Bachelor In Paradise - Season 3 - All Episodes - Discussions - *Sleuthing - Spoilers* #2

Well, I think Jared needs to man the crap up, defend his woman and cut Ashley I. loose once and for all. No friendship. Clearly, Ashley can't handle that. She's stuck at a 13-year-old mentality, so makes sense.

That being said, in the past when drama like this happens (Blake/Holly come to mind - and that was SO MUCH WORSE with Michael and the broken engagment  when compared to Ashley and her delusional "second base" relationship), Jason/Molly/Melissa situation is another one- again, way messier than this with lots of Bach nation taking sides and chiming in... In the end, the happy couple always prevails. Always. That's what is remembered, that is what is lasting. The couple that made it through the drama, everything else left behind. Now it's up to Jared to leave the mean girl crap behind and prioritize Caila.

I watched AP and saw AI's father speak.  I didn't make too much of the words he said - one way or the other. He said he was proud of her.  He may have been referring to the fact that he is proud of her lasting virginity. He may have been referring to her handling the media and SM fairly well for a 28 year old (his opinion). Plus, parents who are asked to skype into a tv show aren't going to utilize that 1 minute to try to teach their child anything or to criticize them. They are going to be all 'fluffy' and 'complimentary' of their special Prince or Princess.

I do, however, find the psychology of AI fascinating, as well.  I think some of it must be that she was raised to have unrealistic expectations about Love. A fairy tale version versus the real life version. In fairy tales, virgin Princesses are rescued by Knights on white horses. There is nothing grey that happens in a fairy tale. It is all black and white. Real life--not so much. Real life is trial and error. It is a process where we allow ourselves to make mistakes and to learn from them. AI strikes me as someone to has an unhealthy need to project perfection (for example, her obsession with her make up being perfect in the Mexican heat) and she is looking for a man who is perfect (she has somehow projected onto Jared that he is her perfect man, because he looks like Aladdin to her Jasmine?   ). She is trying to be perfect. She wants a man who is perfect. She is not comfortable in any setting where she isn't in complete control over what is going to happen (any surprise like Caila completely throws her for a loop). She is petrified of situations like that because she knows she will have an OTT reaction (cryfest) to them. And she has an OTT reaction to them because she has set up completely unrealistic expectations for how life is supposed to go for her.

Now, yes, I would say that somewhere in the parenting of AI someone helped to set up and reinforce unrealistic expectations for her.

Two of my most popular things to say to my kids have been:
1) I always sang the Rolling Stones song "You Can't Always Get What You Want" to them
2) "Life is unfair. The quicker you learn that, the better prepared you're going to be to deal with it."

I repeat: I wish parents would stop raising their daughters to be Princesses, and instead raise them to be empathetic Warriors.

JMOAA.

@Miahawk:
I have two daughters and I use the 1 and 2 above to this day.
Had it been me on Skype I would have said to "let it(him) go". You can be proud and let them face reality. I think he fosters a great fairytale as you suggested vs real life.

If I was her Mom, I would have put an end to the cryfest a long time ago, probably via therapy. There is wire loose somewhere for her to cry like that, IMO.  It is not normal, at all. IMO. If the reaction to something is that out of proportion, something is off kilter in the psyche. IMO. I person doesn't just become that at age 25,26,27. I hope she can seek clarity within herself and move on.

So who in the Bachelor family has actually criticized Caila, apart from a couple of nitwits like Leah? They may not be defending her either, but perhaps that's because they don't think there's any reason to? I mean I'm not a big Caila fan, yet I can't see anything wrong with her actions and find the idea that she owes Ashley anything ludicrous. I think most people from the show know Ashley and know she's not a crying lunatic at all times, so they feel the need to point that out since she's acting like a crazy person on the show. That doesn't mean they don't find her actions crazy, they just know that's not all there is to her so they feel some kind of sympathy. I do think she would benefit much more from people telling her she IS acting like a lunatic, but I guess people don't want to get on her bad side.

I do have a little bit of understanding towards her, since I did have a similar "psychotic break" over a guy at one point in my life where I just couldn't let it go and couldn't stop thinking about ways to get him back (not that he was every truly mine). Granted I was like 10 years younger than her at the time and had the good sense to not tell anyone how obsessed I really was, since I knew they'd think I was insane. I think the main reason I was so fixated on him was my lack of relationship experience at the time. He was my first "love" (really I just loved how he made me feel) and since I'd waited so long ( ) for it, it was hard to imagine ever finding someone like that again. He was a total douchebag BTW, so it really was the blind sort of love, but at the time I was just so fixated on that fantasy. I think it takes surviving a breakup or two to realise that there indeed are plenty of fish in the sea and Ashley's never got to that point. It's pretty crazy considering her age and I can't help wondering how on earth that happened. Maybe she did like some guys before Jared as well, but she met them IRL, so there was no Paradise fantasy involved in the mix. The fantasy is that missing component that truly pushed her over the edge this time, IMO. She really needs to snap out of it sooner rather than later though or she'll be very sorry in a few years time when she realises she wasted her best years pining over a guy who never wanted her.

RS said in his video chat that he doesn't believe Caila and Jared are together anymore.

Why does RS believe that? What else did he say in the video chat? Thanks!

Just mentioned this in Caila's thread, but the people who've sleuthed stuff here have made it pretty clear IMO that Jared and Caila are still dating. I think the interview Caila did though was the biggest clue that they are still dating. If I hadn't seen that interview I might've thought they'd recently split, but the way she spoke about Jared made it pretty clear they are in a relationship IMO.

@MiaHawk Thanks for sharing. It's always insightful to read stories from members.

I don't mean any disrespect, but that is something I just can't understand why anyone would do that to themselves. It's a waste of time, not to mention opportunities that might be waiting elsewhere. There is so much more to focus on rather than someone who isn't willing to share life with you.

As far as Ashley and the psychology of it all, her father said they raised her as a princess. She lives in a fantasy world where the happy ending only involves her and an imaginary prince charming. She isn't capable of understanding what others might be feeling. She only cares about her own feelings, how is she going to find another Jared, don't tell her she's obssessed, "you can't tell me that", her life is all about what she wants people to say and how she wants them to behave to suit her. After being somewhat called out on AP, she mentions Jared led her on, yet in her blog she admits she wanted it to continue even though she felt she was being led on. That's her choice, that's not everyone else's fault. She chose to remain in that so called friendship in order for her to have more time to work on him.

Behaving in this manner so publicly for so long, IMO would make a guy think twice about getting involved with her. Not only that, how are they going to handle breaking up with her? She needs more life experience, more real heartache. She chose to hang on to a fantasy relationship, she choose to dream up scheme's to win Jared's love. It's all her own actions, however she chooses to blame every one else.

She constantly retweets tweets about herself. She needs help, and Jared should have pushed her in that direction long ago IMO. Maybe Jared is now falling in love with Caila, and realizes, Ashley is not a friend, she's a nightmare.

GuardianAngel wrote:She lives in a fantasy world where the happy ending only involves her and an imaginary prince charming. She isn't capable of understanding what others might be feeling. She only cares about her own feelings, how is she going to find another Jared, don't tell her she's obssessed, "you can't tell me that", her life is all about what she wants people to say and how she wants them to behave to suit her.

This is so important. It's one thing to have difficulty moving on or getting over someone, but IMO the most disturbing thing is that Ashley's actions are devoid of empathy for other people and for their wants and needs in life. IMO her expecting Caila to give up a chance at love, for Jared to not meet someone he was interested in, is a very very toxic and selfish mindset. She at that point wasn't just meddling in her own life, IMO she was trying to dictate the lives of other's (and someone she'd only met a few times). I just don't see how that way of being will ever lead to a fulfilling life. AshleyI might get twitter followers and fan support, but real love and happiness is going to elude her if she doesn't develop some compassion and maturity IMO. I guess the show supports this kind of toxicity, and it's only going to get worse each year if nothing changes. All JMO.

Does anyone know what heritage/nationality AI's family is?  

I ask this because I know that certain cultures do not believe in the Western tradition of dating.  The older generation may still believe in arranged marriages/set ups by family members and thinks badly of the process of dating. 

I have a friend whose parents moved here from another country in the 1960's, and they were very Americanized. Yet, after my friend danced with a boy at a wedding, the boy told her aunt that he'd like to marry her. So the aunt asked the mother and the mother called my friend at college and said "Remember So-and-so from the wedding last weekend? Would you like to marry him?" To which my friend was horrified and said "Absolutely not!" 

A few years after college, my friend moved to California from NY, into a condo in the same complex as an aunt, uncle and cousins.  I inquired if she had met anyone out there since moving. She laughed and told me that if she ever dated a guy and her family found out, they'd consider her a promiscuous person. 

Cultural norms can have a huge effect on the courtship process and how many different relationships a person actually has. Just food for thought.

^^I was pretty sure she is Italian but I went to look it up and it says:

Italian American Virgin    

http://okhereisthesituation.com/2014/12/ashley-iaconetti-2015-bio-photos-twitter/