The Bachelorette 11 - Kaitlyn Bristowe - Britt Nilsson - Edit Analysis - *Sleuthing - Spoilers*

Not all of us take this stuff seriously. I, for one, think many read way too much into certain sign placements and any attempt at predicting future events is a crap-shoot. (You can't really tell if a future event is "bad" or simply "dramatic".) Yet there are definite cycles and patterns in life... just like we have consistent seasons and weather conditions. Basically, your "natal chart" is a snapshot of a "moment in time" that is different than everybody else. Even twins have some details that are different unless they happen to "pop out" the very same minute. Often you hear about people meeting others who share the same birthday and are quite surprised of certain coincidences they share in common. Even though they are different people with different lives and raised in different environments, they may have married at roughly the same time and with a person that is similar in personality, had similar career and hobby interests, maybe the same number of kids, etc.

If you look up your partner/spouse... and also your parents and other couples you are familiar with... and find out the "aspects" between person A's planets with person's B's, you will read some strikingly familiar descriptions. I did not list ALL of the "aspects" above involving Shawn and Kait. Also everything listed is abbreviated and VERY generalized. Yet you can get a good grasp on what they are like together.

He finds her stimulating because she is slightly unpredictable. He is very disciplined in his personality and she loves to discipline others. Probably most fights they have involve each other being too nitpicky about things. Both also have that impulsive streak to do oddball stuff that can get them into trouble at times (see "His Mercury square her Jupiter" & "His Jupiter square her Uranus"). While Andi and Josh had a lot of masculine fire signs on their chart (which may account for some temper tantrums and high "drama" that did them in), these two have a heavy emphasis on "water" and "earth" (both feminine/domestic), so family is bigger issue than with some of the other couples. If they make it past the first five months post-show (the testing time for these reality couples), I do think there's a strong chance they will marry and have a kid at least before the Rosenbaums did.

Personally, I am still a bit skeptical of the whole sex-with-Nick storyline. Something about it still feels off to me, but I can't place my finger on exactly what it is. I do not doubt that they DID, just "when", since the way it was presented on screen felt so staged to me. Apparently Mike Fleiss does NOT want us to know whether or not they did more than just online text each other pre-show and pre-Shawn. Certainly "all of America" believing they did is a definite test on Shawn's endurance level as a prospective partner, since Kaitlyn is getting chewed alive online. (This is a bit like what Chris Siegfried went through when "all of America" was convinced Des was not over Brooks even if Diamonds + Hearts made it obvious that there was a more going on between Des/Chris than Des/Brooks off camera.)

Regardless if they did or didn't ON THE SHOW, Kait will probably realize at some point that Shawn is the "stable" Taurus (if his birthday is correct above) that she needs. Nothing against Nick, but he is her "we're enjoying being *in the moment* with each other" relationship that probably would not succeed long-term, although they may remain friends. I get the sense that she needs more of a sense of security with a partner who is more predictable in his habits. Sex is great, but... some people want more than just that.

JBF wrote:Not all of us take this stuff seriously. I, for one, think many read way too much into certain sign placements and any attempt at predicting future events is a crap-shoot. (You can't really tell if a future event is "bad" or simply "dramatic".) Yet there are definite cycles and patterns in life... just like we have consistent seasons and weather conditions. Basically, your "natal chart" is a snapshot of a "moment in time" that is different than everybody else. Even twins have some details that are different unless they happen to "pop out" the very same minute. Often you hear about people meeting others who share the same birthday and are quite surprised of certain coincidences they share in common. Even though they are different people with different lives and raised in different environments, they may have married at roughly the same time and with a person that is similar in personality, had similar career and hobby interests, maybe the same number of kids, etc.

If you look up your partner/spouse... and also your parents and other couples you are familiar with... and find out the "aspects" between person A's planets with person's B's, you will read some strikingly familiar descriptions. I did not list ALL of the "aspects" above involving Shawn and Kait. Also everything listed is abbreviated and VERY generalized. Yet you can get a good grasp on what they are like together.

He finds her stimulating because she is slightly unpredictable. He is very disciplined in his personality and she loves to discipline others. Probably most fights they have involve each other being too nitpicky about things. Both also have that impulsive streak to do oddball stuff that can get them into trouble at times (see "His Mercury square her Jupiter" & "His Jupiter square her Uranus"). While Andi and Josh had a lot of masculine fire signs on their chart (which may account for some temper tantrums and high "drama" that did them in), these two have a heavy emphasis on "water" and "earth" (both feminine/domestic), so family is bigger issue than with some of the other couples. If they make it past the first five months post-show (the testing time for these reality couples), I do think there's a strong chance they will marry and have a kid at least before the Rosenbaums did.

Personally, I am still a bit skeptical of the whole sex-with-Nick storyline. Something about it still feels off to me, but I can't place my finger on exactly what it is. I do not doubt that they DID, just "when", since the way it was presented on screen felt so staged to me. Apparently Mike Fleiss does NOT want us to know whether or not they did more than just online text each other pre-show and pre-Shawn. Certainly "all of America" believing they did is a definite test on Shawn's endurance level as a prospective partner, since Kaitlyn is getting chewed alive online. (This is a bit like what Chris Siegfried went through when "all of America" was convinced Des was not over Brooks even if Diamonds + Hearts made it obvious that there was a more going on between Des/Chris than Des/Brooks off camera.)

Regardless if they did or didn't ON THE SHOW, Kait will probably realize at some point that Shawn is the "stable" Taurus (if his birthday is correct above) that she needs. Nothing against Nick, but he is her "we're enjoying being *in the moment* with each other" relationship that probably would not succeed long-term, although they may remain friends. I get the sense that she needs more of a sense of security with a partner who is more predictable in his habits. Sex is great, but... some people want more than just that.

Excellent analysis JBF. Agree the months following the show will be telling as to whether they last or not. I do think she is in the moment more with Nick than Shawn as well and that her relationship with Nick would not survive long in the real world. Meanwhile, I do think that the jealousy traits of Shawn were highly exaggerated for plot purposes so I don't look on it as much as a red flag as others do.

What is interesting to me is at one time it was thought both Shawn & Nick had the same birthday.

Luvstruck wrote:What is interesting to me is at one time it was thought both Shawn & Nick had the same birthday.

Definitely don't remember that but we now know Nick's is in September, Shawn's is in May.

Yeah... none of us have crystal balls and can predict whether or not Shawn and Kait will last.

Actually the fact that Shawn looks so much LESS "jealous" than he is made out to be is one key reason why I keep struggling with the whole Nick "sex-gate" business. I mean... just SUPPOSE (just thinking up possible scenarios here) that she and Nick briefly dated (instead of just text) while she was in the running for Bachelorette and all hell broke loose with the Fleissmeister. Of course, they had to incorporate Nick into the season to cover up any potential gossip that may be leaked of a future lead not staying "single" when she was supposed to be. Well... if Shawn knows that the True Story does not match The Storyline, he really has no reason to be "jealous" of her being with Nick before meeting him. All of this is silly speculation on my part. I have NO clue what really happened off-camera this season... and, frankly, do we all care what REALLY happened anyway? It is just a silly TV show. Yeah, it is more entertaining than Naked Dating, but Naked Dating is a Reality Show while The Bachelorette is "technically" more of a Primetime Soap Opera with nonprofessional actors being "coached" by handlers.

I always had this funny notion that the bachelors auditioning for a bachelorette season are asked on a questionaire: "Will you walk bare-foot over hot coals if you really loved the lead gal?" Then production keeps a certain quota of guys answering "I thought I was auditioning to be the Bachelor!" ... and a certain quota of guys answering "yes". SHE only needs to fall for one guy, of either answer on the questionaire. Then  the whole "walking on coals" test is enforced with all of the "I'm in love with Frank!", "I'm in love with Bentley!", "I'm in love with your bro-buddy Arieeeee!", "I'm in love with Brooks!", "Nick didn't take the lie detector test in Venice and you did!" and, this season (new seasons require more "shock" drama), "Nick and I sexted as well a text each other!"

Don't worry Kaitlyn... I'm coming for you

So Shawn stated pre-season... after watching her get dumped in Bali by Prince Farming.

A trip down memory lane and what I posted the day after "part two" of the premiere, when Kaitlyn was selected over Britt as Bachelorette...

At the rose ceremony, Tanner states: "No one knows where they stand at all."
Answer: somewhere behind Shawn B.

Good grief! That boy was EVERYWHERE at the start of this show.

In the promos at the start of the show, Mister Harrison narrates his limo arrival as "most eligible men in America". (They did the same with Ali's Roberto, as I recall.) After Kaitlyn says "my husband is in that room", Shawn says... right after... that Kaitlyn is "the best fit for the Bachelorette".

On the show, Harrison arrives to inform Kaitlyn of her position. She is very sympathetic towards Britt and he comforts her in knowing that Britt handled it well.
Harrison: You think your husband might be in that room?"
Kaitlyn: I felt that already... yes.
Harrison: Then we are off to a good start.
Yes... this is a good start. Not that it will be an easy road to the finish line this season.

Kaitlyn calls her mom on the phone, crying over the news.
The next shot shows guys talking, then Shawn is shown in PI again: "I have no clue what's gonna happen tonight. It makes me a little nervous because I told Britt that I was here for Kaitlyn. I am hoping and praying that Kaitlyn is the Bachelorette."
Next shot has Kaitlyn again crying so happy to be Bachelorette on the phone.
Mom is heard saying "Go meet my future son in law"

In front of the guys, Harrison says as the camera zooms in on Shawn: "you chose a woman that... my true hope is that... one of you gentlemen will find everlasting love with."
After Kaitlyn enters the room, Shawn is again showcased... and gives a sigh of relief with a sign of the cross in his PI session. (Another religious "sign" tossed into our storyline.)
Kaitlyn says her heart is pounding out of her chest when Shawn is shown... again.

Sooo... we had to go through all of this drama just to get to the inevitable!

Including... The Dramatic Ending You Won't Believe. (That is what MISTER Harrison promised.)
Picture this... Sunny Malibu. They are keeping the finale local this year.

Right away, before introducing him to Mom & the folks, Kait declares that she and Nick "had sex" in Dublin. Even Nick is surprised she told them in his PI session.

Mom and sis are not too trusting of Nick. Uh oh. Yet Mom is moved by his tears when discussing his w-u-v for Kait. Mom cries quite easily. (Just wait till you see her with Shawn later.)

Mom confirms she was wrong about Nick and calls him a "teddy bear". Awwwwwwwwwwwwwww!!!!!!! Isn't that cute!!!

This is EXACTLY how I viewed Nick in Andi's season!



As cuddily as he is, the family had still interrogated Teddy as to whether he came on the show for HER or for The Show... and he, of course, proved it was for her.

In contrast, this family is ALL over Shawn. Kaitlyn is even told how different she is with him compared with Nick. Yet Mom is concerned of Shawn's potential... *gasp*... jealousy (thanks to Sex-Gate). Yet Shawn is as sick of being labeled "jealous" as some of us are sick of hearing it. He is OK with Kait "testing the waters" with other guys... including his dueling bro-buddy.

When Shawn asks both parents' approval, he gets it (per Mom) "one thousand percent". *sniff sniff*

After all of this, Mister Harrison even comments to his live audience of 90% teary-eyed women on Shawn's stunning performance with her family. He asks our live audience which guy has the edge. A huge cheer goes for Shawn and a quieter murmur for Teddy. Per Harrison: "Sounds like it is almost 50-50". Yup, Mister Harrison... almost.

Next up... the last chance dates.

Oh gosh darn... Teddy Bear is so humble and cuddily when he meets up with Kait for LCD time.

On their glamorous yacht, the two get sunburn (like Jillie and Ed on their fantasy date... which was why he couldn't "perform" properly on their "overnight"). Kait "needs clarity tonight" because she is so much in love with him, but cares deeply for both guys equally. That "clarity" comes in a cute framed photo and poem, highlighted by the line of "electricity in your lips" and a mis-spelling of "energy". Once again, Kait says "in this moment", she is all in love with him and sees him as her husband. She is always "in this moment" with Teddy. (On After The Final Rose, he will remind her that she may have been "in the moment" but he never was.)

Later... Mister Harrison asks his live audience if Shawn's date "will change everything". Dum Dee Dum Dum.

Well... not at first. The clever editors decided to show S & K in wine country at their most awkward and speechless. Shawn even says in PI that he is no longer sure if he will propose to her! (Yeah... right. Oooooooh the suspense is killing mmmmeeee!)

The conversation the two have at night is more interesting than most we have heard before. She actually asks Shawn how he will react to the TELEVISION SHOW playing back months later... and he admits it will be tough seeing her kiss Kentucky Joe. (Ha ha! Gotta wuv Shawn.) He is NOW once again ready to propose.

He then presents her a lovely "memory jar" full of junk collected from all of their dates. Kait is all a glow, BUT... when leaving that date, all of her "I will have heartbreak somebody" talk is spoken over Shawn looking down.

Ring time with Neil Lane.

Twice we see Shawn shirtless. Just in case he doesn't get the girl, he can still recruit male viewers with his fitness training abilities. See my killer abs!

In contrast, Teddy looks a bit nerdier (although he is certainly buff himself as well) and strolls down filthy stony steps in his bare feet. In a very funny moment that had me rolling on the floor, Teddy tells Neil Lane (and reminds All of America in case they have forgotten) that they never met because Cruel Heartless Andi The Dorf dumped him early on the day of final rose ceremony. Neil Lane, pretending to look sympathetic, responds "Oh really?" Neil is quite impressed with the old ring that he got in Dublin though.

As Kait gets ready for the final showdown at... the Bachelor Mansion (huh?!), we see both dudes in their nighttime limos. Of course, Teddy is the confident one.

AND... he gets dumped. She claims she needed "every moment" with him to make her decision, unlike Andi (who just "made love" and dumped him early). He tells her to stop saying she loves him when she didn't pick him. She "took it way" from him. (I am assuming not his virginity like Ben H.)

He tosses both of his rings (the Dublin one and Neil's) on the limo floor... so they can be properly returned. This contrasted with Zak W. in Desiree's season, who aimed for the sidewalk when he was dumped as her F4. He then says: "I'm the biggest joke." No you are not. You are the Perfect Bachelor Contestant. In one episode, you have made a 180 degree turnaround. All of America just... might.. like you. At least I find you funny and furry.

Of course, winner Shawn bends down and proposes... and Kait is all gushy. Before this great romantic finale, Mister Harrison repeatedly asks the viewers and the live audience if Shawn would ever propose. Well... Shawn questioned if he would propose when the two  were tongue-tied (and sloshed) in Wine Country, but confirmed he would once he gave her the memory jar that evening. Um, Mister Harrison... please... WATCH YOUR OWN SHOW AND QUIT TALKING!

After the Final Rose: let's spend more time with Teddy!

In a rare twist, this post-show live spectacular begins with the Happy Couple. Usually Mister Harrison starts with just the lead and the F2 dumpee. Also Shawn and Kait's scene is rather short. Maybe this is a good thing because these two keep groping each other with more lustful intensity than any scenes she had with sex-pot Teddy.

Yet Teddy IS the star of the show and Mister Harrison spends a loooooong time with him.

Then Teddy meets up with Shawn for "The Great Wrestling Match" that Harrison is hoping for... and we do not get. I mean... the way Harrison keeps going on, I thought Shawn would shove a chair down Teddy's throat. But NOOOO! Despite Harrison stroking the testosterone, Shawn and Teddy remain gentlemen.

Also Teddy meets up with Kait and we get shown his rejection... with teary Teddy in his little "viewing box". What?! We were not allowed to see Kait and Shawn in THEIR "viewing box" watching That Romantic Proposal?!?

Eventually, Teddy DOES leave... and we get a final FIVE minutes with Shawn and Kait (and he makes the audience sniffle a bit by declaring her as the strongest woman he ever met)... and another TEN minutes of Bachelor in Paradise promoting. Somebody gets knocked up in this season. Who says this franchise is not productive? Shawn proposes, Jimmy Kimmel and Guillermo help Kait shop for wedding dresses and somebody else gets a delivery by the Paradise Stork.

On his show, Jimmy K had the final word. He forced the happy couple to put their hands together on a stack of US Weekly magazines and swear they would stay together through July 27, 2016 or pay him a fine of $1000.

I never considered that something more than the texting, talking, or skyping etc. may have happened before this season between Kaitlyn and Nick. But that does feel right to me....it makes a lot of sense in why the pre FS overnight happened. intriguing theory.

Y'know... I am just assuming what we heard on screen was true. Kait and Nick had sex in Dublin. They have mentioned it enough times.

The problem for me is that there are way too many cute little coincidences making me think parts of the "storyline" may have been preplanned, such as...
1.) Nick gaining notoriety as the dumpee who accused Andi for "making love" to him on her ATFR. Already he has a storyline going into Kait's season... and the guys all talked about it in New York when he arrived.
2.) Kait telling Chris right out of the limo on his season that he can plow her field anytime. (Add to this all that was insinuated going on in a tent in his promos.)
3.) Jimmy Kimmel discussing with Kait and Chris on their post-Costco date about "not being jealous" because, per Kimmel, God made Chris the Bachelor for a reason and "it is all part of the process". Kait even mentioned a "test-drive" scenario that some viewers found shocking.
4.) Although Andi and Josh's breakup probably had little to do with Nick, you know all of the discussion of Nick online certainly put pressure on that relationship.
5.) Although these incidents were unrelated, they were still interesting: Britt's "nap" after her balloon ride caused a ruckus with the competing ladies... and several ladies (not Kait, who wasn't present in the scene) acted embarrassed when hearing about the Love Guru date.
6.) They were hardly subtle suggesting that Chris and Kait did something on the fantasy date. Whitney probably did too, but mostly she just needed "little soldier samples" at the clinic... ha ha! Becca was The Virgin, along with earlier dumped Ashley. (Soooo much virgin talk that season.)
7.) The group date with the middle school "actors" had several guys (without Shawn and pre-Nick) discussing sex, just to make sure they were comfortable about the subject.
8.) The way the Kait/Nick affair was all shown on screen with a closed door and silly voice-bytes of a conversation. I mean... really? They could have inserted a volcano (like Jillie and Ed's season) instead.
9.) Shawn, not Nick, was getting the OFF CAMERA time.
10.) Shawn did not seem as shocked by the news on screen as I expected him to be. Maybe he is OK about this because he has had multiple experiences with different ladies going into this and has no trouble with Kait "playing the field"? This, of course, means he is not all that "jealous" after all. Yet why present him that way? He never was mad at Nick for anything sexual, just whether or not he was here "for the right reasons". (Kait's family also grilled him for that.)

This is why I often wondered... just as a possibility... that maybe Kait and Nick did more than just socialize online with each other BEFORE the show started filming. Yet these two, along with Fleiss, decided to pretend there was no sex pre-show and simply convince viewers it all happened n Dublin instead. Several possible reasons why this COULD be the case:
1.) Kait was not supposed to "date" as a future lead and they had to "fudge" the evidence.
2.) Shawn needed a good "test", just as Roberto had to deal with the Frank business, JP with Bentley, Chris with Brooks, etc.
3.) They knew viewers would be more angry about any sex on screen than Shawn and, again, this was a test for Shawn to see how well he would defend her against the onslaught of hate and disgust. (Many Americans are very prudish about sex and are eager to stone the "naughty".)
4.) "They" wanted to show that sex is just a physical act and has little bearing on whom a lead will choose in the end.
5.) Testing the "Double Standard". Did you know... that prior to the sexual revolution in the 1960s, it was typically OK for a typical guy to "sow some wild oats" before getting married but any "proper" lady stayed a virgin until her honeymoon? Again, I am reminded how annoyed Trista was in her interviews about how it was OK for Alex and Aaron to date multiple women but viewers were not happy with her dating multiple guys.

Yet... I keep going back to what I state up top. Kait keeps insisting it all happened in Dublin, so... I might as well believe... or "believe"... the storyline. I guess... maybe... she saw Shawn as The One early on, but the Temptation of Nick the Ultimate Stud Muffin was too great for her to pass up. She needed that one-night stand to satisfy her thirst (much as future grooms need a Bachelor Party). Correction: Intimacy is an important part of a relationship... and she WAS in love with Nick too.

JBF wrote:The problem for me is that there are way too many cute little coincidences making me think parts of the "storyline" may have been preplanned, such as...

Interesting ponderings. IMO story lines for a season are written before filming starts and casting gets done to help fit those story lines - or story lines get written around casting opportunities - or more likely a combination of both.

It hasn't escaped me that this season they started with two bachelorettes and each had one guy who was very attracted to the possible lead - Brady to Britt and Shawn to Kaitlyn. I never fully understood how Shawn was attracted to Kaitlyn from Chris S's season until it came out after the finale; but casting created a story line that whoever was The Bachelorette, there was one guy who could leave to go after the one not selected. IMO this was very possibly no accident.

After Andi's season and what happened with Nick it just seems to flow into a story line that Nick comes back, has sex with the lead and gets dumped (again) at F2 setting up another epic confrontation at the ATFR. While the confrontation was far from epic I think the show and CH on stage tried to make it epic - they just failed to.

You had mentioned in an earlier post how "staged" the Dublin sex date was and I would agree - I would say it was very well "produced" in the sense that camera angles (in tight quarters) were all good - lighting was all good, focus was all good, mic placements caught all that was said, there was a very slick ITM with Kaitlyn to "explain" her mood going into the date - at was all very slick and well done. And that means to me there wasn't much organic about it - all those things don't just happen that way IMO - they take work and planning.

Whatever all this actually means ...
JMHO

Boy! Did you nail the Dublin scene. That had flawless lighting and editing. I dunno...this is one of those shows where some scenes are acted and some scenes are "spontaneous". It is a chore determining what is what.

I mean... obviously K & N "did it" at some point. The only question is "when".

AND... let's face it. Does it really matter to us viewers? I am not out to create a major "conspiracy speculation" here. The end result was exactly what they wanted: Shawn needed "tested" for either his "jealousy" issues and/or his willingness to stand by his woman with all of the onslaught of online hostility. (My gosh! She didn't murder anybody!) I especially liked how they discussed "watching the show later" on their last chance date. How often does the lead and future F1 discuss that on camera?

JBF wrote:Yeah... none of us have crystal balls and can predict whether or not Shawn and Kait will last.

Actually the fact that Shawn looks so much LESS "jealous" than he is made out to be is one key reason why I keep struggling with the whole Nick "sex-gate" business. I mean... just SUPPOSE (just thinking up possible scenarios here) that she and Nick briefly dated (instead of just text) while she was in the running for Bachelorette and all hell broke loose with the Fleissmeister. Of course, they had to incorporate Nick into the season to cover up any potential gossip that may be leaked of a future lead not staying "single" when she was supposed to be. Well... if Shawn knows that the True Story does not match The Storyline, he really has no reason to be "jealous" of her being with Nick before meeting him. All of this is silly speculation on my part. I have NO clue what really happened off-camera this season... and, frankly, do we all care what REALLY happened anyway? It is just a silly TV show. Yeah, it is more entertaining than Naked Dating, but Naked Dating is a Reality Show while The Bachelorette is "technically" more of a Primetime Soap Opera with nonprofessional actors being "coached" by handlers.

I always had this funny notion that the bachelors auditioning for a bachelorette season are asked on a questionaire: "Will you walk bare-foot over hot coals if you really loved the lead gal?" Then production keeps a certain quota of guys answering "I thought I was auditioning to be the Bachelor!" ... and a certain quota of guys answering "yes". SHE only needs to fall for one guy, of either answer on the questionaire. Then  the whole "walking on coals" test is enforced with all of the "I'm in love with Frank!", "I'm in love with Bentley!", "I'm in love with your bro-buddy Arieeeee!", "I'm in love with Brooks!", "Nick didn't take the lie detector test in Venice and you did!" and, this season (new seasons require more "shock" drama), "Nick and I sexted as well a text each other!"

Funny how we all have different views! Regarding the bolded - IMO, Shawn looks every bit as jealous as he was portrayed on the show. To me, his sit down with Nick on AFTR confirmed his inability to admit any fault or own his behavior! Remember how angry Shawn was when he didn't get the group date rose that went to Jared? That drama was so over the top but to me, because it was raw, it was spot on.

I am not saying Shawn doesn't have a "jealous bone in his body". Ha ha! Even if I do not see him quite as "jealous" as you might, the silly editors certainly milked The Jealousy Storyline all the way to the bank! In fact, practically the first comments coming out of Mother to Shawn was regarding his jealousy. Nothing this show ever does is subtle.