such.  Again, I never have a good picker as to F1 so "IDK".

@notarose  I like your assessment.  When it comes to Brendan, however I see small town guy in the realm of maybe Chris Lambton.  Both from small towns in Mass., but both Boston "adjacent" in that they frequented the "city" a bit.  Brendan posted from the Harbor district on Friday night.  Both super-close with family, each had lost a parent.  Both worked for awhile in large cities, Chris in NYC and Brendan in LA.  Each had a world knowledge outside their hometowns.  Ed Lambton remains my all time favorite BN dad.  I hope we get to meet Brendans' family.

pavalygurl...it’s definitely a different type of bachette season. Not many SM clues (although there was a Zac airport sighting if source is reliable).  The edit shows to me that they are both pursuing each other. Tayshia was VERY concerned with Zac’s cheating response during the lie detector date. Zac is also the only one she has told she is falling in love. I think she was pursuing Brendan at the beginning like you said, but now her focus is on Zac. If it is Brendan at the end of this, the edit is very strange, IMO.

pavalygurl wrote:@notarose  I like your assessment.  When it comes to Brendan, however I see small town guy in the realm of maybe Chris Lambton.  Both from small towns in Mass., but both Boston "adjacent" in that they frequented the "city" a bit.  Brendan posted from the Harbor district on Friday night.  Both super-close with family, each had lost a parent.  Both worked for awhile in large cities, Chris in NYC and Brendan in LA.  Each had a world knowledge outside their hometowns.  Ed Lambton remains my all time favorite BN dad.  I hope we get to meet Brendans' family.

Agree on all fronts.