Peter Kraus - Bachelorette 13 - Discussion - #9

Acrunch wrote:

Billysmom wrote:I actually think Rachel did say she felt peter was either manipulating or manipulative....  Wish I could recall which interview.

Yes she did.  She called him manipulative and said she felt he was stringing her along and not being forthcoming.  It was in the ET interview.

http://www.etonline.com/tv/223296_exclusive_bachelorette_rachel_lindsay_calls_peter_manipulative_reveals_who_should_be_bachelor_instead/?cid=stp_tmz

And it baffles me because a) he was very upfront with her (even with the men) about his thoughts on proposing and b) that she supposedly KNEW that Bryan was the one and therefore her pushing, coaxing and trying to get him comfortable enough in their relationship to have him propose to her was in my opinion a true manipulation and really stringing him along.  Peter was trying to get there with her while she was just trying to get to the end so she could choose Bryan.

The lead always "manipulates" the F2. It is the show's premise. For me, a few things probably lead to the messy break up scenes with Peter:

1) I think that Rachel's usual guy in the past was the Peter type and not the Bryan type. There were qualities about Peter that she liked and was drawn to. It wasn't that she wasn't attracted to Peter. She was. Enough so to bring him to F2. The break up with the F2 is always the most difficult. Rachel admitted she wasn't good with break ups, so she really struggled with this one and it showed.

2) I think that Rachel's family has a preference for a Peter type over a Bryan type and they probably conveyed that to Rachel on the MTPs. I am sure that this weighed on her mind. I think she was trying to give Peter the benefit of the doubt for as long as possible. I think that they are a conservative, cerebral, traditional family and they found Peter to be more realistic/prudent and Bryan to be more the hopeless romantic and deserving of skepticism. Over-achievers (the Lindsay's IMO) take pride in their achievements which result from hard work and determination. A real achievement doesn't show up on your doorstep and come to you easily. Things with worth and value take time and effort. Therefore, something so quick and easy as Bryan falling in love with your daughter is not to be trusted or seen as real.

3) I think that all of the struggling to make it work with Peter was in direct contrast to how easy it was with Bryan. I think that while she may have thought Bryan was too good to be true, he slowly proved that his words and actions matched up, and Peter proved that his weren't as consistent or if they were consistent they weren't matched up with Rachel's. So, while hindsight is 20-20 in seeing that Bryan was standing in front of her the whole time, I do think she was willing to go through the process fully with both men. In the end, that process showed each man's character traits, emotional state, and who was in the same place as her. It was part of her learning curve.

But but but Perfect Pedestal Pete doesn't deserve any negativity because he's done absolutely nothing, and I mean nothing wrong this whole season or on SM. He's just the bestest, model-perfect personal trainer this franchise has ever seen.

For all Peter's total BS manipulative behavior on and off the show imo Peter has gotten off VERY easy via SM/media and lead JMO

@MiaHawk I take what the lead says about the F2 with a huge discount. How many ways can you tell someone that you just like someone else better? Can you say, yes, I took you to the F2 because I really like you and even love you and I had to choose someone to be in that place? At the same time, the lead has to GUSH about the chosen one, as he/she should. The F2 position is the worst position to find yourself in this franchise.

IMO ~ ALL of Peter's body language was saying don't touch me!!!    I've never seen anything like it on this show.
A man who sits several feet from a woman, arms, hands clenched tightly to his chest.  Saying all the right words, at
least words (imo) that will get him to the next round, but lo and behold, when they get to the meet the parents, he flat out tells her he 'likes' her, but in no way shape or form will he be proposing at the end.    He totally put the brakes on, and implied
he'd be willing to 'date' to see where things went.   Oh really???       Then of course when he senses he will be sent home, the tune changes AGAIN.  Throughout the season, his interactions were SO painful to watch.   

When RS changed is spoiler, things actually made sense.   Peter could not have had less interest in Rachel if he tried.

I hear he's open, and willing to try and find love now.  

mprssdbyu wrote:I can't touch the eyelash comment! If you were in Peter's shoes, are you going to stop and pick them up and revisit those emotions. No, he shouldn't have said it outloud. As far as the crying validating his feelings...I can see it another way. Bryan was so different than Peter. Bryan is a bit much to take when your personality is on the opposite end of the spectrum. Peter had seen Rachel interact with Bryan from the get go. If I were Peter, I wouldn't get it either...not even a smidge. For better or worse, Peter just couldn't let go and reach the point he could commit to an engagement with Rachel. So when he's the opposite of Bryan, I think he's saying the tears do tell she cares for me regardless of how different I am from that guy. He was frustrated when he said go have a mediocre life. In that moment, he meant it but that's emotion getting the best of you. Lawdy, I'm glad I'm not judged when I'm frustrated as hell. I would have to shut down my social media.

Ok, I can see that for Peter perhaps Rachel's tears showed him that she was interested in him (not just into Bryan). But, he couldn't see that she was interested in him all along? That's where he comes across as either walled off to Rachel (protecting himself from being hurt) or just walled off in general. I don't really know which it is with 100% certainty. My gut tells me he is narcissistic and mostly walled off in general to other people's feelings. JMO. I guess when it comes to this show, I prefer to watch as F2 throw caution to the wind and allow himself to fall in love, even if it doesn't end well. That says something about a person's attitude towards life to me. I guess I have a preference on this show.

As a grown man, yes, I expected him to stop, grab a tissue, and dispose of the eyelashes in the trash. That would have been the mature thing to do. To me, this is a sign of a life with a guy who is constantly going to be keeping a tab as to what little chores he has done for you and what you owe him in return. A guy that is more about how something is affecting him than how it is affecting our relationship. The whole eyelash thing is OTT odd to me. I just think it is a red flag. IMO.

AllAboutLove wrote:For all Peter's total BS manipulative behavior on and off the show imo Peter has gotten off VERY easy via SM/media and lead JMO

Yep.

MiaHawk wrote:

mprssdbyu wrote:I can't touch the eyelash comment! If you were in Peter's shoes, are you going to stop and pick them up and revisit those emotions. No, he shouldn't have said it outloud. As far as the crying validating his feelings...I can see it another way. Bryan was so different than Peter. Bryan is a bit much to take when your personality is on the opposite end of the spectrum. Peter had seen Rachel interact with Bryan from the get go. If I were Peter, I wouldn't get it either...not even a smidge. For better or worse, Peter just couldn't let go and reach the point he could commit to an engagement with Rachel. So when he's the opposite of Bryan, I think he's saying the tears do tell she cares for me regardless of how different I am from that guy. He was frustrated when he said go have a mediocre life. In that moment, he meant it but that's emotion getting the best of you. Lawdy, I'm glad I'm not judged when I'm frustrated as hell. I would have to shut down my social media.

Ok, I can see that for Peter perhaps Rachel's tears showed him that she was interested in him (not just into Bryan).  But, he couldn't see that she was interested in him all along? That's where he comes across as either walled off to Rachel (protecting himself from being hurt) or just walled off in general. I don't really know which it is with 100% certainty. My gut tells me he is narcissistic and mostly walled off in general to other people's feelings. JMO. I guess when it comes to this show, I prefer to watch as F2 throw caution to the wind and allow himself to fall in love, even if it doesn't end well. That says something about a person's attitude towards life to me. I guess I have a preference on this show.

As a grown man, yes, I expected him to stop, grab a tissue, and dispose of the eyelashes in the trash. That would have been the mature thing to do. To me, this is a sign of a life with a guy who is constantly going to be keeping a tab as to what little chores he has done for you and what you owe him in return. A guy that is more about how something is affecting him than how it is affecting our relationship. The whole eyelash thing is OTT odd to me. I just think it is a red flag. IMO.

I totally get that. It is weird. I've never seen someone cry off their eyelashes. I'm not sure I would have noticed. But if I did and it was that emotional and I'm involved emotionally, I can't pick them up. Let the emotions stay on that floor. She has said good-bye and nothing is going to change that if I can't say "Will you marry me, tomorrow". I hate to take up for Peter and make it sound like I think he's the bees knees cause I don't. I guess I just know a lot of awkward or emotionally challenged people! Too many, probably! HA HA

MiaHawk wrote:

mprssdbyu wrote:I can't touch the eyelash comment! If you were in Peter's shoes, are you going to stop and pick them up and revisit those emotions. No, he shouldn't have said it outloud. As far as the crying validating his feelings...I can see it another way. Bryan was so different than Peter. Bryan is a bit much to take when your personality is on the opposite end of the spectrum. Peter had seen Rachel interact with Bryan from the get go. If I were Peter, I wouldn't get it either...not even a smidge. For better or worse, Peter just couldn't let go and reach the point he could commit to an engagement with Rachel. So when he's the opposite of Bryan, I think he's saying the tears do tell she cares for me regardless of how different I am from that guy. He was frustrated when he said go have a mediocre life. In that moment, he meant it but that's emotion getting the best of you. Lawdy, I'm glad I'm not judged when I'm frustrated as hell. I would have to shut down my social media.

Ok, I can see that for Peter perhaps Rachel's tears showed him that she was interested in him (not just into Bryan).  But, he couldn't see that she was interested in him all along? That's where he comes across as either walled off to Rachel (protecting himself from being hurt) or just walled off in general. I don't really know which it is with 100% certainty. My gut tells me he is narcissistic and mostly walled off in general to other people's feelings. JMO. I guess when it comes to this show, I prefer to watch as F2 throw caution to the wind and allow himself to fall in love, even if it doesn't end well. That says something about a person's attitude towards life to me. I guess I have a preference on this show.

*snip*

I think he's just insecure. Simple as. That was my first suspicion when I read about his eating disorder past (because I can be a judgemental a-hole) and everything he's done since has been consistent with that IMO. It may be annoying but it's not a crime. We all have our faults. I think Rachel is quite insecure as well behind the sassy front, which is probably why Rachel and Peter felt connected in a sense and why they were such a mess at times. I don't know if things would be any different for them in real life, but in this situation they were bringing out the worst in each other rather than the best. JMO.

@stuckinsc I don't think Peter having used Tinder should be a negative. My oldest met his fiancé that way.

Re: the eyelashes  I wouldn't pick them up either and I'm not a guy.

albean99 wrote:@stuckinsc I don't think Peter having used Tinder should be a negative. My oldest met his fiancé that way.

Re: the eyelashes  I wouldn't pick them up either and I'm not a guy.

Lucky for your oldest, every girl I knew who was on Tinder would meet guys who were interested until sex and then magically disappeared. My understanding it is mostly a hookup app. I heard five or six of my grad school classmates complain about these guys saying they weren't just there for sex and then being gone right after.

JMO.

stuckinsc wrote:

albean99 wrote:@stuckinsc I don't think Peter having used Tinder should be a negative. My oldest met his fiancé that way.

Re: the eyelashes  I wouldn't pick them up either and I'm not a guy.

Lucky for your oldest, every girl I knew who was on Tinder would meet guys who were interested until sex and then magically disappeared. My understanding it is mostly a hookup app. I heard five or six of my grad school classmates complain about these guys saying they were just there for sex and then being gone right after.

JMO.

I guess it depends. Obviously it can work but both have to be ready for a relationship. My son didn't really need an app for dating but wanted more. This isn't anything to do with that but is funny.

My mom ran my Tinder