*Spoiler Free* Editing, VOs & PIs and The Fleissmeister's Storyline

JBF - I love how the editors use that "Trista and Ryan" guitar riff to make an emotional gesture in the storyline. And I believe we may have to wait a while to hear it. Its early days yet.

There was very quiet guitar music under Chris and Des' rooftop alone time. I went back and looked at it... And yeah, he found that all on his own... ;)

in2deep wrote:There was very quiet guitar music under Chris and Des' rooftop alone time. I went back and looked at it... And yeah, he found that all on his own... ;)

I don’t know how difficult it is to click on these youtube videos since I have them “marked” at specific spots (like the music tracks in the earlier post) and each of us have different computer systems. I right click on the mouse for "Open Link in New Tab". I’ll explain what is happening if you can’t see the visuals…

Interesting stuff about Chris. The music is different, but… in a way… this scene in its dialogue and setting…

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… did remind me of this scene… with Ashley’s F2 Ben Flajnik on the Hong Kong group date.

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However, Ben gets this scene in episode #6 while Chris is already making strides in episode #3. Also we hear more matching music used in many of JP’s scenes instead of Ben’s... so this makes it hard to determine Chris’ “status” at this stage. You don’t need much spoiling to determine that he lasts pretty far since he is all over the seasonal promos.

Regarding the face-shots, as you mentioned before Atem, Chris doesn’t look terribly upset about Brooks coming back from his emergency and is actually smiling when commenting on how “so good and so charming” Brooks is. Much more interesting are shots when he or somebody gets the “coveted” group rose.

When Chris gets the group rose, Brooks and Mike are spotlighted. Only Mike... and later Brandon... comment on feeling "jealous". Later, when Chris is slow dancing, Zack and Ben comment on what they may be doing as the camera pans on Drew apparently sulking. Conclusion: Brandon, Brooks, Mike and Drew are the most “concerned” when Chris gets the rose regardless if they really were (in reality). The editors want you to think so at least. Perhaps this trio (with Brandon out of the picture) may consider Chris competition later on if not now.

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On group date #2, James gets the rose and jokes that Juan Pablo only “won” the contest and movie date. Little does he know that Chris got BOTH the rose and a slow intimate dance on the other date while he gets a thorny flower. Zak Waddell comments that he “feels defeated” since James got the rose, while Desiree says the reason she is giving James the rose is to boost his confidence (i.e. so he doesn’t feel “defeated”).

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Here’s last year’s episode #3 group date. They just show Micheal and Jef fleetingly when Emily calls out Sean’s name for the rose. Not too much here to work with.

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Episode #3’s group date in Ashley’s season was the comedy roast, a bit of a challenging date to compare to these. Like London’s group date with Kalon “baggage” business in Emily’s episode #5, it was all about the drama. Bentley and a fleeting Ben Flajnik are shown when Ryan Park gets the group rose. Bentley may act all cocky in his PIs but you can see how angry he is, biting his lip.

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This episode #4’s date in Phuket is a more “settled” and a better comparison to the above scenes.

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Ben Flajnik gets the group rose and JP and Ryan Park are spotlighted. Those two show “concern”, although they aren’t really… JP is confident, Ryan is confident… both say so in the PI sessions… and even Lucas is confident despite not being highlighted when Ben got the rose. Does this mean they don’t quite see “IT” between Ashley and Ben? Poor Ben. He does say he’s “on cloud 9, man”. JP is more concerned about Ryan getting a rose than Ben and he is just fearful of going “all in” with her rather than seeing the others as competition.

Just as an idea of what we didn't get to see. This is from Brooks Fan Club facebook from someone at the Dodge ball game taping:

At the dodge ball game taping, there were a lot of cute interactions between Des and Brooks. He made her (and the fans in the stands nearby) smile and laugh the most out of the ten guys there. Hope that is a sign of good things to come!

wow JBF amazing edit analysis. i have a question for you but i'll ask in the spoiler edit forum.

I always enjoy JBF's analysis and have been reading for years as a spoiled member. However this is first season when I am 100 percent unspoiled. I don't know top4 or even top 6 guys. So when reading analysis about Bryden's edit, I don't know what to think as I don't know how long he lasts. I appreciate the insight but when it is suggested that someone is getting the "Ben F edit" should we surmise that he is not going to be F1?

There are def obvious things in edit for the unspoiled such as things would not end well for Brandon or that Mikey's story is all about his time with Ben vs. Des.

But right now ... for me anyhow ... all I can do is pay attention to Des' smile, eyes, laugh and outfit choices with guys. I think we will be more helpful when more guys are weeded out and given screentime. The fact that Drew is still hidden yet gets lots of screentime in coming episodes makes me wonder if someone else hidden will emerge as well.

MVMom39forever wrote:I appreciate the insight but when it is suggested that someone is getting the "Ben F edit" should we surmise that he is not going to be F1?

Just commenting on this line, because you raised a very good point. It was that particular scene on the rooftop that strongly resembled Ben's. However we see it happening in episode #3 instead of episode #6, so this makes it harder to simply "assume" anything. Already Desiree is pretty "into" him. In contrast, Ben had no scenes with Ashley after his meet & greet until Phuket (episode #4) and that scene was definitely not up to par.

Another scenario: many felt Catherine's episode #6 date with Sean strongly resembled Reid's in Jillian's season (episode #6) with snow games and ice castle furniture. Even the exact same location was used, along with nighttime shots of the same hotel. Add to this fact that Sean may not have had a top choice at the time of Catherine's date (he never said she had him at "hello") and Ed was "on leave" at that point in Jillian's season.

It is fun to find "stuff" that are similiar between Guys A, B and C with past F1s, F2s and F3s, but nothing fits the cookie cutter press as perfectly as we want it to. With that said, it is still interesting that Drew is shown first out of the limos like Emily's Sean, Sean's AshLee and Ashley's Ryan Park (edited first although Micky was in reality)... and others who went far (but weren't F1) in the past like Jillian's Kiptyn and Brad's Chantal. He is also getting the exact same guitar music that both Ryan and Sean got.

Only read if you have seen the episode already.

Editing Odds & Ends…

Episode #4: The Ongoing Battle at Big Ben, Part 4…
…with additional James Drama as part of our Coming Attractions

On Katie Couric, Desiree calls Ben “whatshisname” and Katie laughs “how soon they forget!”

Yeah… right. You just had to dump Zack K. this episode and keep “whatshisname”, didn’t you? OK. We have long known the reasons “why”. The problem is this: some of us are finding The War between him and the two Mikes and Bryden less entertaining than the editors and Mike Fleiss think it is. I can’t wait for the upcoming chapters of this drama to be over with.

Oh well… at this stage we can guess that she has zeroed in on her top choice with two runner up “fall back” guys, followed by the five or six who are easily distracted by each other and won’t notice whether she’s focused on them or not. Must have enough filler for Chris Harrison to entertain himself with on Men Tell All.

So Brad, not James, is Rubbing Eyes Guy in the promo… hmmm. Didn't guess that one. Not that he seemed too heartbroken (assuming Reality Steve was correct in his spoiler about him having to leave for a Maddex situation rather than Desiree simply eliminating him on the date). Nonetheless Mickey T. and Zak W. sure went on and on… and on… critiquing him for being “not right” for her.

Sesame Street’s word of the day: During Brad’s date at the lighthouse, Desiree says she wants a love that lights through the darkness. Zak W. calls Desiree (in one of his many, many, many PIs as Greek Chorus of the show) a shining light. On James’ date, Desiree hopes to shed light on their relationship.

From Brook’s Zoo:
He calls himself a lion at the Mr. America pageant and calls Desiree a unicorn in a PI. Are lions and unicorns compatible?

From Drew’s Dictionary:
Banana hammock… what Juan Pablo got to wear after being told by the Mr. America instructor that they will be “exploring themselves”

Crowning moment:
Kasey at the pageant almost cried when he won, just like the gals do. Some angry twitter comment flashed on screen, forgot what it said, but gee… sorry so many thought that beefcake show was so revolting. I found Kasey quite hilarious commenting to us under his manly tiara. #kingly-pride, #King-of-the-beasts-over-Lion-Brooks

Brooks and Bryden were the only two on the Mr. America pageant whom Desire actually discussed on screen. Figures one of them is eager to bolt because he ain’t feelin’ it with her, yet eventually stays while she eliminates another, better candidate. The other guys’ performances were just discussed… by guys.

When Zak W. (a better singer than Brooks, although the latter does have a nice Cat Stevens twang to him) gets the group rose at the post-Mr. Universe party, it was now Chris’ time to provide commentary of disappointment. I would too if I had to wear high heels and read poetry for her attention. Nonetheless Chris did get a rather “final one-ish” edit this episode with plenty of kissing.

James date was ssssooooooo long on screen, with so much focused on Manny and Jan double-dating with them. Good thing he had his bubble bath before-hand. His date is labeled “Can our love weather the storm?”, which probably foreshadows a lot more this season than just the hurricane rubble they saw. Future storms a-coming this season? For now, he insists over and over on screen that he’s here for the right reasons and tells his past cheating story to her with great insistence that he will never do it again. Date closes with the lyric “baby I got lost in you”.

How to rip off the next dumpee so you can stay…
Mike G. makes flashcards about “things I like about you” with Desiree. This closely matches what Zack Kalter was doing back in episode #2, only we saw just a blip of it. Y’know… I’ve thrown my arms up in the air and am now guessing that Zack was this season’s Mole… operating like Matt Hussey trying to get these shy guys to speak to her. Once his services are no longer necessary, he leaves… and Fleiss’ check is in the mail. At least they gave him a great exit scene... and both he and Desiree were crying a little.

With the other Zak and James sporting roses, our order this episode: Chris, Brooks, Juan, Drew, Mike G., Whatshisname, Kasey, Bryden and Mickey.

JBF ... Thanks for great analysis! I suspect that you are kidding about Zack K being the "Mole" but I have to say WTF (again!). Why oh why would she keep Mikey T over Zack ... or Kasey or Zak W or Ben? I just don't get it unless they had zip nadda chemistry. He's cute, athletic, book publisher ... I wish we had seen more of him so I could understand why he'd be cut as he was in my top four list.

Is there any scoop from Reality Steve about Zack K? Please share now that he's gone as I just don't understand why he'd go so soon.

And ... what the heck ... why are they hiding Drew so much when we know he's got a lot of screen time coming up in future episodes but he's given LEAST amount of screen time? Is Drew:

1) A"late bloomer"/slow to start relationship for Des as TPTB claimed Catherine was in Sean's season
2) Their chemistry is actually off charts hot and it'd be too obvious
3) Drew's storyline is being sacrificed for other guys with more "interesting" stories to tell but are going to exit before him and Fleiss will get to him later

???

No info about Zack K at all, but what we knew from Sopniette and stalking his instagram.

Yeah, I was kidding about the mole business.

Zack Kalter has no "dirt" as far we know. He had a very serious relationship for several years and certainly is "there" as far as longterm commitment. Excellent Bachelor lead potential, if they want to make a serious show not built just on entertainment and abs. His positioning in the rose ceremonies is typical of frontrunners "on paper" who are not on the show just as drama.

In addition, if he and Desiree lacked "chemistry", we WOULD have seen them together quite a bit on screen so viewers would know why he was eliminated. The very fact we didn't suggests that they got along TOO well and the editors may fear viewers would be downright furious and outraged at Desiree for what she did... when the only reason he was cut early was because he was an "obstacle" in the way of one or two other frontrunners ahead of him and she wanted to end it early before things could "take off" on a 1 on 1 date (and that would make it so much harder to eliminate him later).

I suspect this season is a composite of Meredith and Ali's... in which the lead had an Ian/Roberto early on and probably couldn't get "unglued" enough to give anybody else a chance. Just look at the guys remaining:

Chris: a TON of kissing on screen... the only "red flag" is that they are TOO comfortable together. Also occasionally their dialogue seems a bit too rehearsed at times... only in that it resembles past seasonal talk.

Brooks: she talks enough about him on screen even if we don't see them together much

Drew: lots of his scenes with her are cut... like Zack K.... reminding me of Reid in Jillian's season. Does this make him a hidden favorite of hers? Or somebody "all of America" will be outraged if she dumps him and, therefore, have to hide a lot?

James: I think she likes him a lot and that drama he is involved with will hurt her. Doubt she viewed him as "the one", but she might have thought of him as a potential F2 or F3 at this stage.

Zak W.: We see a LOT of them together and it is all buddy-buddy laughs mostly. Chris questions her if he's in the "friend zone" but Zak isn't. Maybe he knows he is stuck there and doesn't care.

Bryden: I thought he was a frontrunner, but when he pretty much hinted to her he wasn't feeling "IT", she kept him for the exact same reason Ashley kept Bentley. (Here is what made THAT drama so muddled: Bentley kept giving her signs he wanted to leave and she kept demanding him to stay in episode #2... but was she that in love with him? I often wondered if production had additional "dirt" on him and they just needed a villian.)

Ben: she forgot his name on Katie Couric!!!!

Juan Pablo: getting the sexy edit, but she sure looked guarded on her movie date with him. Two people have pointed out that popular "gif" of him picking up the popcorn on her bosom. It looks sexy but she is watching him carefully as if she isn't quite trusting yet.

Mike G.: a great narrator and drama participent

Kasey: another great narrator and drama participent

Mickey T.: Why? Why? Why? Every rose ceremony he is rolling his eyes waiting to be called last or next to last.

Thanks! Yes, I noticed all that kissing with Chris and the one that I noticed the most is when they were in pool together and she realized they connected on both enjoy writing/writing poetry. She grabbed his head/face with both hands and pulled him in for the kiss. So sweet!

Brooks has a very similar nature to Chris. I could totally see him be the next Bachelor if he doesn't go all the way. He's just funny and good looking. I wonder why they are not showing them together?

Drew ... I think that they are focusing on other story lines and then going to let him rip come ep 6 and get tons of airtime so TPTB are not going to hide him for too much longer. They seem to have a great European date coming up and we know he's going to tell her he's falling for her. Drew will probably be either F3 or F2 along with Chris and not sure who else just yet. I want to say Brooks but can't be sure that he's not heading into friend zone as we did not see them together. She and Mike G appear to be passionately kissing in the next episode so he's a candidate as well.

I am actually glad to hear that about Zack. When they cut him off from reading her all the things he liked about her on ep 2, I thought for sure he was going to be a hidden guy who went far. Des & Zack frequently seemed to be sitting next to each other at parties and she smiled with her entire face (eyes!) with him. Des honestly seemed sad to let him go and Zack sure seemed sad so I bet you are right ... she probably told producers her top four guys as they plan their Europe dates and Zack was number 5 so producers said we're filling out the cast with all the drama/easy to cut later boys cause we got enough love stories going already. Boo!

Zak ... I just have to ask about him! I have been monitoring Des' blogs and he is mentioned the most of the guys who have not yet had dates. He is also in two deleted scenes. I am not seeing great chemistry with them (thank goodness!). Do you think that he's just a colorful player/distraction? I just hope that he is not in her Final 3 as I am really not a fan of his and don't think he's a "right reasons" kind of guy esp when he pulled out that guitar a la Wes in Jillian's season. If Zak is her F1, somebody please PM me as I'll watch the rest of the season spoiled.