Vanessa Grimaldi - Bachelor 21 - *Sleuthing Spoilers* #4

It's been mostly consensus here that it was Vanessa all along for Nick, It's his fourth time on this show so he has more experience than anyone else, (even if Bukowski appeared more because nick went all the way every season he's on), He's one of the smarter bachelors we've had, so I do have a higher expectation of Nick than any of the others. He knows better than anyone the complications that having sex with people who aren't your F1 causes, especially because Nick's become so synonymous with sex within the context of this show. There's no excuse IMO for Nick having sex with multiple people, and there's no way IMO it wouldn't bother Vanessa. I really hope he doesn't sleep with any of the other girls. All JMO.

I disagree. I think he has too much to lose and nothing, maybe except for a moment of pleasure, to gain.
I think he is tired of this perception of him being some kind of a sex machine, someone that can't say no to anyone. He said multiple times that he's a one woman guy and IMO at that point he new who she was.
He would be risking losing his F1, risking F2 bringing this up at the ATFR and what on irony that would be.
JMO

Wanting to Nick to sleep only with his F1 is a nice thought. It's comforting because it does speak to the potential longevity of his and Vanessa's relationship. However, this show has a history of some leads sleeping with more than their F1. I don't think Nick is immune to that, regardless of his ~sexy bachelor~ narrative. He's neither more nor less of a saint compared to some previous leads, IMO.

That being said, if he does have sex with more than just his F1, I hope there's a conversation and a mutual understanding that sex is not equal to "I love you. I am going to marry you." I think that's where it gets messy -- when certain promises are attached to the deed.

I don't think Nick will sleep with multiple people. Not because of Vanessa, but because he's very image-conscious and smart and knows how hypocritical that would make him seem, if that ever got out. IMO.

I do hold Nick in high regards when it comes to sex, because of everything he said and has shown to believe in (also supported in actions, not just talk) ... because I believe in the integrity ... and honesty and respect.
That doesn't mean that I think he doesn't have 1-night stands and "no love involved" sex, but that he is honest with the women he is with and that both are aware and consensual in what's going on. That means that in case of sleeping with F2, she would be conscious of being a 1-night girl ... or as Andi put in words "a girl just to f***". Knowing what comes after ... and I don't think of the break-up, ATFR, media or reputation ... but consideration of F1, her feelings, consequences and the respect, which so far he has never denied it any of the woman he's been with, so why do it to his "One". - This is all hypothetical JMO
... but I don't doubt ... since in few interviews Nick put emphasis on how there was lot of less sex than what people imagine and that the expectation of that FS-overnight has more to do with off-camera talk than the act itself.

cmarci93 wrote:

notarose wrote:I think Vanessa on any date is great   Nick has said in an interview helicopters make him slightly queasy. Not sure if Vanessa has many secrets.  We don't know anything about her last relationship but Nick might by this point.  

V really likes Christmas so I could see her enjoying a sleigh ride with St Nick. And they can cuddle under blankets all the way ho ho ho!  And reindeer, another 1st.
Oh dear, now I'm really hoping that is their 1-1.

not sure if you saw the season 21 preview , but its rachel that goes on the sleigh ride with nick because rachel is wearing a red hat while talking to nick in a cabin and you see a girl wearing a red hat while kissing nick on the sleigh.

thats why I'm saying vanessa is probably the one that gets to see the northern lights with nick and not the helicopter ride.

I so agree with you...they will definitely be fascinated by their surroundings and will giddily be touching on every topics under the sun, i.e., science, their experiences, etc...    

If not be, there's also that chance that they can go to Canada to see the Northern Lights in Manitoba... it would be great if they could experience both...

cmarci93 wrote:@2ndcampbell yea it will be interesting, i understand where vanessa is worried but nick keeps giving her hints to stay.

I believe those are the reasons why she is staying...or...she would have already walked out long before, if she is not seeing any signs from Nick... regardless, the fear and pain are unavoidable since she is so invested in him...I can feel Vanessa's intensive love for him through her words, expressions, emotions--her happiness and pain when he is with him....

When it comes to sex? IDK. If they want to have fun--then that's what might happen in the heat of the moment. If not--then I guess no. If love--then I guess only one. It depends on the mental/emotional momentary state is my guess.

happygolucky wrote:

shaughnessyb wrote:@happy, for me it's more about avoiding the speculation about it that might be hurtful to V. It would just be a non factor. But I agree with your above points as well

OK... makes sense. Thank you.

About Vanessa - responding what I read around - IMO she didn't complain that much **... saying "what are you doing and why would you do it, knowing I might see it, knowing people will judge you?" (confronting him at the party) or "I'm fed up with the gossip and his stupid choices" (crying in her room) or "he didn't tell me what I wanted to hear and it doesn't feel good" (confessing in ITMs) or "asking for a blessing all 4 families makes his question to my father less meaningful and I'm not sure if he feels the way I feel" (sharing her perplexity in ITM) - all paraphrased /JMO - to me it's not a complaint or whining ... but it's explaining own emotions, negative, uncertainty, hurt, anger, annoyance, doubt, fear ... that IMO is being honest and self-aware and people should be able to express their own negative emotions, actually it's quite healthy for own mental health, because suppressing them inside leads to frustrations -IMO - and not feeling them at all, honestly I can't imagine when the whole point of this "game" is about feelings.

** there was 1 moment when she did sound whiny, when she said "I've been so patient" ... there I could agree, but it's not enough for me to ascribe to her "whining" every time she expresses her thoughts that aren't all "roses and hearts".

I think Vanessa deserves to pat herself on her back... Nick, indeed, has requested Vanessa to be more patient... she isn't doing it out of her own...thus, I take Nick words as validations for her that something will come out of this...indeed, he is seeing a future with her...

...and, Vanessa has been trying so hard regardless of seeing so much negativities...

I do believe that if their time in doing the show is so restricted with so many do's and don'ts, I don't think Vanessa and Nick have connected much during those times...being in love with somebody, being patient, waiting and hoping for some things to happen because of what the guy she loves has requested is definitely tough...but, because of the instant connections Nick has with Vanessa, he has already put her as one of his frontrunners... thus, he tries to focus more on the other girls...struggling on how to eliminate them to come up with his other 3s...

I am not taking any of Vanessa's frustrations as whining...since it is mostly her way of expressing how she feels...the incidents in St-Thomas has happened to all the remaining girls as well, basically, all of them have been whining as well... the scenarios have only stood out with Vanessa due to TPTB edits on her...

@Skates IA that there were probably moments (days) when they couldn't connect or built on their connection (like on GD) ... but Nick mentioned how he observed the girls on the first night of M&G, how they ate, how they tried to entertain themselves when they weren't aware to be watched ... to understand them and their characters, so I'm guessing he did that kind of observing all the time even when he wasn't engaging in the conversation with them and IMO he was very observant how she was reacting to the situations (girl around), also she was good in communicating her issues once they were finally together again, bringing whatever bugged her in the previous days to the front (like her starting the debate on the yacht) ... and his "stay out of your head" IMO is based on his perception of Vanessa (correct, JMO), so he knows her "pretty well" by now despite the environment and lack of time to really "get to know each other".

Kashathediva wrote:When it comes to sex? IDK. If they want to have fun--then that's what might happen in the heat of the moment. If not--then I guess no. If love--then I guess only one. It depends on the mental/emotional momentary state is my guess.

It has happened to Nick before...if he likes the girl, the girl is consensual...and, bum they'll do it...

If ever it happens, I think it will only happen with Rachel that is if he is still indecisive between the two of them (Vanessa and Rachel)...Nick may want to figure out their sexual chemistry for a tie breaker... Lol!!...

...but, for me it is quite obvious that Nick is giving up on Rachel after her HTD...not because of racial issues as per her skin colour, but more so of his comfort level with her family...I don't think he is as comfortable with her family as he is with the family of the other 3s due to the racial issues being raised time and time again...and, with Raven and Corinne those are non-issues... Corinne maybe wild and aggressive...but, Nick so far has been able to stop her from further advancing to base 3...so everything comes down to only one...that is Vanessa, Nick has already shown keen interests to her since Day 1...he knows Vanessa is the one after more than 1-1 dates...I really don't think the sleeping with others speculations will happen again...he has said his numbers are less than 30...I don't even think he is anymore interested to add or lengthen his list other than doing it with only his fiancée...

Maybe Andi's showing up is a wakeup call for Nick to thread slowly and be cautious...but, Andi has a book in the line...with a second book coming in... and, she is also being paid 20k as per RS...to appear for only 15-20 minutes, that is pretty cool for 20k, don't you think so...no sweat in earning that much...

Skates wrote:

Kashathediva wrote:When it comes to sex? IDK. If they want to have fun--then that's what might happen in the heat of the moment. If not--then I guess no. If love--then I guess only one. It depends on the mental/emotional momentary state is my guess.

It has happened to Nick before...if he likes the girl, the girl is consensual...and, bum they'll do it...

If ever it happens, I think it will only happen with Rachel that is if he is still indecisive between the two of them (Vanessa and Rachel)...Nick may want to figure out their sexual chemistry for a tie breaker... Lol!!...

...but, for me it is quite obvious that Nick is giving up on Rachel after her HTD...not because of racial issues as per her skin colour, but more so of his comfort level with her family...I don't think he is as comfortable with her family as he is with the family of the other 3s due to the racial issues being raised time and time again...and, with Raven and Corinne those are non-issues... Corinne maybe wild and aggressive...but, Nick so far has been able to stop her from further advancing to base 3...so everything comes down to only one...that is Vanessa, Nick has already shown keen interests to her since Day 1...he knows Vanessa is the one after more than 1-1 dates...I really don't think the sleeping with others speculations will happen again...he has said his numbers are less than 30...I don't even think he is anymore interested to add or lengthen his list other than doing it with only his fiancée...

Maybe Andi's showing up is a wakeup call for Nick to thread slowly and be cautious...but, Andi has a book in the line...with a second book coming in... and, she is also being paid 20k as per RS...to appear for only 15-20 minutes, that is pretty cool for 20k, don't you think so...no sweat in earning that much...

If I were Andi I would also go back on the show for 15-20 minutes if I'd get 20k