Courtney Robertson & Humberto Preciado - Bachelor 16 - Discussion

Maybe I'm too much of a JP fan to be objective about this, but I still doubt that Ashley had sex with Ben. My common sense tells me that considering she looked so uncomfortable even kissing him

I agree. Completely.

ironcat wrote:Maybe I'm too much of a JP fan to be objective about this, but I still doubt that Ashley had sex with Ben.

I am as well. We could BOTH be right, or we could both be wrong, but my take was that Courtney got that from Ben but that Ben might have been likely to have lied to her about it. I don't think anyone that truly knows the truth is ever going to say what it is, and that's the best for all involved. I do think Courtney believes what she wrote, but that doesn't mean that it's the truth.

I heard that Ashley was not allowed to let Ben go before the FRC (which she wanted to do) and they stymied her plan to take Dino to F2 (which is what she planned to do and had talked to Dino about until the show found out and made Dino bow out) and that's how she got into such a corner at the end. She told them to make sure Ben knew she wasn't going to pick him and they told her it was all taken care of. They lied to her - it wasn't taken care of - and they lied to Ben who thought she wanted a proposal and was going to accept. That in and of itself is more than enough to explain why Ben was so angry. I thought then and still think now that's a better explanation of what happened and why than what Courtney said or the rumors to that effect.

But then again why would Ben think that he/Ashley would be getting engaged w/o consummating their relationship? No matter how much TPTB is in his ear that's only natural for most couple, not unless you are a virgin or deeply religious, come on they must have done something.... I am an was a staunch supporter of Ashley/JP back when people was calling him an abuser but I don't feel like it's out of the realm of possibilities jmo...

tigertiz wrote:

Maybe I'm too much of a JP fan to be objective about this, but I still doubt that Ashley had sex with Ben.  My common sense tells me that considering she looked so uncomfortable even kissing him

I agree. Completely.

Agreed. Completely unbelievable to me, and if the source is that info is Courtney ... that tells me all I need to know about it's validity.   She is awful. I wasn't going to even bother responding to this info, but have seen it referenced enough times lately that I felt I needed to add my opinion.

There is no way to know what actually went down unless a more credible source comes out to write a tell all someday.
What I do know and have been told over the years: TPTB know no boundaries. If they want something, they will do what it takes to get that reaction.
I am going to borrow what Lucas said above and repeat it again, because in my opinion not only is is so spot on(I heard likewise from reliable) it is something that most likely happened this past season. Thanks, Lucas!
"They stymied her plan to take Dino to F2 (which is what she planned to do and had talked to ino about until the show found out and made Dino bow out) and that's how she got into such a corner at the end. She told them to make sure Ben knew she wasn't going to pick him and they told her it was all taken care of. They lied to her - it wasn't taken care of - and they lied to Ben who thought she wanted a proposal and was going to accept. That in and of itself is more than enough to explain why Ben was so angry."

The machine is not above lying. They are not above planting the seeds they want planted. They are not above much.

Kashathediva wrote:There is no way to know what actually went down unless a more credible source comes out to write a tell all someday.
What I do know and have been told over the years: TPTB know no boundaries. If they want something, they will do what it takes to get that reaction.
I am going to borrow what Lucas said above and repeat it again, because in my opinion not only is is so spot on(I heard likewise from reliable) it is something that most likely happened this past season. Thanks, Lucas!
"They stymied her plan to take Dino to F2 (which is what she planned to do and had talked to ino about until the show found out and made Dino bow out) and that's how she got into such a corner at the end. She told them to make sure Ben knew she wasn't going to pick him and they told her it was all taken care of. They lied to her - it wasn't taken care of - and they lied to Ben who thought she wanted a proposal and was going to accept. That in and of itself is more than enough to explain why Ben was so angry."

The machine is not above lying. They are not above planting the seeds they want planted. They are not above much.

Kasha, I totally agree with all of the above, especially the bolded.   I liked and still like Ashley.  I was a Ben fan and not fond of JP.   I have gotten to like JP a bit because of how he treats Ash.  I have gotten to not like Ben as much because of how he handled a lot of things.  I no longer care who slept or didn't sleep with who that season.   I have an on-going battle in my head over these shows.  I enjoy them while I detest the behind the scenes shenanigans and mean tricks.

I can believe tptb put a lot of crap into Nick's head this season.  He watched last season and might have learned a bit of how they operate, but like the Rod Stewart song he still " looked to find a reason to believe".   However, I still think Andi knew her own mind and did assist with Nick coming to think she cared for him a lot.  Even without the ILY.  The difference as I see it is Ashley is a kind hearted person and Andi is one of the most self centered contestants I can remember.

I can buy that Ashley wanted to bring Constantine to the f2 and was stymied by TPTB but if she really wanted Ben to know she wasn't picking him all she had to do was tell him or at least hint in the FS off camera. She had to know by then she couldn't trust them. I never care if anyone has sex in the FS & don't trust Courtney to not embellish for book sales but on the other hand Ashley & Ben were extremely drunk on that boat so it's possible. Not something we need to know either way.

albean99 wrote:I can buy that Ashley wanted to bring Constantine to the f2 and was stymied by TPTB but if she really wanted Ben to know she wasn't picking him all she had to do was tell him or at least hint in the FS off camera. She had to know by then she couldn't trust them. I never care if anyone has sex in the FS & don't trust Courtney to not embellish for book sales but on the other hand Ashley & Ben were extremely drunk on that boat so it's possible. Not something we need to know either way.

But they wouldn't have had sex right on the boat, would they? I don't recall Ashley being that drunk at their dinner preceding the FS.

I still find it hard to believe and find Courtney to be a very unreliable source with her own agenda. So I'm keeping my fingers in my ears and singing la la la on this one, unless there's further corroboration.   

IDK--this is one of those situations that will remain unanswered and does not matter in the scheme of things. The 4 parties involved have moved on and at least 2 of them appear very happy.
I don't consider Ben anymore reliable than Courtney and certainly JP and Ashley have more important things on their minds.

eirekay wrote:I read Courtney's book.  I was kinda bleh.  Couple of thoughts:
   * I'd be intimidated by Emily too if the the second question Ben asked me at the meet & greet was where I went to school.
   * Courtney takes no ownership of the whole "Up the tail pipe" conversation.  In fact, aside from "See ya - wouldn't want to be ya.", she doesn't acknowledge the worst of her behavior.
    * Courtney never mentions the couple of conversations in the last 3 episodes in which Ben directly questioned her behavior with the other girls.  In the LCD I remember him commenting that she had made the whole thing so difficult for him.
   * No surprise that they were broken up before the ATFR. I remember watching Ben's hesitation when CH asked if they were still together and that looked to me like a decision he made on the spot and under pressure.
    * Ben always struck me as being in love with his own reflection once he became the Bachelor.  The way he treated the women was wince inducing on many an occasion.  

I'd be interested in knowing what Kacie thought of the book!  Courtney takes a couple of shots at her.

      

Wow! My thoughts exactly...

I am not sure why I read the book when Courtney is hands-down my least favorite cast member from every Bachelor season. But I bought it on a whim for a summer read after hearing her on AfterBuzz and because I was expecting the BachNation vignettes to be longer and more interesting. I thought she came across "okay" on AfterBuzz so wanted to give her a chance.

I finished the book not necessarily liking Courtney more but instead feeling somewhat sorry for her ...

- She was never a good student who barely made it through high school and implies she might have been dyslexic.
- She is a self described couch potato who enjoys lots of television viewing but doesn't seem to have any enriching hobbies or interests or involvements with charity (as she claims Ben points out repeatedly that she isn't "dynamic" enough). She says that she works out but the fact that Courtney claimed to have had a hard time keeping up with Ben's mother on a bike ride makes me think that she might be skinny but not because of doing loads of aerobic exercise. Either that or Ben's mother is friggin in awesome shape.
- She always had very few female friends growing up and preferred the company of boys ... BUT ... grew up with a mother who preached to her that men are pigs who are out for only one thing.
- She had a string of crappy relationships with men who seem taken by her looks and then proceed to treat her poorly.
- Her career depends on her beauty and there's always a fresh young face around the corner. At 31 she can hope for a career like Christie Brinkley but that's just not the norm.
- She put in a plug for herself to be next Bachelorette ... ???

Playing arm chair analyst, I can see how entering the Bachelor house and being surrounded by loads of beautiful women she was immediately on guard. Her playing field was essentially leveled and the other gals seemed capable of making friends. What's sad is on one hand she talks about how much she hated them and then the next thing \she mourns the fact that they never invited her to their PJ parties or outdoor bootcamps/exercise sessions. Well, Courtney, if you had been a bit nicer to them maybe you could have played their reindeer games.

I think Ben fell in love with the idea of being with a famous and "rich" model (as she essentially says in book) plus she used her sexuality and inhibitions to seal the deal. He sure didn't pick her for her mind or because they had much in common. She says that he was talking fondly of NIcki while they were alone post finale in Mexico and that totally angered her. She then later says something like maybe he would have been happier with someone like Nicki. Maybe!

Oh well ... I am still not a huge fan of Courtney's but I THINK that I definitely understand her better and can cut her some slack. I was never really a fan of Ben's and am still not a fan.  

Finally, the "gossip" that interested me is how she recounted the fight that Emily and Jef had at Cassie and Peter's wedding in late July when they had just returned from Africa trip soon after finale. I was such a huge fan of that couple and I can recall my stomach just sinking when I read on WetPaint how "sources" claimed that Emily and Jef fought at wedding and that Jef spent time away from wedding in his car. Well, I am not sure if Courtney was WetPaint's source but Courtney essentially said the same thing in book. I also remember that Ashley and JP said that they were more likely to hang out with Ben & Courtney than Emily & Jef. I was shocked ... but now ... NOT so shocked at all ...

True many of the rags make up stuff and stretch the truth or blow things out of proportion. But, even the most die hard fan needs to see the light. Where there's lots and lots of smoke ... there's usually a fire smoldering somewhere.

Hi folks.. New member here and first post. Firstly, I am on this board solely as a fan of JP and Ashley. I didn't watch their season when it aired, but came across it on Youtube less than a year ago. Haven't watched the show since Jillian's season. Obviously, only Ashley and Ben know best what happened that night in the Fantasy Suite. That's all I will say about that or what my opinion is or not as obviously I just don't know. Secondly, I think that Courtney writing that book with that information in it, true or NOT true, is COMPLETELY classless. Free speech, her "Rights" or not, is totally immaterial.. It's just plain classless behavior. I have only read excerpts from the book and don't plan on reading more.. NOT my type of reading..
I also saw a post on Ben's Instagram with someone commenting to him about hearing "his" side of the story regarding the book. And Ben replied something to the effect of Courtney "selling out" to make a living.. I mentioned that to say that, yeah, I am sure Ben has his side to the story as well. "Sex" sells.. and her book is very heavy on that, and had she not put all that stuff in there, I wonder if her book would have done so well.. Sad, but true. Not much "bachelor" insider stuff, heavier on the trash.. Anyway, those are my thoughts and my opinion..

melrose!