Re: Blake & Holly - Discussion - Thread #1

[ironcat]

I just wish they would have waited to get together until BP finished filming (the whole shoot was only 3 weeks I believe, so it wouldn't have even been that long to wait), or that Holly had had the guts to level with Michael about her feelings. Maybe she didn't because she was afraid he would then dump her as his partner and team up with somebody else (since it was obvious he was the competitor in the pairing that the others admired and voted for), thus losing her shot at the money. Editing or not, it was handled badly, and Michael, although he still obviously thinks Holly is a good person, has said he did not feel she was being honest with him.

That said, I wish Blake and Holly well, and they are certainly a very attractive couple, who appear to be in love. Whether they are, in reality, wonderful people, or just not the villains some are making them out to be, is still a subjective call for each individual who gets to know them, as is the case with everybody.

[mnmhughes]

From Holly's perspective, I can understand why Blake would be considered the best "catch" out of the men she's been involved with so far; a tall, handsome, educated professional, who will probably be financially successful as well. It's unfortunate that the messy way their relationship started, combined with Blake's unlikability on BP and Holly's rather "colorful" romantic history, will cast a cloud on their potential "fairy tale", and cause people to be skeptical about their odds. If they really are meant to be, they'll make it and prove the skeptics wrong. But it's no surprise that not everyone is going to embrace this couple right out of the gate, too much baggage. Jason and Molly, anyone?

He didn't seem all that nice to Ashley either and I was really uncomfortable watching some of their scenes together, but of course, like with all the couples, I ultimately wish them happiness and love. They definitely seem blissful together.

What? You mean when he was rude to Ashley, refused to sit down, then seem bewildered when she started to cry? Or when she was crying and he was smirking as he said, "Come here and let me hug you?"

Or when he called Erika "thick" upon first meeting her?

If nothing else, at least Holly can maybe refine his rough edges a bit.

Ugh, YES. "Well, I'm going to stand and you can just do whatever." Haaaated him on Ashley's season and haaaated him on what little I watched of BP. What a smug jackass. And Holly offends me because she just seems deeply dumb, although it's probably all an act that she puts on around guys, which is even worse than actually being deeply dumb. Blech.

I'm bringing this forward with a response that seems to be necessary to be reminded of. What we see about any person on any of these shows is exactly what producers want us to see. Nothing more and nothing less. People are edited to support story lines, create drama, and become water cooler gossip in order to secure their ratings with ignited emotions like this. Judging anyone based on a very contrived edit and blatant staging is pure folly. The fact is, I have met several people who have been 'roasted' by viewers who they have never met - people who were fully haaaated - and not one of them are ANYTHING like the character they were portrayed to be. And by meeting, I don't mean just by a quick hello as some star-struck fan. I've had conversations that allowed me to get to know the real people they are. It saddens me to see this board lose perspective about this show to a point that it reflects hurtful comments and conclusions about people we don't know. Holly's heart is spun gold in my opinion. Dating around is not a crime; nor is it unusual to be a young woman trying to figure out who you are and find your way. And this is evidenced by Michael's consistend positive comments about her. If she wasn't a good person, he would not be saying what he has about her. Just like EVERYTHING else, there WAS manipulation in the Holly/Michael/Blake story that we were shown. They were all USED and HANDLED to set up reactions and generate DRAMA where there never otherwise would have been. Knowing the extent of this manipulation may be THE reason why they seem to have moved on in their lives in PEACE and many viewers have not. It is time to remember the context of this show and strive to keep it in perspective when we are shown Ben's season and given several women who are edited so that you favor them and several women who are edited for you to haaaate them. Reality is not what is shown on these shows. Reality is what you know about these people when you are their mother, father, brother, sister, or friend.

Trust me -- I understand about editing. I have watched every season of this show (something which I'm not exactly proud of :P ). The examples I listed from The Bette were moments that actually happened on screen between Blake and Ashley, and there was no manipulation of editing needed. He was a jerk to Ashley.

Furthermore, on BP2, both Holly and Blake handled things badly. I'm sure we can ALL agree on that point. They're both young and immature. It doesn't mean that they don't deserve a happy future, it just means that they will have a harder time convincing people that their love is genuine and true. They did this to themselves. The fact that they moved across the country together and are as far away from Hollywood as possible is a good sign.

I wish them much luck in the future, and I wish the same love for Michael as well.

[ironcat]

I would also like to add that there is a difference between criticizing someone's actions, and hurling gratuitous insults at them, and I don't really see much of the latter on this board. Sometimes people just don't come across as particularly likable on the show to some of us, and it often has nothing to do with editing.

[Guest]

You can't have it both ways, and a lot of former contesants seem to want that.

If you go on a "reality" show, and expose your life to MILLIONS of people for money, then don't come back and complain later that you weren't portrayed in a "realistic" manner, and people are mean to you because of it.

To paraphrase and old saying, "You takes the money, you takes your chances".

[bluwavz]

I would also like to add that there is a difference between criticizing someone's actions, and hurling gratuitous insults at them, and I don't really see much of the latter on this board. Sometimes people just don't come across as particularly likable on the show to some of us, and it often has nothing to do with editing.

I completely agree with this. Criticism isn't the same bashing and not every unflattering moment is just editing. I'm a Blake/Holly fan, but I also wish the whole situation was handled better and I didn't agree with some of the the things Blake or Holly did.

You can't have it both ways, and a lot of former contesants seem to want that.

If you go on a "reality" show, and expose your life to MILLIONS of people for money, then don't come back and complain later that you weren't portrayed in a "realistic" manner, and people are mean to you because of it.

To paraphrase and old saying, "You takes the money, you takes your chances".

I also agree with this. The ones that really get me are the contestants that got a bad edit on either the The Bachelor or The Bachelorette and then they appear on Bachelor Pad and get a bad edit again and complain about it. You didn't learn the first time lol?

[albean99]

From Holly's perspective, I can understand why Blake would be considered the best "catch" out of the men she's been involved with so far; a tall, handsome, educated professional, who will probably be financially successful as well. It's unfortunate that the messy way their relationship started, combined with Blake's unlikability on BP and Holly's rather "colorful" romantic history, will cast a cloud on their potential "fairy tale", and cause people to be skeptical about their odds. If they really are meant to be, they'll make it and prove the skeptics wrong. But it's no surprise that not everyone is going to embrace this couple right out of the gate, too much baggage. Jason and Molly, anyone?

He didn't seem all that nice to Ashley either and I was really uncomfortable watching some of their scenes together, but of course, like with all the couples, I ultimately wish them happiness and love. They definitely seem blissful together.

What? You mean when he was rude to Ashley, refused to sit down, then seem bewildered when she started to cry? Or when she was crying and he was smirking as he said, "Come here and let me hug you?"

Or when he called Erika "thick" upon first meeting her?

If nothing else, at least Holly can maybe refine his rough edges a bit.

Ugh, YES. "Well, I'm going to stand and you can just do whatever." Haaaated him on Ashley's season and haaaated him on what little I watched of BP. What a smug jackass. And Holly offends me because she just seems deeply dumb, although it's probably all an act that she puts on around guys, which is even worse than actually being deeply dumb. Blech.

I'm bringing this forward with a response that seems to be necessary to be reminded of. What we see about any person on any of these shows is exactly what producers want us to see. Nothing more and nothing less. People are edited to support story lines, create drama, and become water cooler gossip in order to secure their ratings with ignited emotions like this. Judging anyone based on a very contrived edit and blatant staging is pure folly. The fact is, I have met several people who have been 'roasted' by viewers who they have never met - people who were fully haaaated - and not one of them are ANYTHING like the character they were portrayed to be. And by meeting, I don't mean just by a quick hello as some star-struck fan. I've had conversations that allowed me to get to know the real people they are. It saddens me to see this board lose perspective about this show to a point that it reflects hurtful comments and conclusions about people we don't know. Holly's heart is spun gold in my opinion. Dating around is not a crime; nor is it unusual to be a young woman trying to figure out who you are and find your way. And this is evidenced by Michael's consistend positive comments about her. If she wasn't a good person, he would not be saying what he has about her. Just like EVERYTHING else, there WAS manipulation in the Holly/Michael/Blake story that we were shown. They were all USED and HANDLED to set up reactions and generate DRAMA where there never otherwise would have been. Knowing the extent of this manipulation may be THE reason why they seem to have moved on in their lives in PEACE and many viewers have not. It is time to remember the context of this show and strive to keep it in perspective when we are shown Ben's season and given several women who are edited so that you favor them and several women who are edited for you to haaaate them. Reality is not what is shown on these shows. Reality is what you know about these people when you are their mother, father, brother, sister, or friend.

Trust me -- I understand about editing. I have watched every season of this show (something which I'm not exactly proud of :P ). The examples I listed from The Bette were moments that actually happened on screen between Blake and Ashley, and there was no manipulation of editing needed. He was a jerk to Ashley.

Furthermore, on BP2, both Holly and Blake handled things badly. I'm sure we can ALL agree on that point. They're both young and immature. It doesn't mean that they don't deserve a happy future, it just means that they will have a harder time convincing people that their love is genuine and true. They did this to themselves. The fact that they moved across the country together and are as far away from Hollywood as possible is a good sign.

I wish them much luck in the future, and I wish the same love for Michael as well.

Refresh my memory. I have no clue when Blake was a jerk to Ashley. I thought he was pretty up front on her show and Ashley wasn't exactly "miss empathy" herself when it came to the guys. I think everyone is now happy and have moved on in any case.

[mnmhughes]

From Holly's perspective, I can understand why Blake would be considered the best "catch" out of the men she's been involved with so far; a tall, handsome, educated professional, who will probably be financially successful as well. It's unfortunate that the messy way their relationship started, combined with Blake's unlikability on BP and Holly's rather "colorful" romantic history, will cast a cloud on their potential "fairy tale", and cause people to be skeptical about their odds. If they really are meant to be, they'll make it and prove the skeptics wrong. But it's no surprise that not everyone is going to embrace this couple right out of the gate, too much baggage. Jason and Molly, anyone?

He didn't seem all that nice to Ashley either and I was really uncomfortable watching some of their scenes together, but of course, like with all the couples, I ultimately wish them happiness and love. They definitely seem blissful together.

What? You mean when he was rude to Ashley, refused to sit down, then seem bewildered when she started to cry? Or when she was crying and he was smirking as he said, "Come here and let me hug you?"

Or when he called Erika "thick" upon first meeting her?

If nothing else, at least Holly can maybe refine his rough edges a bit.

Ugh, YES. "Well, I'm going to stand and you can just do whatever." Haaaated him on Ashley's season and haaaated him on what little I watched of BP. What a smug jackass. And Holly offends me because she just seems deeply dumb, although it's probably all an act that she puts on around guys, which is even worse than actually being deeply dumb. Blech.

I'm bringing this forward with a response that seems to be necessary to be reminded of. What we see about any person on any of these shows is exactly what producers want us to see. Nothing more and nothing less. People are edited to support story lines, create drama, and become water cooler gossip in order to secure their ratings with ignited emotions like this. Judging anyone based on a very contrived edit and blatant staging is pure folly. The fact is, I have met several people who have been 'roasted' by viewers who they have never met - people who were fully haaaated - and not one of them are ANYTHING like the character they were portrayed to be. And by meeting, I don't mean just by a quick hello as some star-struck fan. I've had conversations that allowed me to get to know the real people they are. It saddens me to see this board lose perspective about this show to a point that it reflects hurtful comments and conclusions about people we don't know. Holly's heart is spun gold in my opinion. Dating around is not a crime; nor is it unusual to be a young woman trying to figure out who you are and find your way. And this is evidenced by Michael's consistend positive comments about her. If she wasn't a good person, he would not be saying what he has about her. Just like EVERYTHING else, there WAS manipulation in the Holly/Michael/Blake story that we were shown. They were all USED and HANDLED to set up reactions and generate DRAMA where there never otherwise would have been. Knowing the extent of this manipulation may be THE reason why they seem to have moved on in their lives in PEACE and many viewers have not. It is time to remember the context of this show and strive to keep it in perspective when we are shown Ben's season and given several women who are edited so that you favor them and several women who are edited for you to haaaate them. Reality is not what is shown on these shows. Reality is what you know about these people when you are their mother, father, brother, sister, or friend.

Trust me -- I understand about editing. I have watched every season of this show (something which I'm not exactly proud of :P ). The examples I listed from The Bette were moments that actually happened on screen between Blake and Ashley, and there was no manipulation of editing needed. He was a jerk to Ashley.

Furthermore, on BP2, both Holly and Blake handled things badly. I'm sure we can ALL agree on that point. They're both young and immature. It doesn't mean that they don't deserve a happy future, it just means that they will have a harder time convincing people that their love is genuine and true. They did this to themselves. The fact that they moved across the country together and are as far away from Hollywood as possible is a good sign.

I wish them much luck in the future, and I wish the same love for Michael as well.

Refresh my memory. I have no clue when Blake was a jerk to Ashley. I thought he was pretty up front on her show and Ashley wasn't exactly "miss empathy" herself when it came to the guys. I think everyone is now happy and have moved on in any case.

Examples are in the post above. I agree that everyone has moved on. I'm not the one who brought it back up; I was just commenting on a reply to my post from several days ago. It really doesn't matter anymore, does it? I'm done with it. 8)

[albean99]

I don't remember any of that happening so find it confusing to hear about it now but I'll leave it be also.

[ironcat]

It was at the cocktail party in HK after Ashley told the guys about Bentley. Blake was pretty cold to her when they spoke privately about it, rejected her offer to sit down to talk, and didn't really change his stance until he realized she was starting to cry. My feeling at the time was that he was acting upset mostly for effect/ego, since I seriously doubt he was all that invested in his relationship with Ashley, considering they never even had a 1 on 1 date (and he must have realized by that point that he wasn't going to "win" anyway). But there were several instances during both Ashley's season and BP where I sensed an arrogance about Blake, that I seriously doubt was solely the result of "editing". Does he have something to be arrogant about? Probably, but it didn't really endear him to me on either show.

[albean99]

Thanks, Ironcat. I guess I wasn't all that sympathetic to Ashley either. I don't really blame the guys for being angry at her because they couldn't know that at least part of it was producer induced.

[Guest]

I would also like to add that there is a difference between criticizing someone's actions, and hurling gratuitous insults at them, and I don't really see much of the latter on this board. Sometimes people just don't come across as particularly likable on the show to some of us, and it often has nothing to do with editing.

The point of my comment came at the heels of a page prior to here: "What a smug jackass. And Holly offends me because she just seems deeply dumb, although it's probably all an act that she puts on around guys, which is even worse than actually being deeply dumb." I think that qualifies 'gratuitous insults; and reason enough to encourage all to keep a perspective about what is being shown. We need to strive to keep this board a cut above the rest. There's nothing wrong with picking a favorite - but, being respective in expression is something we can all do, right?

[mnmhughes]

I would also like to add that there is a difference between criticizing someone's actions, and hurling gratuitous insults at them, and I don't really see much of the latter on this board. Sometimes people just don't come across as particularly likable on the show to some of us, and it often has nothing to do with editing.

The point of my comment came at the heels of a page prior to here: "What a smug jackass. And Holly offends me because she just seems deeply dumb, although it's probably all an act that she puts on around guys, which is even worse than actually being deeply dumb." I think that qualifies 'gratuitous insults; and reason enough to encourage all to keep a perspective about what is being shown. We need to strive to keep this board a cut above the rest. There's nothing wrong with picking a favorite - but, being respective in expression is something we can all do, right?

Absolutely.

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