Re: Vanessa Grimaldi - Bachelor 21 - Fan Forum - *Sleuthing Spoilers*

[Skates]

Has Nick's and Vanessa's htd been posted  somewhere alone, not the whole show? I used to rewatch the previous weeks Nessa time multiple times on youtube, but can't find them now.

Having watched all of these videos again, I notice that Nick has been smiling while bidding goodbye to Vanessa (regardless of Vanessa's HTD's outcome)...and he has told her to stay out of her head...

When Nick talks to Vanessa's father, he has also mentioned that he is very happy with Vanessa...and he talks about how two people being madly in love with each other would want to get married, thus he is asking for his blessings...

Nick could have said it simpler, but I think he has been trying to emphasize some key points/words to show Vanessa's father his sincerity and how much he would care for his daughter...Nick is smiling....he is so happy because he is feeling the intensity of Vanessa's love for him...I think it makes him feel good about the love they have...and, it is a good thing...I don't think he has felt that much love from the other girls...not even Rachel or Corinne...

[Guest]

I want to know if Nick also does all these sweet little gestures he does with Vanessa with the other women. I've managed to build a high tolerance for Corrinne and I don't see it. I don't know about Rachel and Raven because I can't stomach watching either one.

[Guest]

@Skates, thank you for posting their date so I can obsessively watching it over and over. Okay, a little.

[ukglasgowkiiss]

WEEK 9   POEM
     
I Said It To You (by Paul Elouard)

I said it to you for the clouds
I said it to you for the tree of the sea

For each wave for the birds in the leaves
For the pebbles of sound
For familiar hands
For the eye that becomes landscape or face

And sleep returns it the heaven of its colour
For all that night drank
For the network of roads
For the open window for a bare forehead

I said it to you for your thoughts for your words
Every caress every trust survives.

[ukglasgowkiiss]

Thankyou @Skates, same reason as @2ndcampbell!

Having watched again I still think that Nick opens and closes his hand as if to gesture 'cut' to the producers, so that he can speak more plainly off camera to Mr Grimaldi. In Part 4, after Nick looks up. It's a very specific hand movement and not in keeping with gesturing while talking.

https://youtu.be/Sfp_g-PGJ0w?t=139

[lleyki]

I actually completely missed Nick's "stay out of your head" comment to Vanessa when he was leaving. I find that very, very telling.

[mprssdbyu]

I actually completely missed Nick's "stay out of your head" comment to Vanessa when he was leaving. I find that very, very telling.

I did, too. I was already ahead thinking about the relationship N has established in the now with her family. It's so easy to spot which ITMS were done later by Vanessa and not in the moment during her HTD.

[Skates]

I want to know if Nick also does all these sweet little gestures he does with Vanessa with the other women. I've managed to build a high tolerance for Corrinne and I don't see it. I don't know about Rachel and Raven because I can't stomach watching either one.

I feel like Nick is more expressive with Vanessa...in most cases he is the one doing the first move on her...

...with Raven, she always initiates...but their kisses, I feel, don't have the passion we are expecting from lovers...

Corinne is kind of wild...she mostly does the first move, but Nick does entertain her advances...

Rachel and Nick's kissing is more traditional or conservative, but during her HTD, she has shown a little bit more aggressiveness than usual...but, I feel like Nick would have gradually disconnected after her HTD...I feel like although biracial issues are crucial...her family has dwelled too much into the topic...I don't think Nick has enjoyed it as much as the HTDs from the other 3 frontrunners...in my opinion, if Rachel is able to bring Nick home with her on him agreeing to come along, regardless of her skin colour, they should have trusted her gut feeling that this guy is definitely not racist or concerned about skin colours...there is really no need of dealing too much on the subject...this scenario has kind of pop up in my mind of a situation wherein a guy is biracial...would you ask the girlfriend on how comfortable she is knowing the mother is black...it is irrelevant...and, I don't think it should be taken in as a big deal...

Nick's kisses with Vanessa on screens are intimate, but delicate with passion...I think with Vanessa being a teacher, Nick is trying to preserve her image in public out of respect for her...but, I think that they can be wild behind the scenes...

On Vanessa's HTD, we haven't seen much of the happy atmosphere surrounding the family's get together... but, I think it has happened in real time... the questions and concerns have came in afterward...but, the issues that have been discussed are legitimate of which most long distance relationships would have encountered...after knowing how much they love each other, I don't think, it is much of a great deal...the scenario with Vanessa's father...with Vanessa knowing Nick has proposed to all fathers...I think would be a big concern to Vanessa knowing Nick as an impulsive guy...she needs to know how much Nick loves her...Nick may have given her a little bit of reassurances...but, until they are together... to be engaged/to be married...nothing is set in stone in this kind of environment...

[Skates]

@Skates, thank you for posting their date so I can obsessively watching it over and over. Okay, a little.

You're welcome... it's funny the first time I watched it....all Nick and Vanessa's concerns/problems just quickly flash right in front of my eyes....I am so disappointed with how the edits have been created...on my second briefing...I have ease up quite a bit... it is a good feeling to see all of these validations from Nick in context through his gestures and words... Lol!!...

[traveler90]

I want to know if Nick also does all these sweet little gestures he does with Vanessa with the other women. I've managed to build a high tolerance for Corrinne and I don't see it. I don't know about Rachel and Raven because I can't stomach watching either one.

I feel like Nick is more expressive with Vanessa...in most cases he is the one doing the first move on her...

...with Raven, she always initiates...but their kisses, I feel, don't have the passion we are expecting from lovers...

Corinne is kind of wild...she mostly does the first move, but Nick does entertain her advances...

Rachel and Nick's kissing is more traditional or conservative, but during her HTD, she has shown a little bit more aggressiveness than usual...but, I feel like Nick would have gradually disconnected after her HTD...I feel like although biracial issues are crucial...her family has dwelled too much into the topic...I don't think Nick has enjoyed it as much as the HTDs from the other 3 frontrunners...in my opinion, if Rachel is able to bring Nick home with her on him agreeing to come along, regardless of her skin colour, they should have trusted her gut feeling that this guy is definitely not racist or concerned about skin colours...there is really no need of dealing too much on the subject...this scenario has kind of pop up in my mind of a situation wherein a guy is biracial...would you ask the girlfriend on how comfortable she is knowing the mother is black...it is irrelevant...and, I don't think it should be taken in as a big deal...

Nick's kisses with Vanessa on screen are intimate, but delicate with passion...I think with Vanessa being a teacher, Nick is trying to preserve her image in public out of respect for her...but, I think that they can be wild behind the scenes...

On Vanessa's HTD, we haven't seen much of the happy atmosphere surrounding the family's get together... but, I think it has happened in real time... the questions and concerns have came in afterward...but, the issues that have been discussed are legitimate of which most long relationships would have encountered... after knowing how much they love each other, I don't think, it is much of a great deal...the scenario with Vanessa's father...with Vanessa knowing Nick has proposed to all fathers...I think would be a big concern to Vanessa knowing Nick as an impulsive guy...she needs to know how much Nick loves her...Nick may have given her a little bit of reassurances...but, until they are together...engaged to be married...nothing is set in stone in this kind of environment...

I agree with nearly everything you are saying besides one thing. I don't think Nick cares that Rachel is black or that her family wanted to discuss it.
Nick likes to hear different opinions and values them. I'm sure they talked about other stuff as well but the edit chose to show us the racial "issues".
Maybe production thinks that Rachel's cast should be aware of what such a relationship might imply and that those few guys who are serious about Rachel should consider that as well.
We also don't know if not of the producers asked her family if they think that Nick is ready to be in an interracial relaionship and that got them thinking. All JMO.

[happygolucky]

IMO the racial issues were TPTB produced, initiated, brought to attention, ... maybe already with a thought of Rachel being the potential Bette, so they tried to bring the focus on what is going to be "an issue" for some ... during her season.

Now back to Vanessa, since the Fan forum isn't open to discussion about other contestants.
IMO each HTD was sweet in their own way, but the level of comfort to just be of both, Vanessa and Nick, was really deep and undeniable ... especially the part of them alone at her school, the way they touched each other, communicated and how they delivered the lines ... it was like watching 2 talk without the cameras in their faces ... they weren't talking to "us", to please and make a show, they both talked like they would have every-day conversation about who is going to do the dishes ... almost "nothing special" kind of talk to them (but boy was he observant of her, because it was her home-ground and he was sensing it) ... it was because of that "nothing for the show talk" that IMO when they laughed at the absurdity and silliness of the moments they both laughed and looked towards the producers/handlers (whoever was present by the camera) ... am I making any sense?

[happygolucky]

Few "funny" things from HTD - video 4 above - they say goodbye to V's family, walk through the front door without their coats on, both with that "secret grin" of knowing they are "walking for the show" - IMO ... then we see them walking on the sidewalk in the dark with their coats on again ... or when they sit with her father and his partner ... and Vanessa starts to eat right away when she's supposed to talk (considering they had an Italian lunch with her mom's family that house visit was so late for her to be so "starved", or they both had "loosen up" with all the drinking - because they were the only ones eating that platter of food) ... and the way Nick is looking at her when she's talking, especially I adored the moment when Vanessa listed their traveling and her dad's partner said it sounded like vacation ... Nick was looking at Vanessa, smiled as if he knew better (and how tough it was for her or how she was dealing)

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