Re: Vanessa Grimaldi - Bachelor 21 - Fan Forum - *Sleuthing Spoilers*

[SueSt]

I want to know if Nick also does all these sweet little gestures he does with Vanessa with the other women. I've managed to build a high tolerance for Corrinne and I don't see it. I don't know about Rachel and Raven because I can't stomach watching either one.

I feel like Nick is more expressive with Vanessa...in most cases he is the one doing the first move on her...

...with Raven, she always initiates...but their kisses, I feel, don't have the passion we are expecting from lovers...

Corinne is kind of wild...she mostly does the first move, but Nick does entertain her advances...

Rachel and Nick's kissing is more traditional or conservative, but during her HTD, she has shown a little bit more aggressiveness than usual...but, I feel like Nick would have gradually disconnected after her HTD...I feel like although biracial issues are crucial...her family has dwelled too much into the topic...I don't think Nick has enjoyed it as much as the HTDs from the other 3 frontrunners...in my opinion, if Rachel is able to bring Nick home with her on him agreeing to come along, regardless of her skin colour, they should have trusted her gut feeling that this guy is definitely not racist or concerned about skin colours...there is really no need of dealing too much on the subject...this scenario has kind of pop up in my mind of a situation wherein a guy is biracial...would you ask the girlfriend on how comfortable she is knowing the mother is black...it is irrelevant...and, I don't think it should be taken in as a big deal...

Nick's kisses with Vanessa on screens are intimate, but delicate with passion...I think with Vanessa being a teacher, Nick is trying to preserve her image in public out of respect for her...but, I think that they can be wild behind the scenes...

On Vanessa's HTD, we haven't seen much of the happy atmosphere surrounding the family's get together... but, I think it has happened in real time... the questions and concerns have came in afterward...but, the issues that have been discussed are legitimate of which most long distance relationships would have encountered...after knowing how much they love each other, I don't think, it is much of a great deal...the scenario with Vanessa's father...with Vanessa knowing Nick has proposed to all fathers...I think would be a big concern to Vanessa knowing Nick as an impulsive guy...she needs to know how much Nick loves her...Nick may have given her a little bit of reassurances...but, until they are together... to be engaged/to be married...nothing is set in stone in this kind of environment...

Really good points, Skate!!

[ukglasgowkiiss]

At the end of the HTD would it be likely that Vanessa stayed at her fathers house? If so then it makes me think she would have a chance to hear the full story of what Nick told her father- perhaps making the distinction about how the blessing was asked for or if anything ws said off camera. Or do they whisk the girls away to a hotel as in Vanessas case she wd be flying to NYC the following day anyhow?
In past Htds always got the impression the f4 stayed with their family after saying goodbye to the lead.
Imo.

[Catdwoman50]

@ukglasgowkiiss I don't think they stay after the visit. The social experiment is to ensure contestants are isolated from family or friends that may influence their decisions without cameras rolling. So no they don't stay with family they get whisked to the hotel they are staying at. I read this in Courtney's book.

[Skates]

I want to know if Nick also does all these sweet little gestures he does with Vanessa with the other women. I've managed to build a high tolerance for Corrinne and I don't see it. I don't know about Rachel and Raven because I can't stomach watching either one.

I feel like Nick is more expressive with Vanessa...in most cases he is the one doing the first move on her...

...with Raven, she always initiates...but their kisses, I feel, don't have the passion we are expecting from lovers...

Corinne is kind of wild...she mostly does the first move, but Nick does entertain her advances...

Rachel and Nick's kissing is more traditional or conservative, but during her HTD, she has shown a little bit more aggressiveness than usual...but, I feel like Nick would have gradually disconnected after her HTD...I feel like although biracial issues are crucial...her family has dwelled too much into the topic...I don't think Nick has enjoyed it as much as the HTDs from the other 3 frontrunners...in my opinion, if Rachel is able to bring Nick home with her on him agreeing to come along, regardless of her skin colour, they should have trusted her gut feeling that this guy is definitely not racist or concerned about skin colours...there is really no need of dealing too much on the subject...this scenario has kind of pop up in my mind of a situation wherein a guy is biracial...would you ask the girlfriend on how comfortable she is knowing the mother is black...it is irrelevant...and, I don't think it should be taken in as a big deal...

Nick's kisses with Vanessa on screen are intimate, but delicate with passion...I think with Vanessa being a teacher, Nick is trying to preserve her image in public out of respect for her...but, I think that they can be wild behind the scenes...

On Vanessa's HTD, we haven't seen much of the happy atmosphere surrounding the family's get together... but, I think it has happened in real time... the questions and concerns have came in afterward...but, the issues that have been discussed are legitimate of which most long relationships would have encountered... after knowing how much they love each other, I don't think, it is much of a great deal...the scenario with Vanessa's father...with Vanessa knowing Nick has proposed to all fathers...I think would be a big concern to Vanessa knowing Nick as an impulsive guy...she needs to know how much Nick loves her...Nick may have given her a little bit of reassurances...but, until they are together...engaged to be married...nothing is set in stone in this kind of environment...

I agree with nearly everything you are saying besides one thing. I don't think Nick cares that Rachel is black or that her family wanted to discuss it.
Nick likes to hear different opinions and values them. I'm sure they talked about other stuff as well but the edit chose to show us the racial "issues".
Maybe production thinks that Rachel's cast should be aware of what such a relationship might imply and that those few guys who are serious about Rachel should consider that as well.
We also don't know if not of the producers asked her family if they think that Nick is ready to be in an interracial relaionship and that got them thinking. All JMO.

Maybe there's big differences in between countries...I live in Canada, and I am also among one of the visible minorities...thus, I don't feel racism as much here since we are so multi-culturally oriented and biracial is so wide spread here...if there is racisms, it will apply to all races between white and any other colours...but, it will not come across with the questions on how comfortable are you with a black person, black community or black environment...

...we are living in the 21st century, racism has lessened down more so now than before, thus we have white people defending black or different ethnicities and vice versa...although more effort is required to shut it down...my thinking is if you magnify something, the issues stand out more... so we are better off toning it down....this is in regards to issues on skin colours....

[Skates]

I want to know if Nick also does all these sweet little gestures he does with Vanessa with the other women. I've managed to build a high tolerance for Corrinne and I don't see it. I don't know about Rachel and Raven because I can't stomach watching either one.

I feel like Nick is more expressive with Vanessa...in most cases he is the one doing the first move on her...

...with Raven, she always initiates...but their kisses, I feel, don't have the passion we are expecting from lovers...

Corinne is kind of wild...she mostly does the first move, but Nick does entertain her advances...

Rachel and Nick's kissing is more traditional or conservative, but during her HTD, she has shown a little bit more aggressiveness than usual...but, I feel like Nick would have gradually disconnected after her HTD...I feel like although biracial issues are crucial...her family has dwelled too much into the topic...I don't think Nick has enjoyed it as much as the HTDs from the other 3 frontrunners...in my opinion, if Rachel is able to bring Nick home with her on him agreeing to come along, regardless of her skin colour, they should have trusted her gut feeling that this guy is definitely not racist or concerned about skin colours...there is really no need of dealing too much on the subject...this scenario has kind of pop up in my mind of a situation wherein a guy is biracial...would you ask the girlfriend on how comfortable she is knowing the mother is black...it is irrelevant...and, I don't think it should be taken in as a big deal...

Nick's kisses with Vanessa on screen are intimate, but delicate with passion...I think with Vanessa being a teacher, Nick is trying to preserve her image in public out of respect for her...but, I think that they can be wild behind the scenes...

On Vanessa's HTD, we haven't seen much of the happy atmosphere surrounding the family's get together... but, I think it has happened in real time... the questions and concerns have came in afterward...but, the issues that have been discussed are legitimate of which most long relationships would have encountered... after knowing how much they love each other, I don't think, it is much of a great deal...the scenario with Vanessa's father...with Vanessa knowing Nick has proposed to all fathers...I think would be a big concern to Vanessa knowing Nick as an impulsive guy...she needs to know how much Nick loves her...Nick may have given her a little bit of reassurances...but, until they are together...engaged to be married...nothing is set in stone in this kind of environment...

I agree with nearly everything you are saying besides one thing. I don't think Nick cares that Rachel is black or that her family wanted to discuss it.
Nick likes to hear different opinions and values them. I'm sure they talked about other stuff as well but the edit chose to show us the racial "issues".
Maybe production thinks that Rachel's cast should be aware of what such a relationship might imply and that those few guys who are serious about Rachel should consider that as well.
We also don't know if not of the producers asked her family if they think that Nick is ready to be in an interracial relaionship and that got them thinking. All JMO.

I know Nick doesn't really care, but the way biracial issues are being emphasized here...so much so it has became too overwhelming for some other people or it may also scare some other suitors that are not black...I am not even there, but I can already feel that this issue maybe a big thing for them...and, redundancy can be quite annoying...it is a bad projection on the family if it is not the case...

Maybe there's big differences in between countries...I live in Canada, and I am also among one of the visible minorities...thus, I don't feel racism as much here since we are so multi-culturally oriented and biracial is so wide spread here...if there is racisms, it will apply to all races between white and any other colours...but, it will not come across with the questions on how comfortable are you with a black person, black community or black environment...

...we are living in the 21st century, racism has lessened down more so now than before, thus we have white people defending black or different ethnicities and vice versa...although more effort is required to shut it down...my thinking is if you magnify something, the issues stand out more... so we are better off toning it down....this is in regards to issues on skin colours....

[Skates]

IMO the racial issues were TPTB produced, initiated, brought to attention, ... maybe already with a thought of Rachel being the potential Bette, so they tried to bring the focus on what is going to be "an issue" for some ... during her season.

Now back to Vanessa, since the Fan forum isn't open to discussion about other contestants.
IMO each HTD was sweet in their own way, but the level of comfort to just be of both, Vanessa and Nick, was really deep and undeniable ... especially the part of them alone at her school, the way they touched each other, communicated and how they delivered the lines ... it was like watching 2 talk without the cameras in their faces ... they weren't talking to "us", to please and make a show, they both talked like they would have every-day conversation about who is going to do the dishes ... almost "nothing special" kind of talk to them (but boy was he observant of her, because it was her home-ground and he was sensing it) ... it was because of that "nothing for the show talk" that IMO when they laughed at the absurdity and silliness of the moments they both laughed and looked towards the producers/handlers (whoever was present by the camera) ... am I making any sense?

I love the part wherein Vanessa is teaching Nick how to speak Italian... It is so cute...I don't think it has ever been included in the edit for Vanessa's HTD on TV...I guess, they have to take it out since her HTD is already the longest among the 4...I can't find the video right now...maybe somebody can attach or show the link here...

[Kashathediva]

I don't have the link--but I enjoyed that bit you mentioned and mentally noted it also. Nice, warm moment. IMOAA

[Skates]

I want to know if Nick also does all these sweet little gestures he does with Vanessa with the other women. I've managed to build a high tolerance for Corrinne and I don't see it. I don't know about Rachel and Raven because I can't stomach watching either one.

I feel like Nick is more expressive with Vanessa...in most cases he is the one doing the first move on her...

...with Raven, she always initiates...but their kisses, I feel, don't have the passion we are expecting from lovers...

Corinne is kind of wild...she mostly does the first move, but Nick does entertain her advances...

Rachel and Nick's kissing is more traditional or conservative, but during her HTD, she has shown a little bit more aggressiveness than usual...but, I feel like Nick would have gradually disconnected after her HTD...I feel like although biracial issues are crucial...her family has dwelled too much into the topic...I don't think Nick has enjoyed it as much as the HTDs from the other 3 frontrunners...in my opinion, if Rachel is able to bring Nick home with her on him agreeing to come along, regardless of her skin colour, they should have trusted her gut feeling that this guy is definitely not racist or concerned about skin colours...there is really no need of dealing too much on the subject...this scenario has kind of pop up in my mind of a situation wherein a guy is biracial...would you ask the girlfriend on how comfortable she is knowing the mother is black...it is irrelevant...and, I don't think it should be taken in as a big deal...

Nick's kisses with Vanessa on screens are intimate, but delicate with passion...I think with Vanessa being a teacher, Nick is trying to preserve her image in public out of respect for her...but, I think that they can be wild behind the scenes...

On Vanessa's HTD, we haven't seen much of the happy atmosphere surrounding the family's get together... but, I think it has happened in real time... the questions and concerns have came in afterward...but, the issues that have been discussed are legitimate of which most long distance relationships would have encountered...after knowing how much they love each other, I don't think, it is much of a great deal...the scenario with Vanessa's father...with Vanessa knowing Nick has proposed to all fathers...I think would be a big concern to Vanessa knowing Nick as an impulsive guy...she needs to know how much Nick loves her...Nick may have given her a little bit of reassurances...but, until they are together... to be engaged/to be married...nothing is set in stone in this kind of environment...

Really good points, Skate!!

Thanks...

[sdmom]

Try this link
https://www.instagram.com/p/BQyzrftAj1b/?taken-by=nickviallandvanessagrimaldi

[Guest]

...snipped.

Obssessively rewatching the "one more for the road" kiss at the end of the video.

[Mgrissom]

...snipped.

Obssessively rewatching the "one more for the road" kiss at the end of the video.

Would love to have heard the conversation about the talk with dad and seen the make-out scene before the "stay out of your head" and "see you at the rose ceremony"

[notarose]

There is something about Vanessa's family concern (which I don't see as a concern specific to Nick being the man she is falling in love with) coupled with V saying on their 1st 1-1 that she didn't want to pry when asking a question about his past that makes me think her family is a locked vault on the matter of her 3 year past heartbreak.  There must be a reason why this particular relationship is so secret.
When Nick was talking to V's dad, her dad's face was relaxed despite the weightiness of the content except when Nick said "safe" at which point Pat's brow furrowed.  Also, every family member from mom's side spoke very openly about their concerns and their emotions but "heartbreak" remained undefined.  These are detail-orientated people IMO but nary a hint beyond the fact that a heartbreak occurred and the suggestion that the family may have been somewhat traumatized because Vanessa was.  Something, perhaps, atypical.

Not sure if Nick knows more at this point in filming and is one of the protectors or if he suspects and is exercising patience or if he is modulating his passion hoping for a slow burn.

I find the evolution of this relationship to be swift and deep and I see more intimacy from Nick toward Vanessa at this point than in past seasons combined.  He endears her with gentleness, tenderness, meaningful stillness.
Curious as to how measured he is sexually.  He watches her intently and when she leans forward he swoops in for kisses.  Standing on the yacht he nibbles her lower lip to the rhythms of her palms moving slowly up his torso... but he watches, eyes opened, to monitor her response, and as tempted as he might be to likewise explore her exposed back or sides, he doesn't.  When in the water, exchanging air, he did glide atop her and pull her closer for a few seconds.  It seems to me he is learning her body in a way.  So different for openly sexual Nick.

He says "care of you" "protect" "safe".
Curious.  Also loving and lovely.

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