Bachelorette 15 - Hannah Brown - July 22 - MTA - *Sleuthing Spoilers*

So within a 2 week time span in Greece Hannah had to deal with the Luke situation, potentially got engaged to Jed, who then told her (maybe) about Haley? No wonder she came back exhausted and it must have been so easy to break if off with Jed once more truth came out. She probably was never fully invested after so much drama. IMO.

ReneeM wrote:Yeah production crossed a lot of lines this season with Luke. From not sending him home when he did what he did to Luke S, to sending him back in when Hannah first sent him home on their 1-1, to this. This wasn’t an elimination where Hannah seemed to be torn about sending him home so you give them another chance to work it out. Nope. This was an extremely volatile goodbye and they sent him back in after seeing that. Then Hannah’s gotta move the rose table and the other guys have to step in? WHAT. THE EFF??? Under no circumstances should that have gotten that far. Disgusting.

I'm totally appalled that the guys had to step in and help Hannah get him to go. That's not even a little ok.

I have said this many times.. they ( production) try to put do the drama for the season before! It’s not ok !!!

dee wrote:Let it be a cautionary tale for those that want to be the next lead....production is not your friend.

... but does that ever sink in?
The RC story shows that producers brought Luke to the ceremony location instead of sequestering him in his hotel. The scene described would have never happened if producers hadn’t set it up. How was that not obvious to everyone there? They all needed to be told where to show up so the situation could have been nipped immediately. Hannah could have ignored Luke and told the producers game over. She could have left until production removed him. The other guys might have followed her lead. Might not have made for as great a tv scene but c’mon now, Hannah continuing to engage with Luke had more than run its course by that point. Useless move to keep repeating.
It’s crazy to deal with the puppet when the puppet master is right there and clearly the instigator.

ReneeM wrote:

(MEN TELL ALL SPOILERS): 17 guys total. Peter, Jed, Tyler not there...

-Mike was the most popular guy by far

-4 hot seat interviews: Luke, Mike, Cam, John Paul Jones

-It was the Luke bashing show. Luke ended up leaving towards the end of filming and never returned (cont..)

— RealitySteve (@RealitySteve) July 13, 2019

(MORE MTA SPOILERS): At one point Hannah faces the cameras directly and apologized to America for keeping Luke on our screens so long.

More coming tmrw...

— RealitySteve (@RealitySteve) July 13, 2019

So Hannah is attacking Luke by saying that he isn't smart enough to manipulate her?  Really?  This is the same woman who said that she is good at "discernment" when assessing other people?

Discernment: Here are a few adjectives from the dictionary's definition.  Perception, astuteness, recognition.  

Recognition:  identification or knowledge of someone or something from previous encounters.  It sounded like Hannah has had plenty of "similar encounters" in her previous relationships that should have clued her in that Luke was the same kind of guy that she has been attracted to in the past.  But red flags were being ignored by her left and right.  I will agree that part of the problem was her insecurity, but IMO she too wasn't "smart" enough to discern and recognize the situation.  And I think that she needs to take responsibility for HER part in this as well.  It takes two to tango.    

So IMO Hannah is not taking responsibility for having kept Luke there all the way to the FS.  And to me that is a flimsy excuse, because IMO she either ignored all of the red flags or she isn't as discerning as she claims to be.  And to insult Luke's intelligence?  Not cool IMO.   And very immature.  Hot mess Hannah meet hot mess Luke.  IMO both of these people need to work on themselves asap.  And IMO Hannah is not ready for a relationship with a guy like Tyler.  I hope Tyler realizes this.

When it gets to the part where Hannah holds herself accountable please wake me up...

New bit of info from bachelor.spoilers. She had heard Luke was doing an apology tour earlier this week prior to MTA with some contestants to save face. It was brought up during mta and obviously didn't work. That's all she says on it.

So if Peter was not at the MTA, he will need to be at the ATFR, hopefully the first night.

notarose wrote:

dee wrote:Let it be a cautionary tale for those that want to be the next lead....production is not your friend.

... but does that ever sink in?
The RC story shows that producers brought Luke to the ceremony location instead of sequestering him in his hotel. The scene described would have never happened if producers hadn’t set it up. How was that not obvious to everyone there? They all needed to be told where to show up so the situation could have been nipped immediately. Hannah could have ignored Luke and told the producers game over. She could have left until production removed him. The other guys might have followed her lead. Might not have made for as great a tv scene but c’mon now, Hannah continuing to engage with Luke had more than run its course by that point. Useless move to keep repeating.
It’s crazy to deal with the puppet when the puppet master is right there and clearly the instigator.

The guys wouldn’t know until Hannah told them, since they didn’t know she kicked him out.
I am sure Hannah understood it, and could theoretically have refused to go out to them, but maybe she did. Maybe there was a 30 minutes discussion before she finally agreed to do it. I can imagine their arguments.

The only ones to blame here are the producers IMO. They are showing us once again what ruthless azzholes they are. I really hope they get a ton of backlash for it. I remember CH whining about the hate he got for what they did to Becca last year. This new stunt, while completely different, seems to be on the same level of discusting.
All JMO

Idlemess wrote:When it gets to the part where Hannah holds herself accountable please wake me up...

She did apologize for keeping him around for as long as she did. That’s all she needs to do at this point. She apologized to us, the audience, and to the men. I don’t think we need an apology in my opinion seeing as how it was her that had to endure his “toxic masculinity” as she put it.

When production allows him to come back AFTER she sends him home and does NOTHING to remove him from the premise when she obviously does not want him there, that is not her problem. That, to me, is a total manipulation on production’s part.

eliza3 wrote:

HavaDrPepper wrote:

sosleepy wrote:

ReneeM wrote:More MTA spoilers went up on reddit. Luke continues to be worse than advertised. The audience got to see a shortened version of the FS episode. Luke told Hannah he could forgive her for one slip up in the FSD but if she did it with multiple guys he’d want to leave. She sent him home immediately but he wouldn’t leave. She had to ask him a bunch of times to get up from the dinner table. Then when he finally did get up he refused to get in the van, she had to get really aggressive with him to get him to leave. Then he showed up to the FSD RC. The other guys didn’t know he was eliminated and he just showed up and lined up with them. Hannah was pissed and tried to get him to leave again and he refused again, at one point she picked up the rose stand and moved it to get away from him and use her body to block him. The other guys then stepped in and got him to leave. YIKES. All of that is super ugly and yeah producers are partially to blame but LUKE made all the choices and all of them are bad imo.

Wow. Producers really took it extremely too far, imo. She’s the lead. She made her decision. How toxic and disgusting to allow that guy to carry on like he did - to actually encourage that behavior by allowing it to happen. It shouldn’t be up to the other 3 contestants to help her, and I’m amazed it got that far. She made her decision, a clear decision, and producers should have stepped in and walked Luke out.

My next thought is after all of that, she still had to let Peter go. This season is too much.

It is no wonder she broke down after all that happened.

She should have just walked off the set....let CH appear and she could have told them she own't continue until he leaves as she has asked

You are exactly right. She should have returned to her room and locked the door until Production did their jobs. I get it though. Sometimes you’re so freaked out you just don’t have the presence of mind to do what makes sense.

Also, if they include footage of her falling down, that will be horrific and just plain mean and disgusting.

I have to say IMO she was very wrong to apologize to America for keeping Luke on so long. It does confirm what I always thought though which is she could have sent him home sooner if she wanted to - like every Bette before her so, I think he had been begging his way back on since that 1-1 date in episode 5. IMO It is true however, that they should have stopped ALLOWING him access to her. She looked panicked when CH told her he was back with a ring. She should have said no, no way. But then I remember Becca’s poor acting job when her ex showed up. This mess is soooo contrived.

blueblues wrote:

notarose wrote:

dee wrote:Let it be a cautionary tale for those that want to be the next lead....production is not your friend.

... but does that ever sink in?
The RC story shows that producers brought Luke to the ceremony location instead of sequestering him in his hotel. The scene described would have never happened if producers hadn’t set it up. How was that not obvious to everyone there? They all needed to be told where to show up so the situation could have been nipped immediately. Hannah could have ignored Luke and told the producers game over. She could have left until production removed him. The other guys might have followed her lead. Might not have made for as great a tv scene but c’mon now, Hannah continuing to engage with Luke had more than run its course by that point. Useless move to keep repeating.
It’s crazy to deal with the puppet when the puppet master is right there and clearly the instigator.

The guys wouldn’t know until Hannah told them, since they didn’t know she kicked him out.
I am sure Hannah understood it, and could theoretically have refused to go out to them, but maybe she did. Maybe there was a 30 minutes discussion before she finally agreed to do it. I can imagine their arguments.

The only ones to blame here are the producers IMO. They are showing us once again what ruthless azzholes they are. I really hope they get a ton of backlash for it. I remember CH whining about the hate he got for what they did to Becca last year. This new stunt, while completely different, seems to be on the same level of discusting.
All JMO

 to the bolded. She could have announced immediately to the guys that she already sent him home so that everyone knew what was happening. Maybe she did... yet to see the scene.
Totally agree that production was asinine and they should be outed and made accountable.
Luke, to me, has a few loose screws.
BUT I also feel Hannah repeatedly allowing Luke back is on Hannah. After the first time she sent him home then let him back the mixed signals began. She set the stage for “no means maybe”. Heck, she even went to his hometown. She had countless opportunities to ditch him over the course of the season with the full support of every guy in the house. JMO that she made decisions that caused this storyline to escalate. Cause & effect.
Hot mess with many shareholders.