Bachelor Canada - Season 3 - Chris Leroux - Episode Discussion - *Sleuthing Spoilers* - #2

tatladylu wrote:@LynnTa
Because she's just 23 and has her whole life ahead of her.

If it ends up like that, then it would prove Chris was right--that 23 is too young and that at 23 there is still a lot of growing to do....and maybe Lyn giving him her heart already after 5 weeks in the Bach Bubble was more proof that 23 is too young -- That could also mean that when he said he was apprehensive he meant it and couldn't get past it. That could also explain why we see them talk about it every time. Lyn saying she felt like she wasn't being seen has to mean something. The physical connection is there but I don't see much of emotional/feeling from his part !
Either way, I do think that being only 23 ,Lyn should enjoy her life rather than settling down.... AJMO of course. Lyn will make her own decisions.

HEA wrote:

Bobette wrote:

I haven't watched this episode yet, but if Chris' body language towards Lyndsey has changed since last episode, it makes me wonder if something went down behind the scenes.  Like, maybe Lyndsey told the producers she wasn't that into him, and he was p!ssed at her.  In all previous episodes he has seemed way more into L than Mik to my eyes, so it seems like a weird and drastic shift.  

Also hypothetically, if Lyndsey did say she wanted out, perhaps Chris felt he had to choose Mikaela even though she wasn't his first choice.  So you would then have a situation where Chris ends up picking M when he really wanted L, and perhaps he confessed this, or Mikalea just worked it out.  I could see that breaking up a relationship in a week, which would explain the RS spoiler.  

All speculation and JMO.

I do not think this is works.

1. lindsey repeated the almost the same words to him... it could be the last time we see each other and that makes me want to cry etc... I do not see when she would have said she wanted out since her words are the complete opposite    In fact she is kinda begging almost that he will pick her instead. No way I see a girl with cold feet... because how clearer this can be: I am yours if you want me.........

2. HER body language is into him.... not the reverse

3. last GD CP when she said she was his, his body language was the same(I will make SC)

IMO, she never wanted to be engaged from the start OR she said that at the beginning of her journey not at the end.... We THINK it is maybe during hometown or fantasy date but WHAT IF she was smart enough to know it would be ridiculous to have a proposal after few hours of knowing each other.

IMO, not all the contestants want the engagement out of this even if they fall in love.

JMO

The problem with this theory, IMO, is that this is kind of based on the VO that is suspected to be all Lyndsey. IMO, it is Lyndsey and Dee spliced in together. I think it is Dee that says that she must leave. It is based on her epi 4 ITM's where she is saying that if he isn't wanting to spend time with her, because of having her daughter at home,she's got to leave.

Clumping me into the category of thinking it happened between htd or fd. I don't remember saying that so maybe the we thing isn't correct??

IMO, Lyndsey AND Chris are BOTH open to each other in the conversations by how they are sitting.....and NOT closed off as you suggest

LynnTa wrote:

tatladylu wrote:@LynnTa
Because she's just 23 and has her whole life ahead of her.

If it ends up like that, then it would prove Chris was right--that 23 is too young  and that at 23 there is still a lot of growing to do....and maybe Lyn giving him her heart already after 5 weeks in the Bach Bubble was more proof that 23 is too young -- That could also mean that when he said he was apprehensive he meant it and couldn't get past it.  That could also explain why we see them talk about it every time.  Lyn saying she felt like she wasn't being seen has to mean something. The physical connection is there but I don't see much of emotional/feeling from his part !  
Either way, I do think that being only 23 ,Lyn should enjoy her life rather than settling down.... AJMO  of course. Lyn will make her own decisions.  

exactly... it is more about HER.... instead of a US.

no way a lead would leave his F1 in this state of insecurity. I remember how Tim ran to April bedroom when she had this meltdown. I do not remember all the leads who did it but I am sure he was not the only one. And it is obvious to me that he is not doing the right things since she is repeating the same thing again and again for the last 2 episodes.

If you see someone you love and in pain, your inner reaction is to make sure this person feels better. At this point, the lead would not want his F1 to quit because he didn't do or say the right things.

jmo

Yes. So true ^^^^

I love SCs. Its amazing how much detail I find when I pause the screen. I start noticing the little things . A picture is really worth a thousand words.
Thank you all who take the time to make SCs

HEA wrote:

Storybook wrote:After watching these two videos through a number of times this is my summary of each one:

Lyndsey: Chris says to her "I don't want to meet your family unless my intentions are to spend the rest of my life with you."

Mikaela: Chris says "I am concerned about whether your family will accept me or not."

If I was going to make a decision on the winner based on these two statements, without question I would choose Lyndsey.
On top of this with Lyndsey Chris is wanting assurance she has feelings for him. He admits he has always had strong feelings towards her.
With Mikaela Chris says he has to figure out his heart before he can tell her what she wants to hear.
IMO there is doubt on Chris's feelings for Mikaela. How this pans out I don't know (but supposedly Reality Steve does). If Lyndsey does not win then I believe it is not Chris who rejects her. And I have to agree with @Bobette's theory.

Chris has no choice in the matter but to choose 3 girls for hometown... do we think that he would say to lindsey: hey girl, I am sorry but I am interested with only one girl from now on............... OF COURSE he needed to re-insure lindsey (again). He is not the first lead to lie to the contestants and won't be the last.

I am ONLY afraid that your family may not like me............. only... that means IMO, he already made up his mind that he WILL meet her family. no if here. He is projecting to the future.

with lindsey, he had the same kind of language with catie and kait: i give the rose to the girl I can project myself in the next 50 years with................ do we really think catie is a valid F1. I doubt it.

If we criticize is pre made words to the girls, IMO, we must look at them in a whole and add his BL with them. Some can say with a mean face ILY or someone can say ILY with puppy eyes.. same but different IMO

it is 2 TIMES now that chris says:  I am afraid to fall in love with mickaela as there are other girls I care immensely too (not verbatim but almost similar)

it is MIKAELA versus THE OTHER GIRLS.... 2 times

I need to clear up my heart BEFORE saying the words that MIKAELA wants to hear....... not lindsey, not catie, not stacy..... specifically Mikaela.

I am totally convinced that Mikaela was never ever a second choice. He made his choice a long time ago and someone had to fill in the F2 position like always

JMO

First off, we DON'T have proof that the spoiler is correct so IMO we need to keep to that fact. IF the spoiler is incorrect(IMO, it is) then what you are sayign above has less validity, IMO.

Again, Lyndsey is spelled Lyndsey NOT Lindsay. Second, of course Chris has to take 3... IMO what you are saying above is that you think Chris would ONLY take Mikaela and none others. IMO, that's kind of closed minded considering that IF the spoiler is incorrect, then IMO we need to keep sleuthing things out to get to the correct conclusion not assumption.

So many assumptions can be made by the words that Chris says....for example, the "I am ONLY afraid that your family may not like me".....This can be taken as: I am only afraid your family may not like me cause I know I am giving you a htd and I don't have any other questions between us......THIS IS TYPICAL F2/F3 not F1. In F1 there are more questions between them and problems that they need to deal with BEYOND whether her parents will like him. Heck with Brad's HTD with Whit, that was his concern there....whether her parents like him and are open to the process. We all know how that turned out.

for a FACT those words were never said....he never said he was afraid to fall in love with Mikaela. I heard him say he wasn't ready to give his heart to her AND we heard his mom in an ITM say don't be afraid to fall in love. That's all that was said. As far as combining that with the name of Mikaela can be assumed as a big stretch IMO.

Right now, we have NO idea who his final choice is....yea we can put that on Lyndsey or Mikaela but we just don't KNOW. Believing that it is one or the other is different than knowing and having that labeled as a FACT. Therefore IMO, we need to make sure that we don't do that. We need to keep our options open and think of ALL the angles versus closing off to who we want it to be.

Typical F1 edit:

The F1's story gets laid out. The obstacle for the lead and the f1 to overcome is set up. On night 1, the lead and the F1 has been taken aside in their own area AWAY from the others to have their private chat. On night one, it was Lyndsey that was taken aside to the private area where no one else was allowed to interupt their time. It was Lyndsey that an obstacle that was laid out for them to solve in the form of the age difference and if Chris can get beyond that. It was Lyndsey that Chris produced an obstacle that they needed to solve together. With Mikaela, he had his alone time with her in clear view of others. The other women were able to watch the time that he had with her. Not only that but there was no obstacle that was presented for BOTH of them to overcome.

The FIRST time an obstacle was presented was in epi 6 when Mikaela was trying to tell Chris how she was feeling and Chris was closed off. He admitted to it, apologized to her by the end of the epi and therefore, their obstacle was presented, and solved, all in one epi. This ISN'T typical of a F1 edit. In epi 7 the only other crux that was put forward for Mikaela is if the family will like Chris. Again, not a F1 edit.

Right now, IMO, it is Lyndsey getting the F1 edit. IF the producers are going off the grid this season, then that needs to be kept track of for subsequent seasons.

With Lyndsey, IMO, Chris does need reassurance from her. He needs to know that she will accept him before he can completely fall. With Mikaela, Chris knows Mikaela is all in therefore there are no questions as far as she is concerned. But with Lyndsey, there is the family, the age difference, the question whether he can fall in love with her.

HEA wrote:BTW.... I am not sure how SC can lie since they are part of the video

But if you take the worse and best sc out of the video to use as a demonstration, isn't that deception? Meaning. If you take the exact moment that Chris is smiling with Mikaela as a sc even though through the video there are times that he's not smiling, isn't that a form of deception? then on the other side of the coin, if you take the exact moment of Chris with an extreme puzzle look for a sc when there are a lot better looks, expressions in the video, isn't that part of deception as well??????

BlackHalo wrote:I definitely think Lynsdey is a frontrunner for Chris but I can see in his body language that their relationship has cooled a bit.

And where Mikaela acts too confident, Lydnsey acts too insecure for someone getting the reassurance an F1 usually gets at this point.

JMO.

Actually in seasons past, this is the point that the F2 gets the most assurance of her being chosen at the end by the lead, by the producers and by the handlers. It is EXACTLY in seasons past where the F1 doesn't get the assurance they need to feel good about the prospect of being chosen in the end.

How else can the producers get the reactions in the end they want....meaning: they want the F2 to be so sure they are chosen that when they aren't is when you get the shocked looks. Then with the F1 they want them to be on pins and needles and completely unsure so when they are chosen, you get the relief looks and complete happiness.

LynnTa wrote:

tatladylu wrote:@LynnTa
Because she's just 23 and has her whole life ahead of her.

If it ends up like that, then it would prove Chris was right--that 23 is too young  and that at 23 there is still a lot of growing to do....and maybe Lyn giving him her heart already after 5 weeks in the Bach Bubble was more proof that 23 is too young -- That could also mean that when he said he was apprehensive he meant it and couldn't get past it.  That could also explain why we see them talk about it every time.  Lyn saying she felt like she wasn't being seen has to mean something. The physical connection is there but I don't see much of emotional/feeling from his part !  
Either way, I do think that being only 23 ,Lyn should enjoy her life rather than settling down.... AJMO  of course. Lyn will make her own decisions.  

Absolutely!

So the question is...

Does he pick Michaela where the future may seem, at least to him, more secure or does he risk and pick Lyndsey where the future seems less secure?

LynnTa wrote:

tatladylu wrote:@LynnTa
Because she's just 23 and has her whole life ahead of her.

If it ends up like that, then it would prove Chris was right--that 23 is too young  and that at 23 there is still a lot of growing to do....and maybe Lyn giving him her heart already after 5 weeks in the Bach Bubble was more proof that 23 is too young -- That could also mean that when he said he was apprehensive he meant it and couldn't get past it.  That could also explain why we see them talk about it every time.  Lyn saying she felt like she wasn't being seen has to mean something. The physical connection is there but I don't see much of emotional/feeling from his part !  
Either way, I do think that being only 23 ,Lyn should enjoy her life rather than settling down.... AJMO  of course. Lyn will make her own decisions.  

Yes, she does have her whole life ahead of her...think that's fair to say, but IMO to say that 23 is too young for settling down, etc. That is a bunch of hoey. Speaking for myself and about 10 others that I know of.....age and age differences mean crap. If the two people are in the right frame of mind at the right time together, that is all that matters and NOT the 10 yr gap. I was 19 and my husband was 30 when we got married, we are nearly 30 yrs down the track and happier than ever. Just to say that a person is 19 or 23 and too young to get married BECAUSE they are that age, then IMO that is short minded to the detriment of sleuthing and the possibilities that may exist. I see ton of emotion on Chris's face and how he handles things with Lyndsey.

HEA wrote:

LynnTa wrote:

tatladylu wrote:@LynnTa
Because she's just 23 and has her whole life ahead of her.

If it ends up like that, then it would prove Chris was right--that 23 is too young  and that at 23 there is still a lot of growing to do....and maybe Lyn giving him her heart already after 5 weeks in the Bach Bubble was more proof that 23 is too young -- That could also mean that when he said he was apprehensive he meant it and couldn't get past it.  That could also explain why we see them talk about it every time.  Lyn saying she felt like she wasn't being seen has to mean something. The physical connection is there but I don't see much of emotional/feeling from his part !  
Either way, I do think that being only 23 ,Lyn should enjoy her life rather than settling down.... AJMO  of course. Lyn will make her own decisions.  

exactly... it is more about HER.... instead of a US.

no way a lead would leave his F1 in this state of insecurity. I remember how Tim ran to April bedroom when she had this meltdown. I do not remember all the leads who did it but I am sure he was not the only one. And it is obvious to me that he is not doing the right things since she is repeating the same thing again and again for the last 2 episodes.

If you see someone you love and in pain, your inner reaction is to make sure this person feels better. At this point, the lead would not want his F1 to quit because he didn't do or say the right things.

jmo

With Lyndsey and Chris. The age thing was brought up by CHRIS, therefore it is a problem for THEM and not just her. The F1 is ALWAYS left with insecurities at this point in the game. Look at how insecure Bianka and April were. Then look at how secure Trish was. Look at how insecure JP was going into the FRC, not to mention Emily, Lauren B, and countless others as you see countless F2's with such great confidence going into the FRC.

When you look at it all, IMO I now look to see who is more confident than the others....it basically pans out in the end.

With the exception of Leah's lie, I don't remember Lauren B being insecure until the F3 stage? and we are not down to that point yet. I can recall other F1s that didn't show uncertainty until it was down to the wire and some that showed none at all. People like Whitney and Chris S. remained confident about their connections throughout. There are outliers. What I am seeing right now is Chris giving Mik reassurance; "ready for the Mik/Chris love story" "I'm concerned if your family will accept me" vs. Lyndsey who acted as though she might be on the chopping block this week. With that being said, there is still a lot of story to be told.

JMO.

As someone who will be happy with either choice, I can say quite honestly that IMO both sides are seeing only what their chosen outcome wishes to see. I have tremendous respect for the great sleuthing that goes on here but IMO the Lyndsey vs Michela wars are no example of the skill and objectivity of sleuthing that is normally demonstrated and the “evidence” is not up to your usual admirable standards, at all. For example; what does
"I don't want to meet your family unless my intentions are to spend the rest of my life with you."
even mean when he’s about to meet THREE girls’ families?
Arguing about such nonsensical statements is beneath the talented sleuthers on this board, IMO. This poor man is all over the map. You truly cannot make sense of nonsense. All JMO

Chgohighlife wrote:As someone who will be happy with either choice, I can say quite honestly that IMO both sides are seeing only what their chosen outcome wishes to see. I have tremendous respect for the great sleuthing that goes on here but IMO the Lyndsey vs Michela wars are no example of the skill and objectivity of sleuthing that is normally demonstrated and the “evidence” is not up to your usual admirable standards, at all. For example;  what does
"I don't want to meet your family unless my intentions are to spend the rest of my life with you."
even mean when he’s about to meet THREE girls’ families?
Arguing about such nonsensical statements is beneath the talented sleuthers on this board, IMO. This poor man is all over the map. You truly cannot make sense of nonsense. All JMO

Pretty much this. And comparing it all to the standards of prior seasons is... Not every lead has the same journey? So yes, while there may be similarities to prior seasons, I'm less concerned with producer tricks and am more concerned with what I am actually hearing and seeing from Chris right now. I can feel one way this week and completely different the next with this guy. It's happened before.

JMO.