Raven Gates - Bachelor 21 - *Sleuthing Spoilers*

I just want to note that before things become facts that 1. A person who no longer is a part of this board is the person who referenced JoJo and the married man without giving any proof and then quickly left the board. There is proof, however, that JoJo dated someone all four years of college when she supposedly would have cheated with a married man. Her ex boyfriend was nothing but supportive of JoJo during Ben's season on his Facebook page. 2. I don't recall anyone ever 100% proving that the bed she posted the video with her dog was tied to Chad. They never lived together in the same place and we've never seen Chad's apartment or bedroom. 3. Just because Chad ran to a magazine and said he and JoJo got back together after Ben's season doesn't mean it's a fact. We have no proof that she did.

With all of that being said, I don't see how sharing information while sleuthing is the same as F2's being incredibly active on social media and selling team shirts. I don't like that if that's the case with Raven. Hopefully she has a good personality to offset the attention seeking. JMO

JoJo NEVER promoted herself during Ben's season. She never hashtagged [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] or faved tweets that said she should be the bachelorette. If anything was taken that way, it's someone's own perogotive IMO.

Oh btw, I skimmed through a life and style mag two days ago (not reliable, but wouldn't be surprised if this is true), and it said that a frontrunner emerges early this season. So, like with JoJo's season, since Robby also sold [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] shirts, both Robby and Raven probably already knew their fate during filming as the winner seemed obvious, and just enjoyed/are enjoying the ride post filming.

^ At least with the team Robby shirts the proceeds were supposedly going to some foundation that was connected to Robby's friend that passed away. Is Raven making a profit off of these? If so, I doubt she'll be making much

I was simply responding to the comment that said,

JoJo was talked about because of her brother being the lead of another dating show and her appearance on said show, and then because of her being the spoiled F2 and generally well-liked. It wasn't her own actions or self-promotion that caused all the discussion and she certainly wasn't selling team shirts.

which wasn't the case for all the reasons I mentioned, not saying they were true, my point is she was talked about a lot and not just because of her brothers, or that she was well liked.

Lennoxcolinrolland wrote:Oh btw, I skimmed through a life and style mag two days ago (not reliable, but wouldn't be surprised if this is true), and it said that a frontrunner emerges early this season. So, like with JoJo's season, since Robby also sold [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] shirts, both Robby and Raven probably already knew their fate during filming as the winner seemed obvious, and just enjoyed/are enjoying the ride post filming.

Which is what I just finished saying up thread, and [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]'s point. They will IMO milk their F2 position for all they can, and TPTB with or without encouragement, takes the focus off the real F1. I recall JoJo posting SM letter found in the mail box by someone that said they loved JoJo and Ben, or posting her and Ben at the Cub's field. I dont' think she would do those things on her own, it's all encouraged or done for them IMHO. When the rumours were swirling about Caila, IIRC we didn't hear much from JoJo, was that on purpose, I think so.

Raven isn't so heartbroken that she's already posting on SM just like Robby did. We'll probably see a lot more from Raven before Jan 2 and beyond.

I never said I listed all the reasons JoJo was talked about. My point was simply that the avid discussion had little to do with her SM behaviour. I'm sure the contestants are encouraged to post certain things on SM these days, since it's free promotion and gets people talking, but I don't think the team stuff and selling shirts is required. That's what sets the last two F2's apart and that's what some find obnoxious. Some posts during the airing of the show is of no concern to me at least since they all do it. JMO.

I'm looking forward to seeing Raven on the show. I think she's very pretty and she seems smart and funny and seems to be very well-liked by those who know her. I don't see a problem with her or any contestant/lead getting what they can from this crazy show. Goodness knows, they get plenty of flack for even going on the show; their every word, look, outfit, figure, and pimple are scrutinized by many. Yes, they chose to go on the show. I see them making a little profit or 15 minutes of fame (if either is their choice) as perfectly okay. I look at that is their "salary" for providing entertainment for me and many others. I don't see a big difference between starting their "campaign" a few weeks before bio release as a big deal. Probably most people who are seeing her shirts/posts already know she's on the show anyway.

Like Kasha, I see TPTB encouragment here also.

IA [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I think Raven is pretty. I think she'll get some good opportunities.

I agree about the f2's push from tptb to put themselves out there more, and think part of it is because tptb are adapting to f1 spoilers. If the f2 can become well-known / popular, then (in production's eyes) it helps keep competition alive, and brings people in to watch the whole season.

Also, even if the general audience (not members here since we are clued into the details) have an inkling of who is supposedly f1, there's still some doubt, so tptb fans those flames and capitalizes on the sm publicity. jmo.

I don't have problem with contestants taking advantage of their 15 minutes, I just hope they, well, TeamRaven to be specific, can be patient and wait till the official announcement. I want to give Raven & Co the benefit of doubt and am willing to think they are just happy and excited for her. However, compared to the other spoiled finalists, Vanessa who hasn't post anything and Rachel who seems just to go about her life, Raven comes across a bit desperate and attention seeking, IMO.

Yeah...they all love the attention, but I fail to see how jojo, nick, or becca did anything as obnoxious and desperate as IG pictures of themselves with the hashtag [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and sell merchandise with the same. Nick himself made fun of people that do that, so I don't think it's accurate to say that this is normal behavior for all F2s. IMO.

I don't have a problem with contestants use of SM to promote themselves ( I do   though and find it off putting ) as long as they don't give away the ending without realizing. I like knowing spoilers but I also enjoy a mystery and thinking the spoiler might be wrong and sleuthing till the end. Had I remained unspoiled this season, I would have still guessed she is not F1 based on her SC last night with some guy friend with heart emojis. No newly engaged woman would post that IMO knowing her SM will be looked at by her fiance's family/friends along with other sleuthers/followers. Instead of casting doubts, she validated the spoiler IMO.

For me, it's like watching a movie and guessing the end. I would not appreciate the actors giving away the ending a month in advance even though there are rumors of how it ends.

At this rate, I am just glad [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] T-shirts aren't out yet.

All JMO.