The Bachelor Australia - Season 2 - Blake Garvey - *Sleuthing* - *Spoilers* - General Discussion -

mercieme wrote:Any guesses as to why Blake chose to propose. I am seriously struggling with the rationale for this though I know he has repeatedly said he is ready for marriage but this proposal is just unreal to me.

My guess is that he chose to propose because he knew at least three months prior to doing so that F1 (Sam?) was *the one* for him. I don't think he actually expected to find someone like F1 but he hoped to. And when it happened, there was NO WAY he was letting her go.

So why marriage and not just a commitment a la Tim and Anna, one may ask? Because too many viewers are focusing on whether SAM is ready and not on BLAKE being ready. In fact, that is what my whole analysis was about: focusing on Blake. I think many of us viewers, because of what we know about The Bachelor franchise, go into watching the bachelor (in this case, Blake) with raised skepticism. This is understandable because the process is very strange. But, BUT!, finding love can happen anywhere and anyhow.

If we focus on Blake himself, we see someone that is nearly 32. Not old, no, but he certainly is mature enough for marriage. He already let us know he had dated, had been in relationships and understood the seriousness of marriage, particularly because of his own upbringing by a single mom. From the get go, the question he asks of every girl is if they see it as lasting love, not just a commitment, but marriage. That was his focus from the start. The difference however, is that many viewers interpreted this to mean he was being a player or treating every girl the same, when in reality, he was letting it be known how serious he was. Did this help to weed out those that were not where HE was at? Yes, definitely, but the fact remains that his main reason for stating this was that he was laying the foundation early on that he was serious and that his intentions were serious (which may help explain why says that Sam is special right from the get go).

I find it also interesting that so much of the criticism of Blake seems to be viewers projecting how they perceive the show itself, and not the person, Blake himself onto Blake and thus deciding his character, when in reality, if one compared him to past bachelors, he has maintained impeccable sincerity and sensitivity towards what is happening, even when the new girls arrived. Every one of the girls and had the same thing to say about Blake. They noticed he was doing his best to balance he process with being genuine. What is also important is that each of the parents that Blake visited with at the hometown dates ALL clearly stated how genuine Blake was. And I sensed that immediately when I noticed how he was sensitive to the girls' emotional needs while still trying to put his own heart first. This is, after all, Blake's journey to find his wife and love of his life.

mercieme wrote:Also I just re-watched all of Sam's dates and watched it differently based on how AllAboutLove analyzed Blake and Sam's relationship. Boy oh boy, Blake for sure went off script many times and how the heck did the producers allow him to do that. Please correct me if I am wrong, I have never heard on any of the US version for a lead to tell a contestant by the second date that they felt differently about them compared to the other contestants. Which is exactly what Blake said to Sam on the second date: I feel differently about you than any other person. And for sure I did not internalize this until the analysis done by you all lovely folks on this thread. I am repeating my prediction from earlier, Sam is either F3 of F1. Something major must go down on the overnight date if she makes it to F2 for her not to be the F1.

As you mentioned, Blake went totally off script on the picnic date with Sam. If you watch his previous date with her at the drive-in diner you will realize that this was NOT the first time he did this. Watching their first date you will notice that on the way there Blake says something to Sam in the car that is really striking and totally off-script. And it is as if he catches himself doing so and loses his words when he says, "Just remember this moment right now, and just.... ... yeah, know that I am really, really happy to be sharing this day and time with you" as they are driving to the drive-in diner to watch Sam's personal story. (Go here to watch Episode 5 where Blake says this at 6:54)

He treated her differently from the get go...

mercieme wrote:Any guesses as to why Blake chose to propose. I am seriously struggling with the rationale for this though I know he has repeatedly said he is ready for marriage but this proposal is just unreal to me. Also I just re-watched all of Sam's dates and watched it differently based on how AllAboutLove analyzed Blake and Sam's relationship. Boy oh boy, Blake for sure went off script many times and how the heck did the producers allow him to do that. Please correct me if I am wrong, I have never heard on any of the US version for a lead to tell a contestant by the second date that they felt differently about them compared to the other contestants. Which is exactly what Blake said to Sam on the second date: I feel differently about you than any other person. And for sure I did not internalize this until the analysis done by you all lovely folks on this thread. I am repeating my prediction from earlier, Sam is either F3 or F1. Something major must go down on the overnight date if she makes it to F2 for her not to be the F1.

If Blake takes each of the girls to the FS overnight, I think Sam will really struggle and maybe that was on her mind when she was talking to Blake at the end of her HT. Blake may have been disappointed and frustrated by her lack of support - which he clearly states is what he wants from a relationship, wanting to feel "invincible". I think it will be interesting to see how it plays out. Maybe there is no overnight portion again in BachelorAU.

well imo blake had marriage and life long love on his mind from the onset - he's ready for it and wants it and wants to take advantage of TB to find the girl...he told louise " in [this mansion] you can pause at any moment in and get married" and when jess entered the room in their wonderland date and walked down he said "she looked like she was literally walking down the aisle there for a moment" when lauren (intruder) came in with her outfit looking like a wedding gown which she made fun of he said something along the lines of "oh yea you made me picture it" as if in encouragement...

I'd say marriage/life long love has been his objective from the get go...I also do believe from watching back he did feel a genuine connection with jess - all his non-verbal cues are there and a genuine deep connection with lisa though not sure if the romantic bit is as fiery
with that said I don't think he was sooo desperate for marriage if the love wasn't strong enough he would propose...i think he did fall really hard for his F1 to a point where he felt she's the one and there could never be anyone else...and so he proposed...
this is mho...

AllAboutLove wrote: too many viewers are focusing on whether SAM is ready and not on BLAKE being ready. ...

So I know I am responding to my own comment :/ but I wanted to have a separate post to address the question: Is SAM ready for marriage?

My broad answer to that would be is ANYONE truly ready for marriage?!

Even if you have all of it figured out, are the right age, have the right income, have all your ducks in a row so to speak, you will never have it all figured out with someone else because you are not marrying yourself you are marry someone else. Someone who hopefully both challenges and supports you and you do the same for them. Maybe not at the same time or not in the same manner, but at the times that are needed most. And that is the point.

I remember reading about a person who asked their parents why they stay married and the parent responded, "we never wanted to be divorced at the same time". There is some truth to that. Marriage has its ups and downs, its ebbs and flows, just like life. Sometimes you want to give it your all and sometimes you want to hold back. Sometimes you are a receiver and sometimes you are the giver. I know this is a generalization but I think people sometimes judge who is ready for marriage based on viewing marriage through the lens of their own life experiences. Every couple is different and their dynamics are different, so one can never truly know.

But, concerning Sam specifically, here are my thoughts....

So many viewers have stated that Sam is immature and they use that reasoning to state she is not ready. I would argue that she is mature in many ways and not as mature in other ways. But is she mature in the ways that count? That is, can she COMMUNICATE her frustration, her weaknesses, her fears, etc. Yes she can. And communication is the key to any lasting relationship. Sam even states that communication is essential for her with a partner.

From the first moment she meets Blake, after stepping out of the Limo she talks about significant things, deeper things. She tells him from the get go what matters to her most, her family, things that are personal. By talking about serious, personal things from the start, Sam sets the tone that she is serious about finding a lasting love. Though she has her dorky, fun, hilarious side, at the core, it is the things that matters most that she focuses on. This continues throughout her and Blake's relationship.

Some might say that communication is the ability to talk or express yourself well. But really, it is the ability to understand someone else and have them understand you. Understand what makes you tick and how you emotionally process things. This is an important distinction because, essentially, to communicate effectively, you have to know yourself well. And Sam does (as does Blake). And to me, that is true maturity. KNOWING YOURSELF.

Knowing yourself is the true testament of maturity. Knowing your strengths, your weaknesses, the things you need to work on. Sam gives evidence early on that she knows her weakness because she tells Blake this on their picnic date. She confesses how she has issues opening up and trusting and how she is scared of being vulnerable. But by telling Blake this she is not only letting him know the real her, she is connecting with him and facing her fears by addressing them. She is helping Blake to better understand how she emotionally processes things which Blake picks up on immediately. He understands her and thus realizes how to relate to her emotionally.

One can see this when Blake convinces Sam to talk to him when the new girls arrive. Sam shuts down, but as she stated already to Blake, this is what she does when she doesn't want to get hurt because she is afraid of how much she cares. He understood this and so he fought for her, communicating to her that he cared as well. When they go outside to talk, Sam immediately communicates why she did what she did and apologizes. This fear is a fear stemming from her past which she already communicated to Blake about. Because of the situation of Blake dating other girls, this fear was heightened and so it is actually a huge act of maturity for Sam to still keep communicating with him and not totally shutting down, or rather, when she does shut down, having the maturity to realize that what Blake says to her in front of all the other girls is truth, even if it is embarrassing to her she understands what he is saying is true.

And what did Blake say? Blake says... "Okay, Life is very, very challenging and from here I am going to go on with someone, with one person, and we are going to have to overcome a lot of obstacles together and I hope that this person is going to be able to support me. And this is where it starts and it has to start here and this is it and if we can't have this time to talk and to sit and to work through this now what is that going to say about the future? Can you please, have a chat with me?" ......... Remember that he is addressing SAM when he is saying all this.

Honestly, it is so raw to watch and hear. For both Blake and Sam. You can see the struggle Sam is having with herself, with her fears. Her immediate reaction to conflict is to run, to flee. This can be taken as immaturity in and of itself. But true immaturity is when you are given the opportunity to face your fears and you don't. Sam did even though she didn't want to, Blake brought that out in her. To face it head on.

So while Sam brings out a deeper and more meaningful side to Blake, Blake brings out Sam's confidence (you will notice it is the show that makes her less confident, not him). Everyone has a flight or fight instinct when it comes to obstacles and challenges in life. Both Blake and Sam bring out the FIGHT FOR each other, though in different ways. I think it is much better, personally, for the man to be more of a fight for his wife person than the other way around. That Blake can bring that out in Sam even with her fears both past, present (so many other girls she is with) and future. Again, I firmly believe that based on the situation they are in, Sam's issues are more about the process than they are about Blake. And honestly, that is mature of her to keep her heart somewhat guarded and rather let Blake wear his more on his sleeve.


Note: I focused on discussing Sam's maturity in regards to a relationship with Blake rather than Sam's maturity as a person in general. The reason for this is because someone can be very mature in taking care of family, having kids, being a responsible adult, hard-working, provider, etc,. but still not have those skills translate to relationships. That is because, though they may intertwine, I have yet to witness in my own life or observing others, where maturity as an individual is THE cause for maturity in a relationship. It can be a correlation, but it is usually not the cause. The ways of the heart are much, much more complex...

AllAboutLove,
Since you only joined us yesterday, you are really putting words down to make us think! I think Sam realized she was all in when her sister Chris said "he's the one for you" and Sam, you deserve it. As she said, Chris can read her better than she can herself. Now Sam has not let Blake know she is all in but previews show her saying I love you and I want you to really know me before making a decision. I truly can't wait to see the interaction between Blake's mom and Sam. I think Blake will tell his mom that she's the one because he wants her to know how special she is to him. I feel badly for F2. I presume it's Lisa. She'll be OK but that is never an enviable position to be in. Kinda like 4th place in the Olympics - you can be a millisecond from third but have no focus on you for anything!

I posted in the ScreenCaps thread some photos that go along with addressing the upcoming proposal and whether Sam and/or Blake is ready for marriage (that is if she is the F1).... I thought to share the thoughts I have about the proposal and my theories here in the general thread as well since its on topic...

In my own narrative (when I watch the proposal preview and look at Blake's face) I can almost hear him saying to Sam, "Sam, thank you for believing in us, for keeping the faith and not giving up. For trusting me when I told you early on to have faith, have confidence in what we have." That is what their journey has been all about since their first date.  

In fact, I think he told her to have faith and confidence in what they have, as early as on the Yacht Group Date when he says, "If this ended tomorrow, and it was you and I".... this because he knew she was the one early on.

Also, I firmly believe that the hometown date, where Sam says "It is what it is" is Sam referring to the process that she knows Blake has to go through, contractually. I believe that is what they were discussing and why Sam was frustrated. Not with Blake, but at the process. And it has always been the process that is the issue with Sam regarding Blake, not Blake's feelings towards her or her feelings toward Blake. Her doubts have always crept in just because he has to be with other girls. As Blake has stated in many interviews, he had to go into each date blocking out everyone else otherwise he would have gone crazy. He wouldn't have had to do that unless there was someone that was so special that the only way he could cope with the process was to block her out as much as he could when he wasn't around her.  

When I entertain doubts about whether Sam is F1 (because, like Sam, I too hate the process) I remind myself of one thing which is this:
I cannot for the life of me think if there was even some doubt Blake had concerning whether Sam was the one for him that he would have kept her on. From the get go he understood how she emotionally processed things, he understood and iterated how he felt he needed to "be protective" of Sam on the picnic date because of her past bad relationships. There is no way Blake would have led her on to the final 3 only to break her heart. If she wasn't the one for him he would have let her go a long, long time ago to save her more heartache.


Question: Does anyone else think Blake says Sam's name differently than he does Louise or Lisa's? It is almost as if he spends more time saying her name... dragging it out a bit? I can imagine him saying, "Sam,...... will you marry me" so easily.

AllAboutLove wrote:
Question: Does anyone else think Blake says Sam's name differently than he does Louise or Lisa's? It is almost as if he spends more time saying her name... dragging it out a bit? I can imagine him saying, "Sam,...... will you marry me" so easily.

You make me think of a new perspective every time you post!!!! Ok I buy the argument for the proposal but only to Sam....still not seeing it with anyone else, I think I am going to literally fall off my chair if Blakey boy proposes to anyone but Sam at this point

Regarding your question, yep for sure now that you bring it up, he really does drag Sam's name out.

On another note, I love when Sam's sister, Chris asked Blake if he was falling for Sam and he responded that he was, then Chris said, how could you not, that was brilliant.

Speaking of the word "brilliant" (not sure if this is an aussie thing) but I made an observation. Sam is the only one that I recollect using the word brilliant quite a bit on the show. Post show, Blake has used the same word to describe Laurina in an interview (which Sam did also use to describe Laurina prior to the Blake interview) and in a couple of other interviews that Emusha posted. I may be wrong but just don't recollect Blake using the word "brilliant" at all on the show. Anyways could be a random coincidence but wanted to note the observation.

Mercieme I'm from Australia and No Brilliant is not a word used quite commonly to describe someone.

All this analysing has me going back and looking at the show in a whole new light. I'll be blown out of my mind if Sam is not the one he proposes to.

I really do see what you are all saying about Sam and Blake's relationship and the way he has gone off script with Sam. There are a few things that are holding me back from coming fully on board;

- Two things from Sam's sm; "At the end of the day... this is what really matters! Hanging out with my cheeky little monkey" and her best day in her life comment with friends
- the comments by the girls about Lisa's off camera connection and how they would frequently catch each other's eye, it was like Lisa was looking out for him
-the kindred spirit comment about Lisa although did also say this about Chantal
-Blake pushed Lisa probably not quite the same way as he has Sam, asking Lisa at the end of the HT if she could see more than just dating and when she said she could see a future, he pushed her again and she said she was ready to go to the next level, he said he was "blown away" by her answer and it was the first time, he could "possibly" see a future.
-whatever he said to and about Louise at the end of her HT was cut

I guess overall it depends how much in love with Sam he is at this point as to whether anything that happens in South Africa could be a game changer.

AEF wrote:I really do see what you are all saying about Sam and Blake's relationship and the way he has gone off script with Sam. There are a few things that are holding me back from coming fully on board;

- Two things from Sam's sm; "At the end of the day... this is what really matters! Hanging out with my cheeky little monkey" and her best day in her life comment with friends
- the comments by the girls about Lisa's off camera connection and how they would frequently catch each other's eye, it was like Lisa was looking out for him
-the kindred spirit comment about Lisa although did also say this about Chantal
-Blake pushed Lisa probably not quite the same way as he has Sam, asking Lisa at the end of the HT if she could see more than just dating and when she said she could see a future, he pushed her again and she said she was ready to go to the next level, he said he was "blown away" by her answer and it was the first time, he could "possibly" see a future.
-whatever he said to and about Louise at the end of her HT was cut

I guess overall it depends how much in love with Sam he is at this point as to whether anything that happens in South Africa could be a game changer.

Thanks AEF for providing the voice of caution. I stated in an earlier posting that without the proposal, it really could be any of the 3 girls. However I can't get my head around how the heck Blake proposes to either Louise or Lisa with what we have been shown. Surely they have to present a story board for either Lisa or Louise. And Blake saying that the ring he designed represents the journey he and the F1 went through. I see more of a straightforward relationship between him and Lisa/Louise, no adversity that they overcame per se. I think unlike the US where we are always skeptical of the show with the proposals, the Bachelor AU producers were smart to not mandate a proposal which has worked well with the Australian viewership. Now Blakey boy is going to flip the script and go with a proposal...oh boy they better have a good justification for the proposal if it's not Sam because it will just seem weird and a bit disingenuous to whoever the F1 is watching all the chasing of Sam that Blake did. Regardless though, other than me falling off my chair in shock, I will be happy and respect Blake's choice, all the 3 girls are lovely IMO.

On another note, I just skimmed Tim's finale last year and indeed the F2 met his family. So I expect Blake's F2 to also meet his family if they stay to the same format/script.

AEF wrote:I really do see what you are all saying about Sam and Blake's relationship and the way he has gone off script with Sam. There are a few things that are holding me back from coming fully on board;

- Two things from Sam's sm; "At the end of the day... this is what really matters! Hanging out with my cheeky little monkey" and her best day in her life comment with friends
- the comments by the girls about Lisa's off camera connection and how they would frequently catch each other's eye, it was like Lisa was looking out for him
-the kindred spirit comment about Lisa although did also say this about Chantal
-Blake pushed Lisa probably not quite the same way as he has Sam, asking Lisa at the end of the HT if she could see more than just dating and when she said she could see a future, he pushed her again and she said she was ready to go to the next level, he said he was "blown away" by her answer and it was the first time, he could "possibly" see a future.
-whatever he said to and about Louise at the end of her HT was cut

I guess overall it depends how much in love with Sam he is at this point as to whether anything that happens in South Africa could be a game changer.

I think you make some very valid points!

I think the only way, as you and others have mentioned, that Sam is NOT whom Blake chooses at the end is that there is something that happens and she leaves. If that is the case, Sam would have to be F3. And the only way for that to happen is if she is NOT where Blake is. She may be falling in love with him but she doesn't "see" him as the one for her. Perhaps they get into an argument and so instead of her feeling rejected by him she rejects him?

I cannot see Blake rejecting her outright for anything other than something truly negative. WIth that said, and if that is indeed the case, then it is absolute insanity that Blake is proposing at all. Moreover, it is insanity that the producers, knowing there is a proposal at the end, chose NOT to highlight Blake falling, and TELLING the girl for heaven's sake at least one time. I mean, he could have told three or more if he wanted to and maybe he did, but as of yet, that hasn't been shown. If it IS shown in the next two episodes that is awfully late in the game to tell someone that you are falling in love with them, love them, and then proposing and yet not having that documented at least one time during the show.

It doesn't make sense for it to be anyone but Sam given what we have seen from Blake. If it is anyone other than Sam that Blake chooses I will have to admit that the producers did some of the worst editing in the history of the show by not at least making it seem like Blake felt the same way about two people and had to make a decision from that. Instead we are given witness to a Blake who repeats constantly he is falling for one person, Sam, and are expected to believe that was not his most potent feelings toward one of the girls and there was someone even more special to him? Someone he, or the editors/producers deemed not worth documenting their journey on national television but rather document an F3 or F2's journey? I am aware TB USA does this, but never has there been a case where the bachelor in question focuses on one girl only. It is always more than one that he says he is falling for or he evades saying he is falling until the very end...

Mercieme, we are on the same page regarding this upcoming proposal... nothing else makes sense in light of what we know for it to be anyone but Sam.

I too will be on the floor off my chair if it is not Sam. Like you, if he chooses the others, wonderful (for him, since they are lovely). But I will say that my analysis will be for naught since the show had to be deliberately telling someone other than the F1's storyline and that is incredibly cruel, especially to the F1 given that we will barely see either Louise or Lisa treated by Blake as he did Sam.